Looking to start casting some boolits for a 44 mag rifle.
Plan to shoot them subsonic, so high velocity obviously isn't an issue.
Looking at moulds and trying to determine if there are any pros/cons to using a PB or GC boolit in this application.
Thoughts?
Accuracy.
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“If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.”
― The Dalai Lama, Seattle Times, May 2001
Correct, that is the question.
you will get better accuracy with a GC.
Now "Better" may or may not be measurable with your application and shooting distance...whatever they are?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
“If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.”
― The Dalai Lama, Seattle Times, May 2001
You might get acceptable accuracy for your needs and distance....tin cans at 15 feet? But it's one of those things you will have to try .
You didn't give any information as to how you plan to use them (application ).
I have never had great luck shooting boolits that were a GC design and I left the GC off. A plain base or the GC installed always seemed to do better.
I can say that I have never had a GC designed boolit shoot worse with the addition of a GC.
My general rule of thumb is to use a plain base if the velocity is below 1000 fps, things start getting near 1000 , use a gas checked design with the check.
With Lee 2 cavity moulds being affordable , get a mould with and another without a GC....You can't have just one 44 mould, I think that's a casting rule !
Last edited by gwpercle; 04-29-2017 at 11:35 AM.
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I've stopped using gas checks in pistol/revolver rounds... even full-blown magnum loads.
Most of my magnum revolver loads run in the 1150-1250 fps range... which includes loads for the .45 Colt, .38-40, 10mm, .32-20, and .32 Magnum in Ruger Blackhawks. I get no leading and no problems with acceptable accuracy.
I don't shoot any in rifles, but I would think subsonic loads (<1100 fps) would not require a gas check.
*
Originally Posted by mattri
Read up on slugging the bore and bullet fit to said diameter. All your questions will be answered.
Bullet diameter will be more important that plain base/gas check. With a 44 mag rifle, SAAMI groove diameter is .431 so size accordingly. I size mine to .433.
Key
"Hatred is the cowards answer for being intimidated"
I shoot PB at 1300 to 1350 fps in the .475 and .500 JRH also a .500 S&W and .454 at max. Hey to 500 meters. I work around a GC with alloy and am guilty of making the .44 a GC, Not needed at all. Just a good FB.
My first question/comment on this would be to discuss SAAMI barrel dimensions for 44 handguns/rifles. In handguns, the max groove diameter is .429. In rifles it is .432. What this means is that most all molds are undersize for shootzen cast boolits in rifle barrels. That said there are some cures. First of course is to slug your barrel and find out what size it is. If you find you have a large groove diameter then modify your moulds (beagling or lapping) or purchase a mold which is appropriate to the measured diameter. That said, I have shot a bucket full of boolits through 44 Mag rifle barrels (NEF/H&R, Marlin, Rossi the NEF and Rossi barrels are .432) using 6 grains of Red Dot and Green Dot (6 grains of TiTe Group is quite similar). These loads run circa 900 fps and make for great plinking. I finally purchased the NOE .434 mould copy of the famous Keith design 250 grain semi wadcutter because i simply couldn't stomach 4-4.5 inch groups at 50 yards. The .434 diameter boolits cut the group size to less than half that. For a long time I shot a boolit from a Lee 310 mold I modified by machining the mold down to remove the gas check shank and it left me a boolit that drops 250 grains. It would shoot quite decently out of the NEF barrel and I killed several deer with that boolit/rifle. The bulk of my 44 Magnum plinking is done with the Lee 430 200 RF. Mine drops at 217 grains from a Marlin this boolit shoots superbly, not so superb from the NEF or Rossi. Banging on 6" steel from offhand positions, one would never know that the paper groups this boolit makes are not so hot. But shootzen paper will make you crazy if you are A retentive about groups. I run these same loads through my handgun (Dan Wesson) with great satisfaction. All these boolits I shoot are plain base and I see no reason to add the expense of a gas check for plinking, kinda defeats the purpose of cheap enjoyment.
These are ten-shot, fifty yard groups fired within soft, 1:30 tin-lead, plainbased bullets in a Marlin 1894S Microgroove .44-40 rifle with open sights. These are not subsonic loads, but full charges, about 1200 fps.
Attachment 194318
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Plain base is fine. Comments above are valid re: slugging the bore. Sample of 2 River 77/44 rifles was .429 and .430", the latter coming from the earliest production run.
I have danced with the Devil. She had excellent attorneys.
plain base is plenty good. [especially if you time your casting properly]
the lower velocity and longer length might not be compatible.
especially if you get a 44 mag rifle with the twist rate for a 44-40.
Yes, there is the twist issue to consider. The 77/44 is 1:20" and handles the longer bullets as well as your shoulder can stand the recoil. The rifle shoots MOA with 300 gr. pure lead paper patch at 1600 fps. Some of my wussy friends whimper after a shot or three.
Average velocity for the target below was 1050 fps for 5 shots, range was 25 yards in the course of initial load work up:
The bullet is 320 grains and cast at .430"
I have danced with the Devil. She had excellent attorneys.
Normally speaking I do not worry about gas check until I am pushing 1400 fps or close to it. 1300 up you may see a touch more leading without one. Or if it fits well and your powder works well you may not.
Over 1400 fps consistently, better to buy gas check.
My experience as well.
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I can't seem to ever get it down under 4-5 molds! Got 2 more on the way.
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Great information thanks to all!
In a revolver - Plain Base, done.
Darn I am over 1630 fps in a revolver with a PB. Been over max in a .454 with a PB.
You fellas with slow are pikers.
I do not buy the silly things anymore. There is a place for them. Think RIFLE.
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