Loaded some soupcan (Lee 309-113f) in my 30-30 with 16gr 2400. Made from AC ww+1% tin sized .308. From my 94Win at 25yds off hand only got a 3" group. All the rounds chambered hard the last fraction of an inch. I know I'm kinda shakey but not that bad. Anyone else use this in 30-30?
Will
..............Odd, must be something going on somewhere? My old Lee 2 cav mould drops this slug rigth at .314" and it has been a delight to use in various Argentines, Russians, and a Krag but sized to .310". I don't currently have a 30-30 but I did have a Handi-Rifle of that flavor but it didn't do much with anything I tried so I don't have it anymore
One of my old shooting buddies, who has since moved to Prescott, AZ pounced on me one Tuesday as I appeared at the range. He was waving a couple targets. He explained they were the Lee Soupcans shot from his 94 Win 30-30, which had a Leupold VXII 3-9 on it. Each target showed a group of 5 shots that were maybe 1-1/4" and the other a bit smaller. He said they'd chronographed just over 2100 fps.
I naturally said that that had been some fine shooting and what was it, 50 yards? He said nope, both were shot at 100 yards. You could have pushed me over with a featherHe said he had another 10 rounds to shoot and after we shot our match (Burrito Invitational) he'd shoot them to see if he could repeat the previous 2 groups. He did and they did. I suspect if you overlaid all 4 targets, those 20 rounds might have gone a scant 2" total.
He was using H4198 and IIRC it was like 23.0 grs or so. I don't recall now if he used dacron with them or not, nor do I recall him mentioning any special reloading proceedures, like scaling the slugs, etc. My favorite load in a 1903A1 Springfield I have is 23.0grs H4198 + dacron under the Ly 311284 which is good for 1620 fps and very accurate. I decided to use the same load under the little Lee next rangeday.
I loaded 20 rounds using visually inspected slugs lubed with Javalina over thrown charges of powder + dacron. At 50 yards two 5 rounds groups put 4 into well less then an inch but each had a leaker. At 100 yards the last two 5 round groups ran about 2" each for all 5.
LEFTGroup fired at Winnemucca, NV. Very first 'For Effect' group fired with new rifle (M1917 Enfield). Load 23.0grs H4198 + Dacron, Lee C309-113F. Fired at 50 yards, 1.050".RIGHT 8.0grs of Red Dot, Lee C309-113F. 1903 Sporter Springfield. Iron sights, 50 yards. This Red Dot load was what I used for ground squirrels around the place when we lived in the sticks. Report about like a 22 so it didn't spook the horses, or cause the old lady down the canyon to call the house
Accuracy has normally been pretty good for users. Good enough to have caused 3 GB's over the years in 6 cavity moulds!
..................Buckshot
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I really like the soupcan. It is one of my favorite molds. Wish mine was like Buckshots and dropped at .314. Mine is right around .310, which is pretty handy in all of my American .30's. I'm a big fan of this bullet with a light charge of red-dot. I've found it to be a superbly accurate boolit at 50 yards, but never got a GREAT load at 100 in the '06.
I've loaded quite a few backwards (no gas check) and its a pretty hard hitter like that! I've shot a few yotes and a few yotes that way, and they go down pretty hard.
I've modified one of the cavities so it no longer requires a GC. Been trying to get a good load that cycles 100% in the m1 carbine, but not very successful yet.
Lee really hit a home run with this boolit. I really need to get a soupcan 6 banger, maybe thats what I'll ask for christmas from the wife.
..............Lee doesn't offer the design in the 6 cav blocks. That's why we had to do the GB's.Originally Posted by kir_kenix
................Buckshot
Father Grand Caster watches over you my brother. Go now and pour yourself a hot one. May the Sacred Silver Stream be with you always
Proud former Shooters.Com Cast Bullet alumnus and plank owner.
"The Republic can survive a Barack Obama, who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools such as those who made him their president."
Shrink the State End the Fed Balance the budget Make a profit Leave an inheritance
A 3" offhand group at 25 yards is about right for most shooters, especially this one.
The soup can works great in both of my Model 94 Winchesters, and it would shoot one ragged hole groups in my 30 carbine BH pistol before some dirty (*^&$#@@ low-life *&^%%$#@ stole it.
Any ideas on why my action would be so hard to completely close with this load?
Will
Had that problem once. Turned out I wasn't sizing the neck back down small enough after belling it and crimping the bullet, there was a little wrinkle still there. Also had this happen on .45 ACP loads where I was too cautious in crimping. A taper crimp die solved that problem.
Ahhh, I'll have to keep a lookout for the GB, or else try and snag one up on the "swappin & sellin" part of the forum. Thanks..............Lee doesn't offer the design in the 6 cav blocks. That's why we had to do the GB's.
They are good so far in my Marlin 336 over 20 gr of IMR 4198 chrono at 1950. I need to vary the charges for accuracy. I whacked my 12" plate at 175 yards this morning with one. It was shooting 2" high at 50 so I put the crosshair at the top of the plate and BANG......................................clang... .........flop.
Now I have to decide whether to shoot them through the unfired 1972 Win 94 that we bought this morning.
A co-worker bought it from a widow whose husband died before getting to hunt with it. The wood is slightly banged up from moving around and being stored in a cabinet. The metal is nearly flawless. Couldn't let it get away for $250
They are also the only boolit that goes through the target nose-first from my cut-down SMLE. I am shooting soupcans, 309-150-Rf sized and the 312-155-2R (7.62x39) over 20 gr of IMR 4198. At 50 yards with a peep sight, the soupcans shoot into about 3". The other two shoot 6" groups but all are profile holes in the target and backer.....back to the drawing board.
Will, the Soupcan has a generous front band and most .30-30's have short throats. I presume you're loading it with the front band out of the case.
It's very possible the bullet is engraving a little bit before the lever is completely closed. That would account for the little extra effort shoving it home.
I've had good luck with this bullet using mild charges of fast powders to get around 1500 fps. W231 works well for this. In the '06 and .308 also. Makes a good small game load.
35 Remington, do you have trouble with the necks sooting up on your 308 with those loads?
No, I do not. The fast shotgun powders burn very clean. I found that more moderate charges of around 8-9 grains of these powders - 700X, Red Dot, W231, etc. in the .308 and .30-06 cases gave me exactly the velocities I wanted of 1450-1550 fps. Cut that back two or three grains for the .30-30 case.
Light charges of slower powders will give some sooting but not the fast burners. When I increased the charge of fast burning powder much over these levels accuracy fell off, and was definitely worse when 18-1900 fps was approached.
These loads approximate a .32-20 factory load or mild .32-20 handload and work on everything smaller than deer pretty darn well.
35Remington:
You are right about the front band engraving. I chambered a round and extracted in and I can just make out a slight (0.01) engraving on the front band.
Thanks
Will
Not knowing what a Soupcan was I just realized that I own one. I purchased it to use on a 32-20 Contender which had a .308 barrel. I guess that I never thought of using it in anything else. I might have to try it in my 03 or my K31 with Buckshot's 8 gr. load of Red Dot.
Skeet1
Thanks for that input! I'll try going faster than Unique with the powder. With Unique, by the time the cases seal in the chamber, the velocity is higher than I want.
I took this boolit ot the range today so I figured I throw my experiences in, too.
I tried 15.0, 17.0, 18.5, and 20.0 gr of 2400 in the Savage 24F .30-30. 50 yards from the bench I got 2"- 5 shot groups with one set each of the 15, 17, and 18.5 load. I got one 1" group with the other 17.0 gr set. And got patterns with the remaining four sets. Mine were sized to .311, lubed with homemade SAECO green, and seated just deep enough to cover the lube grooves.
I also tried a few Lee 309-170F's These were 24.0 (1 1/2" group)and 26.0 gr (2 1/4" group)of surplus IMR4895, CCI-200s, sized to .311 with SAECO green. TONS of unburned and partially burned powder grains left in the barrel. (Actually, I guess it wasn't "tons"- but they were definitely the dirtiest smokeless loads I've ever fired. And I've reloaded for almost thirty years and used IMR4895 for most of that time).
I'm glad there's some left-over 4198 in the powder cabinet! Back to the bench and then to the range!
John
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