Hydroshock Mold?

[thraxx]

Has anyone ever produced a mold with a post in the center of a hollow point, like the hydroshock bullet? Is it even possible to cast something like that?

[rancher1913]

there is a russian 12g slug mold that comes close.

[country gent]

It would be possible and could be done. several issues to do it.
1) it would need to be a floating pin insert so bullet could release from mould first.
2) the pins cavity would need to be very smooth and tapered to release from pin and cavity both
3) Would be very sensitive to temps and cadence along with cooling.
4) the pin would be susceptible to breaking off and staying stuck in the pin cavity. Actually flipping the mould over upside down before opening might help here.

Making the mould wouldn't be to hard. the pin would be more work than normal.
The pin would need to be turned / ground to form then a hole drilled reamed with tapered sides and radiused bottom made. This would probably need to be 8*-10* to get release and everything radiused to add strength. It would be very fine delicate work.

I believe when done and right reject rate would be high from poor fill out ( keeping mould hot enough may be a problem) in the pin due to eat and venting issues the pons cavity will be hard to vent. Another will be bent or broken pins in the cavities from bullet release.

A better way might be to use a forester hollow pointer and drill a small hole in the bottom of a hollow point and glue a snug fitted pin in it. A short length of lead solder.

[Burnt Fingers]

That would be an interesting mold to try and cast. It would have to be run very hot and getting the boolits to drop would be interesting.

[TNsailorman]

I have shot the hydroshok bullet in the .45ACP, the .357 magnum, and the .38 Special. Although it does expand, I never saw any great advantage to it over other hollow points. I never tried it in gel or clothing but shot it into water jugs. Not the most scientific method but give a rough idea of what will and what won't expand. Your idea is workable but why? Unless you just want to experiment and that is in itself a reason to try it. james

[RED BEAR]

I wish i could get hold of a mold to cast the old style hydra shock. There used to be a 130 gr swc hydra shock for 38 and 9 mm. This was a wonderful bullet that i have missed ever since federal bought them out. I doubt i can ever get one unless i make it my self i think federal holds a patent on it if not mistaken.

[rking22]

What is the purpose of the post? I remember seeing them but just wrote it off to marketing. Suspected it was left over from the bleed hole on final swage and they made it a “feature”. In all seriousness, I am curious.

[TNsailorman]

It would not surprise me if Federal does hold a patent on the process/bullet. It is said that there is nothing new under the sun and that probably holds true in this case. In the late 1800's a lot of ideas were being tried to improve bullet lethality. I know I have read about explosive charges put into a cavity of the bullet to explode on impact. Also they tried such things as steel and glass balls to try to expand a bullet. The british tried a dum-dum bullet that was as flat as a pancake up front but it was outlawed. It was supposedly used in India on insurgents and was reported to inflict terrible wounds. There was also a pinfire bullet that exploded after penetrating, using a pin in the nose to drive back into a charge of powder inside the bullet. Lots of weird ideas and some of them worked after a fashion. The AK47 had a lot of the older ideas in it makeup that were not new. Most "new" designs have some features from the past.

[USSR]

The 2 guys behind the Hydra-Shok bullet are a couple of local boys. When they got a gov't contract for their ammo, Federal took notice and bought the patent and name. They had quite a supply of ammo and components when this took place, and I have been quietly buying the ammo, bullets and cases that were sold by family members. I tested a bullet I handloaded by firing it into water soaked newsprint, and they do expand exactly as advertised. BTW, research has told me that Starline (a new company in the mid 70's) made their brass, Albert's (an out of business company in New Jersey) made the bullets, and the .38 Special load used 3.3gr of W231 powder. All in all a fascinating story.

Don

[thraxx]

What is the purpose of the post? I remember seeing them but just wrote it off to marketing. Suspected it was left over from the bleed hole on final swage and they made it a “feature”. In all seriousness, I am curious.

I have shot the hydroshok bullet in the .45ACP, the .357 magnum, and the .38 Special. Although it does expand, I never saw any great advantage to it over other hollow points. I never tried it in gel or clothing but shot it into water jugs. Not the most scientific method but give a rough idea of what will and what won't expand. Your idea is workable but why? Unless you just want to experiment and that is in itself a reason to try it. james

I just enjoy unique bullet designs, and happen to be looking at one the other night and wondering if anyone had attempted to make a mold for one, and if it worked worth a darn. I'd certainly like to try casting it.

I'm sure the factory ones are swaged. I haven't seen any testing that says they are substantially better than a standard hollow point.

comparing it to a .44 devastator (Mihec version) the cavity looks similar, so I was thinking I might be able to modify a pin to try it. I just dont have an extra pin(s) to modify.

I dont have a lathe, so I was thinking I could file a flat on the tip of the pin enough to get a drill bit to bite, and then go for it using a drill press. I hadn't thought about drilling it to depth, and then using a bigger bit to put a step on the post.

[RED BEAR]

It is my understanding that the point inside the hollow point is supposed to help keep the bullet going straight. Weather this works or not who knows apparently it does something. I can tell you for a fact the old ones were bad medicine for deer out of a 357. I don't hunt myself but brother in law swore by them and had me load them up for him. The originals were solid lead.

[Wag]

Part of what makes a HydroShok a, well, Hydroshok is the jacket on the bullet. I think that in order to imitate the performance of it, you'd have to really play around with the lead hardness and see what you get. Not difficult to do, I expect, but it would take a bit of trial and error to get what you want.

--Wag--

[Bigslug]

This would take A LOT of blood, sweat, & tears (both to make and to cast with) to initiate expansion when there are easier ways to accomplish it. The penta-point nose pin concept comes immediately to mind, as does simple manipulation of your alloy to match velocity and intended impact distance.

Given that the Hydra Shok is '80's tech from the days before the current FBI testing protocols, and most LE agencies have moved on from it, I suspect it's a notion that's had it's day. Most likely, Federal still produces it primarily for agencies that require seven acts of Congress to make a policy change on the brand of toilet paper in the restrooms.

[USSR]

Part of what makes a HydroShok a, well, Hydroshok is the jacket on the bullet.

Actually, the Hydra-Shok was designed as an all lead bullet, and it performs admirably as one. For whatever reason, Federal never produced it as it was originally designed.

Don

[country gent]

Everything I've read and been told was the post kept heavy clothing from plugging the hollow point and affecting expansion. I believe the federal versions were swaged not cast.

[Wag]

Actually, the Hydra-Shok was designed as an all lead bullet, and it performs admirably as one. For whatever reason, Federal never produced it as it was originally designed.

Don

Okay, that's a new one on me......

--Wag--

[mdi]

I can see a hollow pointing pin for a mold machined with a "Hydro-Shock" point done easily, but even if casting/bullet release were taken into consideration, home casting would be quite a challenge...

[RED BEAR]

Oh yes the all lead ones are the ones that worked the best as far as i am concerned they weren't especially hard lead ether they were lubed sort of like a 22 lr. I was able to push them to a decent velocity with out leading but if you went full bore leading was excessive especially in a 357. The ones i miss were 130 swc all lead. This was back in the 80's. I may be wrong but i can't see where it would be any harder to cast than any hollow point.

[USSR]

Here's a pic of the original Hydra-Shok.

Don

[Burnt Fingers]

Oh yes the all lead ones are the ones that worked the best as far as i am concerned they weren't especially hard lead ether they were lubed sort of like a 22 lr. I was able to push them to a decent velocity with out leading but if you went full bore leading was excessive especially in a 357. The ones i miss were 130 swc all lead. This was back in the 80's. I may be wrong but i can't see where it would be any harder to cast than any hollow point.

You would have a hollow point pin with a cavity in the middle. Like a closed end tube. I can see venting problems, problems keeping the whole thing hot enough.

Swaging them would be easy with the right dies. Casting....a whole 'nuther can of worms.