My Primer went ka-boom tonight

[Mk42gunner]

One reason I like the RCBS hand priming tool over the Lee round tray version is that it has a metal shield between the primer being seated and the rest of them waiting in the plastic tray. Would that have helped in this case? Who knows, but it does make me feel better.

I do know I don't like handling individual primers. It really doesn't matter if I plan to seat them using the press's built in system or a ram prime unit. Twenty years of giving and receiving explosive safety lectures and training must have sunk in at least a little bit.

Then of course there is the friend I had that liked to repackage and store his primers in the little urinalysis sample bottles, (prior to use at least) the Navy used to use, "because they take up less space." (He was a QuarterMaster). I did warn him in some pretty colorful sailor language that he was stupid for doing that.

Robert

[Alan in Vermont]

It works like a dream. RCBS includes longer tubes now. I've been using an earlier "short" tube model for 35 years and never had a problem. One quirk with them is they have to be mounted at the edge of the bench unless you want to cut and weld the handle or mount on an angled base. I don't mind the overhang but I don't prime while watching TV.

There is also the APS style that uses plastic strips. I'm not a fan having yet an extra piece of plastic to deal with. It's up to you if you think the trade-off is worthwhile and want to stock the strips (I seem to recall there was a shortage of them a while ago.) There is also a tool to load the strips.

I am now using the RCBS Tool you mention above. I like how it works and the fact that the primers are set in the priming cup and the tube moved away before the primer is seated. It might be possible to chain fire if one somehow managed to jam a primer as it is deposited from the tube to the priming punch but I don't see that really being likely.

My RCBS Pro-2000 had that mickey mouse strip priming device incorporated into it. They include the strip loader with the press outfit. However, the strips get burred up in use and then there are feeding issues. Mine got out of time on a burred strip and detonated a primer. There is a metal cover over the primer strip. The flash from the detonated primer chain fired three more primers until where the metal cover ended, allowing the flash from the last primer fired to go upward instead of onto the next primer in the strip. The whole priming system was a constant nightmare and I ended up replacing it with a tube feed conversion they offer. No issues and the primer column is contained in a steel scattershield which should direct any detonation in the tube straight up.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

one time , long ago and still new to the 1000's and 1050's we had back then , pulling handles for the Old man, I had the stack of primer in the primer tube go off and blew the little following bar into the over head and lit my face up with the powder in the primers.
I would not go back to loading with that machine for about 3-4 months, had the scar on my face from hairline to chin for months...after that I would not go into the shop with out safety glasses (no. did not have them that day like a dum@@@) & I wanted a face shield too...after that any way.
I would be scared to ever primer with a hand held tool, never gave them a second look ever...
Love Dad's RCBS tool or even the 550 or 650 for doing my priming but always had to be careful when doing Military brass and make sure we swagged the pockets 1st....to make sure I did not blow another stack of primers or a new pair of shorts....

[P Flados]

When I started reloading some 40 years ago, I considered the original Lee auto-prime to be one of the best tools made by Lee.

I could take primers, dump some in a clean tray and push them into the cases without ever touching a primer and with much more feel than I got using the priming function on my RCBS press. I felt that it did the job faster, easier and better than I could do with my press and the cost was a bargain.

Eventually, I stumbled across a discussion of problems with the Lee tool and Federal primers. I looked up the issue and found that there was an injury from a primer going off, and a lawsuit.

The cause of the detonation was not really explained. I checked today and the Lee site still has guidance of:

New Primer Information. Effective Aug. 2011

This primer restriction applies only to the original round tray Auto-Prime, Auto-Prime 2, Pro 1000 and Load-Master

These sizes may be used with 100 primers in the tray:

• All sizes of CCI brand primers
• Winchester small pistol
• All sizes of Remington brand primers

Limit to only 20 primers in the tray of these types:

• Winchester Large Pistol
• Winchester Magnum Pistol
• Winchester Magnum Rifle

Only 10 primers should be loaded in the tray of this type:

• Winchester Large Rifle

Do not use Federal primers


I still have and use my original (and a second) Lee Auto Prime. I was a little nervous, but one unexplained event was "not worth" doing something about.

I did change how I held it when seating primers. I try to hold it out and tilt it away so that anything ejected "up" would not be toward my face.

I have not been using a lot of Federal lately, but do have a more than a few. Most of my recent usage has been Tulammo. CCI used to be my favorite brand and I did score a couple of thousand CCIs in my most recent re-stock.

The two additional detonations describe in this thread have increase my level of concern.

Even if held so as to point the "up side" away, there is the discussion of how the lower plastic piece shattered and resulted in hand injuries.

This is kind of sad, since my engineering inspection of the device indicates that this specific item could have easily and cheaply been configured to provide better hand protection.

The newer Lee hand tool (Auto-Prime XR) seems to have changes that they indicate will better assure no mass detonation. It does not say it provides any improved hand protection. I hope it does.

The Lee tool is still a great concept. It would be even better if I could be sure that I am not taking too much risk.

If anyone has any information that the original auto prime can cause significant injuries when used as recommended by Lee, this needs to be identified and Lee should probably be pushed into more aggressive action. A discount for people that would upgrade to the new Lee tool and while destroying their old Lee tool would be a start.

For me, I am leaning toward continued use but with a mostly simple plan:

• No more than 10 for either large or magnum primers
• No more than 20 in small non-magnum
• Continue to keep the tool out and pointed as safe as practical

This is easy to remember, more aggressive than what Lee put out and will not be all that hard.

I still need to decide how to use up the 2k or so Federals I bought before I was aware of this issue. I may do 10 at a time with additional protection (such as a glove).

[fast ronnie]

I have an RCBS auto prime. Two things I really like about it. (1) it is pretty fast. (2 and most important) you see the primer is in correct position BEFORE you put it in the case. I have had several primers turned upside down or sideways with other priming methods. The RCBS is well worth the money, even if you can't find a used one. (mine was) You also have a pretty good feel with it.

[tankgunner59]

I use the Lee hand primer, square, and no problems. I have even had to put excess hand pressure on it a few times and it didn't have any problems.
Hope your hands, stomach and anything else that may be injured. Always better safe man.

[Grump]

A LOT of posts here from people who missed facts from the first post and follow-ups from the injured comrade.

This is a good reminder: I have always somewhat regularly run a wet patch through my primer tubes to clean out the dust. It IS the explosive compound itself, and as noted above is a candidate for all sorts of misbehavior. In this thread we have report(s) of tray explosions without the primer being seated going off. That tells me that the hazard includes the primer magazine (and stack for the tube systems), not just the seating operation. The RCBS move-away mechanism and blast shield from the seating operation won't do any good for that scenario.

These reports of Dillon systems lighting up: Is the steel outer tube containing the blast? I can easily imagine how chunks flying from either end of the blast tube can cause injury, but I want to make sure. My ceiling above the press is indeed fire-resistant, but I should probably beef up the lenses over the lights, to keep them on in an "event" and eliminate the risk of a secondary electrical fire.

My feeling is that failure to regularly clean out live primer dust may someday be viewed with the same "that's STOOOPID" thoughts we now have for all our buddies' fathers who would clean off car parts in their garages using gasoline instead of safety solvent. At least our neighborhoods were all-electric, without a gas-fired water heater in the corner with a nice pilot light waiting to ignite vapors.

[Bullwolf]

These reports of Dillon systems lighting up: Is the steel outer tube containing the blast? I can easily imagine how chunks flying from either end of the blast tube can cause injury, but I want to make sure. My ceiling above the press is indeed fire-resistant, but I should probably beef up the lenses over the lights, to keep them on in an "event" and eliminate the risk of a secondary electrical fire.

My feeling is that failure to regularly clean out live primer dust may someday be viewed with the same "that's STOOOPID" thoughts we now have for all our buddies' fathers who would clean off car parts in their garages using gasoline instead of safety solvent. At least our neighborhoods were all-electric, without a gas-fired water heater in the corner with a nice pilot light waiting to ignite vapors.

I blew a primer tube at work while loading on one of the older commercial Dillon presses. It briefly made me the center of attention in the shop.

A piece of berdan 9mm Makarov brass was missed by one of the case sorters, and fed in through the automatic case feeder. When I went to prime that case while loading regular 9mm Luger, my recently filled primer tube went BANG.

The primer tube contained the entire explosion, and all of the primers shot up into the ceiling. (missing the fluorescent lights) Spent and unspent primers rained down from the ceiling after. I was using CCI small pistol primers at the time.

To my recollection the primer dust had never been cleaned from any of the tubes, though sometimes I'd blow off the press and shell plates with compressed air. I certainly do make a point to clean primer dust up now!

No injuries were incurred other than to my pride. There may have also been a need to change my shorts. Ears sure did ring for a while after though.



- Bullwolf

[Littleton Shot Maker]

In my case the tube held no problem, but the slit cut out in front sent the shrapnel right into my face, eyes, hair, neck, ears rang for a few. Dad laughed it off it at first but we took it serious, and we did clean the tubes but we think one pocket was shallow ( new brass too) and I could have seated it too hard but I did nothing odd , same old stroke just cranking away.

The over head was messed up. glad the tube was not full , but about half way full. Dad joked - 'Yeah just like back in Nam' and something about 'willie pete', that all it took I was done, went back to casting hot lead where it's safer!!

OH YEAH I have been told by very many "experts" how 'this' can never happen- BS- I used to have the scars to prove them wrong and still remember it like it was today what it looks like when the flash of those primers goes off right there in your face and no way or where to run and hide-- dang stills burns an image in my head even after 20 years...yes shorts thing for sure,

[725]

I've set primers off inadvertently with my Lee whack-a-moles, but never in my RCBS hand primer. Thanks to all for raising my awareness about seating primers. Next move is to clean the device and find my safety glasses. Would never thought about priming material dust accumulation and the inherent explosive potential. And here, I thought I was a super safe kind of guy. Never too old to learn.

[country gent]

WHen I talked to Lee about mine going up they flat out stated that uncovered primers ( no foil or paper seal) er te problem since they allowed primer dust out to accumulatein the tool. Both Lee and the primer manufacturer were very helpfull in sorting this out.I contacted theprimer manufacturer the next day afraid there were some over sensitive primers that got out. Somethings are not considered in the use by the users, How many are being primed in one setting ( like me that day I was over 800 308s in that setting working on 2000 cases for ythe high power season). WHen was the last time accumulations were removed? And the big one manufaccturers have no control over what modifications maitenence have been done and how. Theres so much that affects reloading tooling and how it perrorms after manufacture along with its original desighn.

[Bonz]

The only way that I prime brass

https://youtu.be/S4nShKxk7Gs

[mgread]

Hope the hand get better

[fguffey]

I have R. Lee's book on modern reloading. My Book says R. lee did not test Federal primers because Federal did not donate primers to be tested. Federal did give reloaders something to complain about, they made the large primer trays. The large primer trays drove a lot of reloaders to the curb when it came to moving primers from the tray to the small round flip tray used by Lee.

In my years? I have found double clutching the leaver stacks primers, when a case is installed the top primer gets seated in the primer pocket and the reloader does not have enough leverage to seat it and 'the worst part' the reloader is using the extra primer to seat the top primer.

The bottom primer does not have support meaning when the reloader does not remove the primer and chooses to seat it in another case additional effort is required. Do not double clutch the Lee hand primer. Removing the case with a half seated primer requires a little thinking on the part of the reloader.

One day I started out to bust a primer, after changing from the Lee to the RCBS auto primer I managed to mangle a primer and set it off. It took 2 plus hours.

F. Guffey

[Grump]

The only way that I prime brass

https://youtu.be/S4nShKxk7Gs

For $90, where's the blast shield for that primer tube?

What I'm seeing from first-hand accounts here is that many, perhaps about half, of the primer blowups have nothing to do with a primer in the act of being seated getting ignited.

I was skeptical about the Dillon stories until I thought through how the flame can propagate from the primer seating station to the primer stack. The way it happens might be more a factor of a trail of primer dust in the parts carrying the ignition like a trail of gasoline along the ground. The lower frequency (if there are any at all) of primer stack blowups with the RCBS-style tubes both on their bench tool and in designs like the Rock Chucker primer feed could be explained by the mechanism having no uninterrupted path of parts on which the primer dust could accumulate.

[runfiverun]

I use the rcbs bench mounted tool.
it uses the same shell holder you use to reload your ammo with.
I liked the first one so much I bought a second one just in case they quit making them.
they are quick with a good feel to them.

I mounted it on the bench on a board.
by using a bolt in the center I can spin the priming tool out of the way when it's not needed, and mounted a canellure tool on the other side.

[thegatman]

RCBS tool is the way to go.

[mdi]

I never liked hand priming tools, they just don' seem to fit my hand (tried 3). I found a ram prime to be an excellent priming method. Many will poo-poo it because you load primers individually but I have used one for mebbe 17 years and have always had excellent feel, and uniform seating, with no primer pops.

[seaboltm]

One reason I like the RCBS hand priming tool over the Lee round tray version is that it has a metal shield between the primer being seated and the rest of them waiting in the plastic tray. Would that have helped in this case? Who knows, but it does make me feel better.

This is the setup I use, for the same reason. Does it help? I would say yes as I have popped dozens of primers in my RCBS with no chain reaction. I ditched my Lee when I discovered this issue.

[triggerhappy243]

I use the rcbs hand tool that holds only one at a time. even rcbs could not give me one of those tray types and expect me to keep it. If I have to have a primer accident.... well it will dang well be just one primer.