45-45-10 with muzzle loader bullets?

[Willyp]

How would this stuff work with Maxi-balls or Lee Real Bullets in a Flint Lock rifle,50 caliper and black powder?

[rda72927]

Great question. Anyone tried this....

[tomme boy]

Still need actual lube

[bubba.50]

after ya take a sturdy rod & mallet & drive'em down the barrel they'd probably shoot okay. with all that hammerin' I doubt yer range session would last long though.

[bubba.50]

I mighta read yer question wrong. if this is about an alloy see above. if this is a lube yer thinkin' of usin' it should be okay as long as it's compatible with black powder foulin'. if it ain't yer barrel will be a tar-baby booger to clean. AND you'll hafta hammer the loads in after a few shots.

[Lethemgo]

45 45 10 is more for smokeless powders and I wouldn't put it in my muzzleloaders. Make up some or buy some blackpowder lube and guarantee you'll be much more happy with it the same it's designed to keep fooling soft and the other will probably harden it. There's a guy down it the vendor softest ion that sells some. Haven't used it because I make my own but from reviews bet you be happy with it. Looked it up tac black....allaabees plus he's a site sponsor

[rodwha]

I use Gatofeo's #1 lube on my .50 cal REALs, pistol boolits, and felt wads. I've been told it makes a good patch lube too, which I'll try.

Gatofeo found this this recipe in a very old (30's or 40's) gun magazine. It was an outside lubricated bullet recipe for commercial bullets.

Made in a double boiler it is (by weight) 1 part mutton tallow, 1 part paraffin wax (Gulf Wax), and 1/2 part beeswax. Simple and inexpensive. And according to Gatofeo it was the best thing out of many that he tried (maybe climate determines best?).

[Omnivore]

I had to look it up, being as this is a muzzleloading forum and 45;45;10 is a bullet lube used in smokeless loads. It consists of Johnson's paste wax, Lee liquid Alox, and 10% mineral spirits used as a thinner. The mineral spirits will evaporate out over time if left to open air, leaving the other two components behind.

Will it "work" in black powder applications? I dunno. What's your personal definition of "work"?

In my experience and understanding, the only purpose for "lube" in a muzzleloader or a percussion revolver is for keeping the black powder fouling soft enough that the gun continues to shoot to POA, and can be reloaded and operated without the powder fouling tying up the process. And even there, we'd need to contrast the purpose of lube in a percussion revolver from the purpose of lube in a true muzzleloading rifle or pistol.

In a BP revolver I want the fouling soft enough that the next shot wipes out all of the fouling from the previous shot. Using enough lube to truly accomplish THAT in a true muzzleloader might be a problem, as you'd be wiping all of that fouling/lube mix (goo) down upon the powder charge for a subsequent shot. In a revolver the bullet isn't being pushed back down the bore. That's a big difference. Therefore I tend to use only a lubed patch in a muzzleloading rifle, whereas in a revolver I'm putting a lube cookie between the powder and the bullet. Therefore I'll wipe the bore between shots in the rifle, whereas I'll shoot all day with the revolver and not wipe the bore (or do any other form of maintenance other than blowing through it) until I get home. So I could be wrong but I see it as a whole different deal, whether the bullet is going two ways through the bore, or only one way.

That is in TOTAL contrast with the purpose of "lube" in smokeless powder systems, which is to prevent bore leading due to the much higher pressures generated by smokeless powder.

Do some lubes work for both systems? Sure; SPG is touted as good for both. 45:45:10? I have no idea. Try it and let us know what happens, but first have a good, working knowledge of a good BP "lube" system. I'll tell you right now that, for MY purposes, any lube with a volatile component such as mineral spirits would be right out. I make up lube pills, and those are stored long term. They're also loaded into paper cartridges for percussion revolvers, and stored long term. I couldn't tolerate havbing a volitile component in there, soaking into the paper and possibly the powder, and drying out over time. Gatofeo #1 (GF! for short) does very well in that there is no liquid or volatile component in it. I can store the stuff for years, in cartridges or otherwise, with no issues.

For a commercial black powder lube, SPG seems to be one of the main standards, by which others might well be compared. Again though, I believe there would be a big difference (or at least some difference) between a revolver or BPCR "ideal lube" and one for a true muzzleloader, and/or whether you're using lube under the bullet or in lube grooves. BPCR shooters may do both lube in the bullet grooves and in cookie form under the bullet, depending on bullet design and conditions. In the case of lube in the bullet grooves only, I believe you'd have more flexibility in lube recipe, because FAR less lube would be left behind in the bore.

OK, I'm now rambling so I'll shut up...

[rfd]

as mentioned, white label type 45-45-10 was created for smokeless bullet lubing - i use that for .45acp and .357mag bullet tumble lube.

but what the heck, you try it out and please report back yer findings.

personally, i'd want a viscous stick-to-yer-ribs lube like ... gatofeo #1

[Willyp]

BUBBA,you jogged my memory and now i do recall that LLA will gum up a muzzle loader!!!!!!!!
Won't be trying it at all!