357 max and PP

[moto357]

Sorry to keep asking so many questions, but I have another. When seating the boolit I'm pressing in as far as I can by hand, then sending it up into the die. Sometimes they come out perfect, other times it seems the paper catches and comes out with one side of the paper wrinkled down. Is this a common headache with paper patching or is there something I'm missing? Would a taper crimp die help align the boolit without messing up the paper? Or can this die I have now be modified to not do this?

[Old Coot]

Moto357:
Are you flaring the mouth of the case?
If not then I would strongly suggest getting a Lee Universal Case Mouth Flaring die. You only need to flare the mouth about .005 inches, and then use your crimping die to just take the flare off. This is all you need especially if you are shooting a single shot and the bullet doesn't need to go through the buffeting of being fed into the chamber.
Brodie

[CJR]

Moto357,

You need to provide more info;
1. What kind of seating die are you using? Paper crinkled down indicates the seating die stem is forcing the paper down.
2. Is the PP over the ogive?
3. Use a taper expander die for the case mouth or a Lyman style M die to open the case mouth slightly. Likewise, inside deburr the case mouth.
4. Lube the base/rear part of the PPCB and ID of the case mouth to ease seating the PPCB. Make sure to lightly crimp the round to remove the flared case mouth.

Best regards,

CJR

[moto357]

Old Coot,
yes I'm using a flaring die but I would suspect its plenty more than .005 that I'm going.

CJR,
1. RCBS 38 dies. The seating die stem does not reach anywhere near where the paper begins. It appears to be the ledge inside the die that actually does the crimping is whats catching the paper
2. The PP is not over the ogive, as can be seen in the following picture.

3-4. This is probably good info, specifically deburring the inside case mouth. Haven't given it a thought previously since the boolits going into the brass haven't been an issue yet with the PP

I've made a half assed taper crimp die(though never having seen one to "know" what its supposed to be), but need to finish the polishing inside. I'll give that a try also tomorrow and see if that helps me at all

[CJR]

Moto357,

If the die's crimping shoulder is pushing the PP back, that's a simple die adjustment. I would suspect that moving the seating stem down into the die body further and then moving the die body up in the reloading press to get the OAL you need should cure the problem. Likewise, you may need to use a separate taper crimp die to straighten out the case mouth flare.

Best regards,

CJR

[moto357]

You make it sound so simple. Don't know why I didn't think of just moving the stem down in the body! Thanks CJR

[303Guy]

I'm enjoying what you've done to make that mold. I am intrigued by your handle and sprue plate mounting. I do suspect that a perfectly cylindrical mold is ideal for even cooling although the effects may be negligible.

Anyway, a suggestion if I may, since you are making these things is to make a nose pour. It would still have a bottom plate. My idea would be to fix the sprue plate and bottom plate to the handle piece and attach a second handle to the mold body would would swing the mold body out, cutting the sprue and opening the base for dropping the boolit out. You could then even go to a parallel shank and push the boolit out through the nose. I designed a fixed mold that moved the body out and under an ejection rod. I never built it though. It was to have a catching something too, possibly a water drop.

I changed to a base plug which set the boolit length into which I incorporated a small chamfer or rebate, the idea being to ensure there was no base feathering from being swaged down the bore which was happening with a flat base.

I plan to make my next mold with small steps instead of radii toward the nose and to reduce the forward section to suit the throat taper. The idea being to provide something for the patch to grip onto so it doesn't slide back on firing.

Just some ideas.

[moto357]

My goal was to make something usable and as simply as possible. Especially considering I'm new to paper patching, it was just an excuse to go make something in the garage. After some promising range time I think I'm hooked on this PP thing!

I realist my 357 max isn't a barn burner for speed, but I've seen no evidence the paper is leaving the book it prematurely. Shooting my 30:1 as fast as 2350+ and a bore riding nose, I've yet to see any leading.

Shot more with the 212gr(brass mold) this weekend with more promising results. Had a slight issue with the gun so its tore apart getting proper repairs. Also, tried shooting some loads with unsized brass and 3 of 6 were stuck in the chamber, and they were all a bit tight going in. Shot good but for fun at the range its a pain to use a rod to get the shells out, not to mention that wouldn't due for a hunting situation.

I'll look into the nose pour mold, see if I can find a design simple enough since I would like one some day. I do have a Lee mold block sitting in my lathe tool box waiting for some mods... Years ago i used a Lee .379 mold and just ran in a .404" reamer to make a 300gr smooth sided boolit for use in sabots with the muzzleloader. Still have the mold too. The design with the step down to the nose is I think what you were referring too 303guy?

[303Guy]

Yes, that's the idea. Nice looking boolit! I was thinking of more steps for mine though, maybe three to simulate a taper. My rifle has a longer throat of course, being a 303 Brit.

Grade 8.8 bolts make great mold bodies. They machine well and harden and blacken with heat. All my working molds are made from them. I've been tempted to make one from stainless steel but worry about heat dissipation/cooling. I did add cooling fins to mine which may help. The bolts were simply scrap ones from work.

[JTCoyoté]

My goal was to make something usable and as simply as possible. Especially considering I'm new to paper patching, it was just an excuse to go make something in the garage. After some promising range time I think I'm hooked on this PP thing!

I realist my 357 max isn't a barn burner for speed, but I've seen no evidence the paper is leaving the book it prematurely. Shooting my 30:1 as fast as 2350+ and a bore riding nose, I've yet to see any leading.

Shot more with the 212gr(brass mold) this weekend with more promising results. Had a slight issue with the gun so its tore apart getting proper repairs. Also, tried shooting some loads with unsized brass and 3 of 6 were stuck in the chamber, and they were all a bit tight going in. Shot good but for fun at the range its a pain to use a rod to get the shells out, not to mention that wouldn't due for a hunting situation.

I'll look into the nose pour mold, see if I can find a design simple enough since I would like one some day. I do have a Lee mold block sitting in my lathe tool box waiting for some mods... Years ago i used a Lee .379 mold and just ran in a .404" reamer to make a 300gr smooth sided boolit for use in sabots with the muzzleloader. Still have the mold too. The design with the step down to the nose is I think what you were referring too 303guy?

Moto,

This is the same method I used years ago to ream a .457 Rapine grease groove mould to a .457 slick sided PP Boolit mould with delaminating ridge for my 577-450 MH... But... no matter the alloy, when I poured the coal to that big case, coal being largish loads of IMR-3031, the groups would spread out a lot due to the lead slipping out of the patch inside the bore.

I found that by using about 20-30 lbs. of pressure, as I rolled the Boolit's bearing surface, where the patch is wrapped, between a flat surface and a course bastard cut file, it moderately knurls the surface enough to stop the lead/ patch slippage and tightened up my groups once again... Adding some teeth to the Boolit insures that the lead and patch stay tight as a unit until they leave the bore...

Coyoté