Cast and the .308 Win

[charlie b]

Short story. I have a Savage model 12BVSS in .308 Originally I had thought about just shooting long range with jacketed and have put a bit more than 1000rounds through it. But, I have decided to get back to casting and use lead bullets in this one. Problem is which one? I had a bunch of 165gn plain base bullets from when I had a .30-30 so I loaded them up with some gallery loads using Blue Dot. Very promising results with many 5 round groups in the 1 1/2" range. 8grains seems to be kind of a sweet spot for 100yd shooting.

But, what to do about longer ranges? So I went to the cast bullet competition results. Narrowed it down to the RCBS 165SIL and the Lyman 311299. Turns out one of the production class shooters uses a 12BVSS and the 165SIL bullet!!

I did not want to buy both right now so instead I went to Montana Bullet Works. Purchased 100 of each and loaded some up. I am starting with IMR4198. Targets show the results. Really nice that my first loads shoot so well.

I highly recommend Montana Bullet Works if you want to try out a new bullet, or just buy instead of cast. They have a pretty good selection to choose from.




PS I will post more as I do some more experimenting

[robg]

Your rifle doesn't know that lead won't shoot accurately. If I'm on form my 116 will shoot into an inch at 100 yards ,big if .my wife laminated my best group 4 in under an inch in the bull .

[Winger Ed.]

Impressive.

Looks like either one would be fine.

If you're shooting in competition- rather than spending a lot of time reinventing the wheel-
find out what the previous winners are using, and start there.

Both are good, but like the Indy 500 when the difference between 1st and 2nd place is 1/2 of a car length,
a tiny little bit of an edge can payoff big.

[charlie b]

That's kinda what I did. A frequent winner of the production class was Don Kost with his BVSS using the RCBS 165SIL. After my first shots with it I can see why.

There was a large variety of bullets used. The were even a few shooting a Lee bullet. The only one that seemed to be used by more than one or two was the Lyman 311299/314299 (mainly in the military classes).

The results seem to point to the person and their skills in casting, reloading and shooting more than the specific bullet type.

And, no, I won't be shooting any competition with it. Just making as small a group as I can

[bluejay75]

It’s the Savage. I sold a couple Remingtons and replaced with Savages. They feed cast well and flat out perform.

400.00 gun outshooting a 1000 dollar gun. Great job Savage.

[lotech]

I've had both the 165 SIL RCBS mould and the #314299 for a long time. Both shoot well in .308s. I haven't used the RCBS mould in at least ten years because I get a little better accuracy from the #314299.

[Went2kck]

I shoot cast out of a ruger precision in 308 with IMR 4198. I don't remember the grouping other than it was tight. I belive it was shooting a 165gr something with a lyman mold. Those at the range looked at me funny shooting cast out of the RPR.

[ole_270]

I've been working with an old (1959 or 60) JC Higgins 51-L (Husky HVA action) 308. High Standard barreled them for Sears using European barrels that were slightly oversized. The throat is pretty big as well as worn. I had good results from some Accurate 31-165A bullets a guy sent me, but finally settled on the NOE clone of the Saeco #315. The tapered design allows me to stick it into that worn throat to bridge the large throat. I'm shooting PC'd bullets water dropped out of the oven. I worked up as high as 2400 fps using H4831sc, H4350, and Varget, but best accuracy was in the 2100-2300 range. The slower powders handled the faster speeds much better than the mid-range powders like 4895. Some guys are getting speeds up to 2700 fps with the 165 weight bullets, but this old worn barrel works better at 30-30 to 300 savage speeds. Think I'll use it this fall on deer, can't think of anything locally that would stop a 180 gr bullet at 2150-2300 fps.

[waco]

Don't overlook the NOE 30XCB mold. It shoots very well in my Rem 700 .308

[_The_Shadow]

What do you size your cast bullets to for the 308 guns? 0.308", 0.309", 0.310", 0.311" ?
0.308 with gas checks did well in my Marlin 30-30Win but what about something like the AR guns using cast bullets, what sizer do you think is best?

[Jniedbalski]

My savage axis is hard to close on a .312 but .311 works great. I have used the lee 100 2r and the 90gr swc . Pistols bullet. The Also the noe 203 gr . The pistols bullets shoot good with 3.0 to 3.2 of bullseye. There quite and really accurate at 50 yards

[_The_Shadow]

Thanks for the reply, I have read where some are using 0.311" in the bolt guns...I might need to load a dummy to see if it restricts the BGC if the neck is too tight...

[charlie b]

I had the bullets sized to .309 cause that is what my rifle measured at in the grooves.

I also found that my rifle has a very short throat. I had to seat the bullets such that only about 0.1" of the bullet 'shoulder' was showing.

[_The_Shadow]

I made a dummy cartridge without sizing the cast bullet 0.311" and it did chamber into battery just fine. Even though I left it a little long and the start of rifling was touching the bullet...
I was worried that the neck area would be too large to fit the chamber, that didn't appear to be any issue.

[Ateam]

charlie,
I have the same rifle with almost no throat, the rifling is so sharp that it gouges bullets and boolets. It has been a safe queen because of it. I may get around to finding a throating reamer some day and fixing the problem...

[Jniedbalski]

In my axis the noe 203 gr was fine at .311 Seated out long . It’s the round nose with gas check. I thought I might have to seat this one deep in the case but had no problem leaving it at mag length and longer for single shot. I don’t remember the charge I thank 5 to 7 gr of bullseye and it shot good at 100 yards. Have wanted to try the 16 gr of 2400 but this load of bullseye shoots so good I haven’t yet

[Jniedbalski]

The riffling should imprint on the bullet if it’s long enough. Is yours gouging or tearing the bullet metal / lead? The couple of 308’s I tried had a very long throat. Could leave the bullet out way past mag length and all of them I could use .311 and chamber.

[waco]

I size to .311" as well.

[Shuz]

I have been having some success in getting sub 1 inch groups with a Lee 6 cavity clone of the Lyman 311041. Boolits drop at .311 from 10:1(ww/lino) My load is 17g of 2400 Velocity is 1650fps. I occasionally get a flyer that opens the group to 1.5 inches or so, therefore I am experimenting with different amounts of lubrication in the grease grooves.The thought is that I may be experiencing lube purging?

[charlie b]

The throat is interesting. When shooting Sierra Match Kings I could seat them out to the book recommended OAL plus a little bit and was still .020" from touching the lands. Seeing where the rifling starts was a surprise to me. But, as long as these things shoot well I will keep going.

My next experiment is to seat the bullets out til they just touch or slightly engrave the rifling. Not worried about pressures as these are all lower power loads. May also try some IMR4895 or IMR4166 that I have laying around.

I may go ahead and buy a Lee .311-200 mold to play with as well.