H-110 in a 357mag

[Plane340]

I am trying to develop a full power load for my ruger sp-101 (2.25" barrel). The bullet that I would like to use is the Lee 356-125-2R. The alloy is pretty much straight wheel weights. I powder coat the bullets after casting which gives me a final weight around 132 grains. I tried to interpolate some data from a Lyman reloading handbook to determine a good starting point. I settled on 17.5 grains of H-110. The powder is extremely dirty. Black residue coated the cylinders and residue was even on the outside of the spent brass. Is this a sign of under loaded cartridges? The accuracy was good as I was able to consistently hit a 6" round target at 50 yards. I just don't like how much cleaning I had to do with this combination. Anybody have any experience with this bullet/powder? What are the signs of under load?

[knifemaker]

Your load is under the starting load for 125 gr. Hornady XTP bullet which is listed at 21 gr. by the Hodgdon on line reloading site. H-110 and W296 are the same powder with different labels according to Hodgdon and they recommend that you do not load under their recommended starting loads with that powder. In fact they warn you not to do that. I am sure you are seeing the signs of a underload for that caliber and bullet weight.

[357Mag]

Plane340 -

Howdy !

Are you shooting your loads w/ " Magnum " primers ?


With regards,
357Mag

[Petrol & Powder]

Your load is under the starting load for 125 gr. Hornady XTP bullet which is listed at 21 gr. by the Hodgdon on line reloading site. H-110 and W296 are the same powder with different labels according to Hodgdon and they recommend that you do not load under their recommended starting loads with that powder. In fact they warn you not to do that. I am sure you are seeing the signs of a underload for that caliber and bullet weight.

/\ This is right on the money /\

I don't load/shoot a lot of magnum rounds but when loading .357 mag (or 44 mag) - H110 is my go-to powder. H110 (ww296 -same thing) does NOT tolerate down loading well. H110 does produce excellent results when loaded within published ranges. Magnum primers are usually recommended with H110. That powder meters beautifully and gives excellent results but seems to operate best at higher pressures.

[NSB]

Good answers so far but it needs to be added that 110/296 won't be your best choice out of such a short barrel unless you're trying to develop some spectacular visual displays.......it will blind you from the muzzle flash. This powder isn't suited to short barrels.

[Plane340]

They are not magnum primers. They are regular small pistol primers. The brand is S&B from Cabela's. The cheap stuff. I reload for a reason. These primers have worked flawlessly in other applications. I'm starting to not like H-110. It shoots great, but it's expensive with the large load needed, dirty, and now I read requires mag primers.

[claude]

You just need to understand what H110 is for, namely heavy magnum loads, it may not be your best choice. For economy you might be better served with a quicker powder such as Bullseye, Unique, Power Pistol, or N340. As far as liking H110, it does exactly what it is supposed to do, you've just applied it inappropriately.

[Sur-shot]

Plane,
A lot of reloaders fail to think out the problem. You can not get 4, 6 or 8 inch velocity with a 2 inch snubbie, even if you use (only as an example) nitroglycerine as a propellant. You are working your problem exactly backwards, you need energy and energy is produced in a handgun with heavy bullet weight or velocity with a light weight bullet. With a 2 inch barrel you can not get to the velocity you need with a 125. Switch your bullet to a 180-200, change to a reduced load of fast burning powder, shoot the 125 for practice with 231 or Unique and save the heavy bullet loads for business.

I have shot 357s with H-110 in competition for 30 years, it is a great powder in an 8 inch or 10 inch 357 revolver. Even more so in a 10 inch single shot handgun with a 200gr bullet. But as has been said, in your situation, H-110 is not the appropriate powder nor is a 125gr bullet appropriate for a 2 inch revolver.

Here is a funny for you, say the 2 inch is your carry gun, say you have to use it in the black dark..... slow burning H-110 will instantly blind you with the flash from outside the muzzle.
Ed

[dragon813gt]

H110 requires a magnum primer. It's an hard to light powder that is erratic at low pressures. Keep the pressure up and it shines at what it does. Which is produce full house magnum velocity. There is nothing wrong w/ using it in a snubbie. Just expect a blinding flash and lower velocity. I personally don't use it w/ lightweight bullets. W231/HP-38 and Universal work better in this application.

[rototerrier]

I love H110, but I am shooting it out of a Full Size large frame with 158-170gr bullets. I've tried lighter bullets, and even with the long barrel, I would get unburned powder. Out of a 2", I'd imagine it would blow a cloud of powder out the barrel.

It's an absolutely wonderful powder, within it's usable range.

I've had much better success with lighter bullets in 357 using TiteGroup, HP38, HS-6 and real good success with CFE Pistol.

I actually try to stick with Hodgdon powders because of their online reference material and there's always a decent coverage of load data in my reloading manuals. I'm sure there's others out there that work just as well. Just need to be a bit faster burning for the shorter barrel.

[mdell49]

Try Some Blue Dot

[Plane340]

The purpose of the load is to serve as a target practice range load in my everyday carry gun. The 158 grain bullets that I have been shooting in this pistol kick like a mule. I already load the Lee 356-125-2R in my wife's 38 spl. I was hoping to get the velocity up with the 357 while also reducing the kick over a 158gr bullet. After that I could tailor my EDC ammo with a jacketed HP that closely resembles my range ammo. Then I could train like I shoot and shoot like I train. I actually like the performance I'm getting out of H-110 in terms of accuracy and felt recoil. The reason I'm hung up on this particular bullet is because I already have lots and lots of them cast and powder coated for my wife's gun. I use 4.0 grains of HP-38/WW231 for her load which is a little light in comparison to her EDC ammo, but for now it gets her willing to shoot more so I consider it an acceptable trade.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

I personally had much better results with 2400 in barrels 4" or less. H-110 worked well in longer barrels and I would expect it to be great in carbines, but out of snub nosed guns I got nasty fireballs and lots of unburned powder.

[dragon813gt]

Try Some Blue Dot

Try it of you really want a fireball. And then there is the whole disclaimer about not using Blue Dot w/ 125 grain bullets. It's the last powder you should attempt to use.

[RPRNY]

4227 is better for the intended purpose and bullet type. 17.5 grs to start.

[Kestrel4k]

I have used lots of H110 (WC820 actually) and it really likes maximum loads w/ heavy bullets, I can see the fired cases get cleaner as I go up toward max.

They are not magnum primers. They are regular small pistol primers. The brand is S&B from Cabela's. The cheap stuff. I reload for a reason. These primers have worked flawlessly in other applications. I'm starting to not like H-110. It shoots great, but it's expensive with the large load needed, dirty, and now I read requires mag primers.

I have been comparing the inexpensive S&B primers to Winchester primers in 44 Mag (scoped rifle) recently. I seem to be getting better & more consistent ignition with the Winchester primers, so I'm pretty certain they are hotter than S&B. Most likely less of an issue in .357 Mag, but it sounds like if you're going to use the milder S&B primers that's another reason to use 2400/4227/etc. All of my H110 loads I use the Winchester Std/Mag primer and I'm getting good results FWIW. Hope this helps,

[jonp]

I had one of those myself. Are you sure you want to do what you are trying to do? As others have said the muzzle flash is enormous and the recoil unpleasent. I think that the barrel is too short to ever clean that up and I would try a different powder like Unique

[Plane340]

4227 is better for the intended purpose and bullet type. 17.5 grs to start.

I show 4227 to be a slower powder than even H-110. Please help me understand how that powder could be more suited in a short barrel pistol.

[RPRNY]

It is not load density sensitive like H110 (does not need near full case load to function effectively) and is not as powerful as H110, which is not a powder I would use with WW bullets. The burn rate of 4227 plays a very limited role in suitability vis-à-vis barrel length provided the charge is suited to bullet. Because 4227 is not density sensitive, you can adjust downward from 17.5grs to see if you can get to a good compromise on combustion/velocity. The only issue with 4227 is that it's a bit dirty. You may get more residue than you like.

[Plane340]

Is there a place where I can learn about the internal ballistics of all the various powders? Some say use 2400, some say use Blue Dot, some say no-no don't use blue dot with a light bullet, some say use Unique. I don't have time or money enough to try everything out. I can research things out but have been confused about the usefulness of the burn rate chart. Especially when I see seemingly contridictory information. For example, everyone say HP-38 IS W231. My experience confirms the truth of this fact. But then I see that the two powders are not listed next to each other on the burn rate chart. What's down with that??? Perhaps I totally misunderstand the purpose of the burn rate chart. But it's pretty much all I have to go by except for the loading data. Which is for bullets that I am not using. There has to be a better way of learning than by trial and error or asking for help everyday on the forum.