Things we will absolutely need should SHTF

[jdfoxinc]

T P is a right!

[farmbif]

might need a little shovel to make cat hole for the used TP

[Slim Chance Pistolero]

just read the 5 pages of this thread .. here is some of my thoughts .. i live in a 250 yr old stone farmhouse .. natural never dry (last 35 yrs) spring house .. dead end road backed by no easy access forest .. around Y2K tinned out guns to only a few necessary calibers and reload for them ...enough ammo to hold off hoards of looters before i need to get into my home cast and PC supplies ... home canned food for yrs .. home garden with protection from my "front yard" deer heard of 8 ... lots of tasty squirrels ... remote from the everyday wonderer ... like minded and armed neighbors ... at the age of 73 yrs seems like i can out live many and life in prison just sounds like a much needed vacation ... long term anything using batteries seems, to me, a waste of resources

[dverna]

just read the 5 pages of this thread .. here is some of my thoughts .. i live in a 250 yr old stone farmhouse .. natural never dry (last 35 yrs) spring house .. dead end road backed by no easy access forest .. around Y2K tinned out guns to only a few necessary calibers and reload for them ...enough ammo to hold off hoards of looters before i need to get into my home cast and PC supplies ... home canned food for yrs .. home garden with protection from my "front yard" deer heard of 8 ... lots of tasty squirrels ... remote from the everyday wonderer ... like minded and armed neighbors ... at the age of 73 yrs seems like i can out live many and life in prison just sounds like a much needed vacation ... long term anything using batteries seems, to me, a waste of resources

The most important thing to have is a leader.

The second is like minded armed neighbors. A family group will not make it long. I have pondered what is the minimum size needed and cannot come up with a good number. So much depends on the distance between neighbors and terrain.

The third most important thing is a way to communicate so the group can respond to a threat.

All the resources we have will only make us targets if we are not organized to defend them.

[Don Purcell]

They are pricey but if possible a Harvest Right freez drier can be extremely valuable. I can hear the wailing already, "You wouldn't have enough money left over to buy your food to freeze, you wouldn't this, you wouldn't that, yeah blah, blah, blah. Also keeping a gray man way of life. A couple years ago I bought a couple bags of beans and rice and the checkout girl got nosey and asked me what I was doing with all that. I gritted my teeth at her noseyness, smiled and said our family was finally having our postponed reunion because of the recent nationwide medical event and that killed her interest. I mentioned what happened to a friend of mine and he bristled up and said "I would have told her it was none of her damned business". I just shook my head and told him who do you think she is going to remember most, the guy who was friendly and moved on, or the arrogant jerk who messed with her long day standing at the cash register. Low key is important

[Soundguy]

The bug going around got me thinking about basic necessities, and even though I always have, always had years worth of non-perishable food on hand, I bought a hand-crank flour mill and a hand-crank oil press. My line of thinking was that cooking without oil and baking without flour are simply impossible. The mill is already here, and I have tested it. Works wonders on everything but rice (due to its extremely hard grains it is hard to mill and has to be milled thrice). Now my wife's cookies and pancakes are better then ever.

Next on my list is a balance weight scale, for reloading, past the point where batteries could be obtained.

I can melt lead in a cooking pot.

The last concern is tumbling. What does everyone expect to use for tumbling, should no electric power be available? Or is it Okay to reload w/o tumbling the cases? My impression is that using a dirty, sooty case results in more heat transferred to the barrel. Any other disadvantages from that?

As others said.. wipe and go. Besides.. if you use something like a revolver.. shells never hit the ground.. something to think about..

[Andy45]

The most important thing one can do is vote for people who are less likely to create or allow a SHTF situation. Research and make good choices in the primary elections!

Learn from history. Electing extremists on either end of the political spectrum is more likely to result anarchy and apocalypses. Choose folks who unite us over those who would divide us. Divisive low brow populism is basically just shallow manipulation.

A deeply divided country is a dangerous and unstable situation. If one has any understanding about asymmetric warfare, one knows one can never successfully suppress political or dogmatic opposition without destroying democracy!

Choose and practice tolerance over intolerance. Actually be a 24/7 practicing Christian or other person of faith and tolerance and not just a poser.

[Don Purcell]

The most important thing one can do is vote for people who are less likely to create or allow a SHTF situation. Research and make good choices in the primary elections!

Learn from history. Electing extremists on either end of the political spectrum is more likely to result anarchy and apocalypses. Choose folks who unite us over those who would divide us. Divisive low brow populism is basically just shallow manipulation.

A deeply divided country is a dangerous and unstable situation. If one has any understanding about asymmetric warfare, one knows one can never successfully suppress political or dogmatic opposition without destroying democracy!

Choose and practice tolerance over intolerance. Actually be a 24/7 practicing Christian or other person of faith and tolerance and not just a poser.

You may be a little late with your suggestion however kindhearted it is and I agree with you but the fuse of the rocket sled to hard times is already lit. Prepare accordingly.

[truckjohn]

I agree with others. This thread is pretty funny. A tumbler for brass? Really? An oil press? Yeah, nope.

Talk with some people who lived through the Balkan war or read the accounts of people surviving through Stalin's purges and The Gulags. A tight knit extended family is #1. Alcohol is #2. It can be drunk, used as a base for medicine, fuel, an antiseptic, etc. #3 is lighters/matches/portable fire starter. #4 is preserved food. #5 is shelf stable medicine. Everything else is down the list.

The #1 thing you can do to prepare for SHTF is to read the tea leaves and be ready to leave and restart your whole life well in advance. The most heart breaking real life stories (to me) from The Balkan War were the families who LEFT when the tanks rolled in, then had to return to an active war zone 2-3 months later because they ran out of money and had nowhere else to go. In many cases, they didn't speak foreign languages required for employment in other places or had careers that simply were not in demand when ten-million other people flooded in with them.

Perhaps look at the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina. The folks who had family in other places often lived with them with while they restarted their lives. Most of them never went back. People who had nowhere else to go often ended up getting forced to return a few months later - and they had a much harder go of it.

[GhostHawk]

I still like investing in things that are hard for me to make myself, or are incredibly time consuming. Cordage being #1, duct tape, glues/epoxy's. Water filtration, Bleach tablets have a much longer shelf life than liquid bleach. Very useful for water purification.

TruckJohn's #1 family/community is hard in my particular situation. I have family in town but they don't want to listen. So until the SHTF they won't come around, maybe not then.

Pretty hard up here in the North Country to build any kind of a livable shelter and fuel supply for winter single handed. While doing that how are you going to plant and maintain a garden? And who is going to watch over you and your stuff while you sleep? One of the options is instead of firewood to burn corn. But corn needs extra combustion air to burn right. But if setup correctly it will produce a lot of heat off 1-2 acres of field corn.

One man alone is a target. And actually an easy target.

[dverna]

I still like investing in things that are hard for me to make myself, or are incredibly time consuming. Cordage being #1, duct tape, glues/epoxy's. Water filtration, Bleach tablets have a much longer shelf life than liquid bleach. Very useful for water purification.

TruckJohn's #1 family/community is hard in my particular situation. I have family in town but they don't want to listen. So until the SHTF they won't come around, maybe not then.

Pretty hard up here in the North Country to build any kind of a livable shelter and fuel supply for winter single handed. While doing that how are you going to plant and maintain a garden? And who is going to watch over you and your stuff while you sleep? One of the options is instead of firewood to burn corn. But corn needs extra combustion air to burn right. But if setup correctly it will produce a lot of heat off 1-2 acres of field corn.

One man alone is a target. And actually an easy target.

My friend, your family will be there once the SHTF. They have nowhere to go and know you have "stuff". The tough part will be dealing with them.

I have put away enough "stuff" to take care of my sons for a few months but no one else.

You will need some of your family there. One old man (like we are) will not survive a real SHTF event for a month.

I moved to rural MI 10 years ago and have developed a network of locals who have a very good chance of surviving for a while. I had something they wanted (hunting access through my property to state land) and I granted that to them early on. From there, the relationships grew. It helped that they knew I was a competitive shooter and could reload and cast. I also did minor gunsmithing and got some of their guns working. Mounted and gave a scope to one of the less fortunate locals. Skills they lacked. They talk about me becoming the "ammo plant" when things get bad.

I go to the Volunteer Fire Dept annual chile cookoff. Give to the fund raisers. Attend the local church and help when I can. They need to get to know you.

If the SHTF the "Group" will end up being about 50-75 people. Many garden and raise livestock so I will not need to worry about that.

[truckjohn]

One man alone is a target. And actually an easy target.

That is the #1 thing I kept hearing from folks who were forced to live through big hairy catastrophes. The lone wolf is an easy target.

I think the other thing to remember is that while SHTF on a national level is extremely unlikely, it happens all the time on a local level. I've been through half a dozen hurricanes and a couple big floods, and an economic collapse. I've seen whole communities roll up and die. Hurricane Katrina level events happen every single year in the US.

Do you have some place else to go when the big one hits your area? Can you leave material possessions behind and start fresh, or are you determined to be the guy huddled on your roof with a shotgun in your hand while the water floods in through the windows.

Or... Can you take in family/friends who are forced to leave some big nasty mess behind?

The place to be when the next Katrina hits isn't there, guarding your wrecked stuff with a gun. You would really rather be some place else where you can just watch the catastrophe on the news.

But to each his own.

[Chena]

If SHTF means surviving while the current cycle of global civilization ends I believe it will absolutely require youth, health, exceptional luck and a state of mind I can best describe as cheerful, resolute fatalism. Everything else is situational. Having passed retirement age, my hope is to provide aid to family before my number comes up.

[BadgerShooter]

In the movie "Zombieland", one character had a list of rules to survive. Rule #1 is Cardio! If you huff and puff on the stairs or walking to the mailbox, a FAL, Mags, Body Armor, Etc aren't going to do you a bit of good. Those things are tools, you are the weapon and if you are not in the best condition you can be, you will be behind the curve. Being in the best condition you can be is way different for everybody, but you need to be doing things to be better. That may mean being handier and faster in your wheelchair or it might mean running, rucking, shooting and working out every week. If you can't help yourself, you can't help the people important to you. Figure out what you can do and then try to do it just a little bit better. That leads to the "Cheerful, Resolute Fatalism" Chena refers to.

[MrWolf]

Problem is a lot of folks are getting old and/or disabled (like me). We are kinda secluded and not many know a house is where we are. In the mountains, flooding is not an issue and trees are plentiful. Worried about wood smoke and such? There are two of us. Our kids from prior marriages live in other states and are two to five hours away. We are not going anywhere. We have a good supply of frozen meat, a whole house generator with a dedicated 500 gal propane tank. Sounds great but if it gets bad enough that we have to worry about roving bands of killers, we won't make it. Kids if smart would make this a compound but who knows. I know we wouldn't last to long (medications) so... If somebody is dump enough to try and take from us, we will defend. Not much more we can realistically do and honestly not that worried anymore. Life I to short as is. For you younger non disabled like our kids, I would do prep but be realistic. Prep on things that are usable. Doubt you would need a personal nuclear reactor, even though that would be kewl, just not realistic.
Ron

[gishooter]

"Prep but be realistic"
Agree 100%. Having supplies of all types, along with the tools and knowledge, makes perfect sense. And enough manpower and location to defend it all.

And would probably be sufficient for most short term events that only affect part of a state or small region of the Republic.

But what about sometime that goes for multiple months or more? Or hits the entire country at once?

Majority of the population will starve to death in any significant emergency that affects a large portion of the country.

Very few people in US grow food. Most farmers specialize in only a few different crops (ie. milk, beef, corn & soybeans etc). Without supplies of diesel or even electricity, farm production essentially stops.
Or lack of fertilizers, herbicides, or pesticides will drastically reduce production in any given crop cycle.

During winter months a whole lot of food is imported. Look where your fruit and veggies are imported from during the cold months. Interrupt transport by freighter, rail, or truck and people will get real hungry real fast.

Regardless of the quantity of stored food you have, it will eventually run out. And if the emergency lasts longer than your supplies?

Better be practicing growing food now. Along with the seeds and tools. It is what I do. I'm in my 50's and work my ass off to just have a basic garden and raise a flock of chickens. I also used to trap. So can stretch out the stored food a bit.

Realistically cannot make it long without a small farming community that grow all types of food & livestock.

Census data on farmers:
https://www.nass.usda.gov/Publicatio...ghts/index.php

https://usafacts.org/articles/farmer-demographics/

[GregLaROCHE]

If you have the spring build yourself a spring house. Otherwise, dig a root cellar. Besides keeping things cool, it will also keep them from freezing.

[MUSTANG]

Think "Pioneer Settlers" post US War between the States.

More food than one thinks for the 1st year.
Seeds to grow a garden.
Fencing and pest control to keep the Critters from eating your 2nd year food stuffs.
This aint Kansas and Dorothy in Oz - variety may be limited.
Grow what you got and keep seed back for third year Planting as every year something will not make it in the garden.
Ever on the Watch - Just as after the US War between the States; there will be roving nare-do-wells to guard against.
Reestablish ties with Neighbors for mutual defense, community watch, and resource/skill trading.
My first deployment on board ship an old Marine Gunnery Sgt told me - If you didn't bring it; you won't have it.
THIEVERY CAN NOT BE TOLERATED. That was one of the 1st admonishments from the Marine Drill Instructors to the new recruits when I hit boot camp many decades ago; and it has a lot of wisdom across the world today and in a Post Collapse Event.

[gishooter]

"Prep but be realistic". Part II
Yes, got to be able to survive off your stored stuff until you have a HARVEST! Practice growing now. And saving seeds. Seeds and food isn't a one time buy a package and just put it in the ground. And suddenly you have all the food you need.
I use this method:

https://squarefootgardening.org

Saving seed: https://www.seedsavers.org/heirloom-seeds

I usually buy my seeds from victory gardens website. But have bought from other places as well. Believe it or not the local small town hardware store carries a lot of seed for stuff that grows well in my AO.

Water: I have food grade 55 gallon NSP rated 55 gallon plastic barrels. Consensus is 1 gallon of water per person per day for drinking and cooking. I used to use unscented regular bleach to sanitize water (not the low splash because it has surfactant chemicals added). Switched to using calcium hypochlorite.
This site has the best instructions I've found. I even printed them out, laminated, and taped to a barrel. Have another hard copy with the calcium hypochlorite.
https://theprovidentprepper.org/disi...-hypochlorite/

My only concern is my well. The water table is fairly deep. And without electricity I'm not going to be able to pump water. I do have a diesel generator that easily powers everything. I have enough diesel to run it as needed to keep water pressure up and freezers going for a month or so. But long term I need to find something that will pull from a deep well.

[poppy42]

The bug going around got me thinking about basic necessities, and even though I always have, always had years worth of non-perishable food on hand, I bought a hand-crank flour mill and a hand-crank oil press. My line of thinking was that cooking without oil and baking without flour are simply impossible. The mill is already here, and I have tested it. Works wonders on everything but rice (due to its extremely hard grains it is hard to mill and has to be milled thrice). Now my wife's cookies and pancakes are better then ever.

Next on my list is a balance weight scale, for reloading, past the point where batteries could be obtained.

I can melt lead in a cooking pot.

The last concern is tumbling. What does everyone expect to use for tumbling, should no electric power be available? Or is it Okay to reload w/o tumbling the cases? My impression is that using a dirty, sooty case results in more heat transferred to the barrel. Any other disadvantages from that?

Forget the scale get/make some dippers! They take up less room and less chance of breakage