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Thread: A New Earth?

  1. #21
    Boolit Master
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    "Of old you laid the foundation of the earth,
    and the heavens are the work of your hands.
    They will perish, but you will remain;
    they will all wear out like a garment.
    You will change them like a robe, and they will pass away,
    but you are the same, and your years have no end."

    Psalm 102:25-27 (E.S.V.)

    exile
    "There is not a single instance in history in which civil liberty was lost, and religious liberty preserved entire. If therefore we yield up our temporal property, we at the same time deliver the conscience into bondage." --John Witherspoon, The Dominion of Providence Over the Passions of Men. 1776

    "The words of the Lord are pure words, like silver refined in a furnace on the ground, purified seven times." Psalm 12:6 (E.S.V.)

  2. #22
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    And……..will there be lead there?

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    Here's my input:

    The description of the New Earth is highly symbolic, just like the descriptions of Hell. We are not meant to take these things literally. The main idea of the New Earth is that God will make his home with man and evil will be removed.
    You might want to read or re-read Revelations because a "New Heaven and New Earth" is not as you say "symbolic". There are very precise descriptions in Revelations of both.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatmedic63 View Post
    You might want to read or re-read Revelations because a "New Heaven and New Earth" is not as you say "symbolic". There are very precise descriptions in Revelations of both.
    I stand by my statement. Revelations in whole uses symbols to express its message. This holds true in the descriptions of the New Heaven and New Earth. If you take things in the Bible that are symbolic and interpret them as literal and absolute you will get the wrong message and bring about disappointment.

    The First Century Church would have never understood the descriptions in Revelations to be literal. The original audience also would not have seen "Revelations" as being as mysterious as today's audience does. Mainly because they would not have tried to put a concrete meaning on every little detail in the text. They would have looked at the whole seeing the overall message...which is pretty apparent. After all, the book is named Revelations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by exile View Post
    Will there be a new earth?

    Is this new earth described in the Bible?

    If a new earth is coming, who will live there?

    How should the possibility of a new earth effect our response to problems like global warming?

    If there is to be a new earth, will it last forever, or will it perish like the old one?

    What do you think?

    exile
    Maybe the new earth will have a new Firmament?
    Maybe it will be much like it was before Flesh man was created, when all spiritual beings lived there, because we will all be in spiritual bodies (I assume) during the time of this "new earth described in the Bible"
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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    ― The Dalai Lama, Seattle Times, May 2001

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    I stand by my statement. Revelations in whole uses symbols to express its message. This holds true in the descriptions of the New Heaven and New Earth. If you take things in the Bible that are symbolic and interpret them as literal and absolute you will get the wrong message and bring about disappointment.

    The First Century Church would have never understood the descriptions in Revelations to be literal. The original audience also would not have seen "Revelations" as being as mysterious as today's audience does. Mainly because they would not have tried to put a concrete meaning on every little detail in the text. They would have looked at the whole seeing the overall message...which is pretty apparent. After all, the book is named Revelations.
    “I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband” (Revelation 21:2).

    “It shone with the glory of God, and its brilliance was like that of a very precious jewel, like a jasper, clear as crystal. It had a great, high wall with twelve gates, and with twelve angels at the gates. On the gates were written the names of the twelve tribes of Israel. There were three gates on the east, three on the north, three on the south and three on the west. The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb” (Revelation 21:11-14).

    “The wall was made of jasper, and the city of pure gold, as pure as glass. The foundations of the city walls were decorated with every kind of precious stone. The first foundation was jasper, the second sapphire, the third agate, the fourth emerald, the fifth onyx, the sixth ruby, the seventh chrysolite, the eighth beryl, the ninth topaz, the tenth turquoise, the eleventh jacinth, and the twelfth amethyst. The twelve gates were twelve pearls, each gate made of a single pearl. The great street of the city was of gold, as pure as transparent glass” (Revelation 21:18-21).

    “I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. The city does not need the sun or the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and the Lamb is its lamp” (Revelation 21:22-23).

    “Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life” (Revelation 21:27).


    Seems pretty descriptive to me. We all believe what we want to believe but this is to precise for me to ignore as "Symbolic".

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatmedic63 View Post
    “I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband” (Revelation 21:2).

    “It shone with the glory of God, and its brilliance was like that of a very precious jewel, like a jasper, clear as crystal. It had a great, high wall with twelve gates, and with twelve angels at the gates. On the gates were written the names of the twelve tribes of Israel. There were three gates on the east, three on the north, three on the south and three on the west. The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb” (Revelation 21:11-14).

    “The wall was made of jasper, and the city of pure gold, as pure as glass. The foundations of the city walls were decorated with every kind of precious stone. The first foundation was jasper, the second sapphire, the third agate, the fourth emerald, the fifth onyx, the sixth ruby, the seventh chrysolite, the eighth beryl, the ninth topaz, the tenth turquoise, the eleventh jacinth, and the twelfth amethyst. The twelve gates were twelve pearls, each gate made of a single pearl. The great street of the city was of gold, as pure as transparent glass” (Revelation 21:18-21).

    “I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. The city does not need the sun or the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and the Lamb is its lamp” (Revelation 21:22-23).

    “Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life” (Revelation 21:27).


    Seems pretty descriptive to me. We all believe what we want to believe but this is to precise for me to ignore as "Symbolic".
    You seriously don't see the symbolism in the passages you listed?

    Do you think New Jerusalem is literally going to be dressed like a bride? Do you think Jesus became an actual lamb? How can the Father and Son become a physical temple and take the place of the sun for providing light for the city? If the city were made of all the items listed it would be structurally unsafe and the roads would wear out very quickly. I won't even ask if you think God has actual books that he uses to keep track of things.

    What you have in those passages are symbols used to convey a message. They are "precise and descriptive" symbols that are not meant to be taken literally.

    Many Christians would do well to take a class in basic Bible interpretation or read a good scholarly book on the topic. From what I have seen, many pastors need this as well.
    Last edited by Ickisrulz; 01-04-2022 at 06:37 PM.

  8. #28
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    If the city were made of all the items listed it would be structurally unsafe and the roads would wear out very quickly. I won't even ask if you think God has actual books that he uses to keep track of things.

    Are you really serious? We are talking about God, the Alpha and Omega, the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth. Do you really think that "structural things" or roads wearing out would hinder Him. Really ??? Look around you at nature and all the wonders of the Earth and you are thinking about God being hindered in any way. Oh, and no I don't believe He uses books to keep track of things because he is the Almighty, not a human that needs to remember things by writing them down. The only book that I do believe in is the "Lambs Book of Life" because the Bible says it is real.

    I guess you won't know for sure until the Rapture happens.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatmedic63 View Post
    If the city were made of all the items listed it would be structurally unsafe and the roads would wear out very quickly. I won't even ask if you think God has actual books that he uses to keep track of things.

    Are you really serious? We are talking about God, the Alpha and Omega, the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth. Do you really think that "structural things" or roads wearing out would hinder Him. Really ??? Look around you at nature and all the wonders of the Earth and you are thinking about God being hindered in any way. Oh, and no I don't believe He uses books to keep track of things because he is the Almighty, not a human that needs to remember things by writing them down. The only book that I do believe in is the "Lambs Book of Life" because the Bible says it is real.

    I guess you won't know for sure until the Rapture happens.
    I would think that God in his omniscience would know that building a road, a city or a wall from pure gold would be a bad idea and I don't think he'd do it. Then again, I know that the symbolism in Revelations is to show the value of God living among man, not the ability of God to by-pass the limits of the physical world he created. It is important to identify the actual message the Bible is conveying.

    (It is interesting to note that the record of God operating outside the physical laws of the universe when dealing with man are few and far between in the Bible.)

    I noticed that you did not comment on the other obvious symbolism I pointed out. Are you starting to see my point?
    Last edited by Ickisrulz; 01-04-2022 at 07:53 PM.

  10. #30
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    No one has answered smithnframe's question? Personally, I feel, given the list of minerals mentioned in Revelation 21:18-21, that lead will be present, and that no smelting or fluxing will be required. But, hey, that's just me talking!

    My question is, will there be any pre-1964 Winchester model 70's in the New Jerusalem?

    exile
    "There is not a single instance in history in which civil liberty was lost, and religious liberty preserved entire. If therefore we yield up our temporal property, we at the same time deliver the conscience into bondage." --John Witherspoon, The Dominion of Providence Over the Passions of Men. 1776

    "The words of the Lord are pure words, like silver refined in a furnace on the ground, purified seven times." Psalm 12:6 (E.S.V.)

  11. #31
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    wouldn't the New Jerusalem need a New Winchester model 70 ?
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.”
    ― The Dalai Lama, Seattle Times, May 2001

  12. #32
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    I would like to point out, it's Revelation, NOT revelations. There was only one Revelation, the sacrifice of the Son of Man and his redemption and reconciliation of man to God the father!

  13. #33
    Boolit Grand Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Yes to a "new Earth". Besides, we'll be rid of these meat suits so anything would be a very different experience.

  14. #34
    Boolit Grand Master
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    I do not know and do not care. It will be what it will be. His way will be done.

    What any man or I think or want to believe is immaterial.

    What I care about is what God wants me to do to serve Him. At 71, I am still not sure about that. I believe that is a good thing....as my work is not done.
    Don Verna


  15. #35
    Boolit Grand Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Matters to me. The previous world, this one, the world to come.
    That's part of what I'm to understand; what I am and why I'm here.

  16. #36
    Boolit Grand Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    I do not know and do not care. It will be what it will be. His way will be done.

    What any man or I think or want to believe is immaterial.

    What I care about is what God wants me to do to serve Him. At 71, I am still not sure about that. I believe that is a good thing....as my work is not done.
    Good point Don.
    We moved a thousand miles north in faith because of being shown to. And, we think we are here to accomplish work that is not yet done.

  17. #37
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    how many have died in wars fought over religious beliefs. because we are in a free country we each have a right to our own beliefs. one persons interpretation of the version of the written bible that they believe in may be very different than someone else interpretation. the best I can do is to respect what someone else might believe and leave the preaching up to the preachers.

  18. #38
    Boolit Grand Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Farmbif,
    I'd reference you to the maxim that all wars are bankers' wars.
    That doesn't mean the individual trooper doesn't get sucked into it because the propagandists were successful in convincing him it was for a god. Governments always do that one way or the other, even if they are communists!

  19. #39
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    I think you'll find communism has been a bigger killer in just the 20th century than all the religious wars from antiquity. Further, most religious wars are a cause of convenience.... the rulers of the moment use whatever means available to stir up the masses....in some cases, it just happens to be religious dogma.
    Chicken Little has finally found an audience

  20. #40
    Boolit Grand Master Good Cheer's Avatar
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    Heh, at that time when global government is almost together, what are the party faithful going to think when the devil is out in the open and claiming to be god? What a terrible time to realize they were conned.

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