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Thread: Guide to making percussion caps

  1. #41
    Boolit Buddy TheOutlawKid's Avatar
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    Oftig is very much correct about the antimony granulation. I have successfully made the mix many times...but the times it failed were due to the antimony granulation. The airfloat stuff wont work, i got some 325 mesh and it wouldnt work, sometimes would fizzle but thats it. Even tried it with chinese needle (about 200 mesh)...same thing. Both from a fireworks supply company. Then got a slightly larger granulation from a chemical supply company and still didnt work. I ended up mixing a 1:1 ratio of the chinese needle batch and the chemical supply company batch...mixed it up into FA-42 and it worked amazingly perfect. I had read the same info mr.Oftig posted and it made sense...the granulation ratio was extremely important for success.

  2. #42
    Boolit Buddy TheOutlawKid's Avatar
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    Oh and i wear a mask when doing this...just like when i make black powder...the airfloat powders get into your sinuses and causes the dark boogers. I noticed when i didnt wear a mask i could still smell the chemicals hours after i finished the project and washed up . the sulfur smell. Not sure if others experienced this. I assume it was from fine dust particles getting trapped in my sinuses.

  3. #43
    Boolit Buddy
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    [QUOTE=TheOutlawKid;5116819]The roof flashing is way to stiff...doesnt make good caps on the cap maker. The 36 gauge/.005 aluminum works good but is a little too weak as the caps back end gets destroyed (practically desintegrated) losing all pressure that could have been pushed into the nipple cone. Doubling up helps. The best that i have ever used is the .005 copper sheets that come in a roll at Hobby Lobby. Makes the best cap hulls i have ever used. They also have brass in .005 and it works great too only its a bit stiffer than the copper.[/QUOTE

    Speaking of copper - How does Remington get that "corrugated" look for it's caps?

  4. #44
    Boolit Master

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    More info on cap tests all-fire energies:
    Rem #11: 2 oz@22"
    rollcap + 1/4 gr 4Fg: 2 oz @ 17"
    Prime-all: 4 oz @ 28"
    F48: 4 oz @ 26"
    F42: 4 oz @ 28"

    the F42 mix: 8 gr S powder + 5.5 gr Sb2S3 (pyro powder) + 5.5 gr Sb2S3 (Chinese needle 200 mesh) + 0.5 gr NaHCO3 + 17 gr KClO3
    it is a lot less sensitive than using rollcaps but I calculate my 1858 Navy revolver has hammer impact energy of about 121 inch*ounces so it works 100% with my F42 mix caps

  5. #45
    Boolit Master
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    So far, F42 mix gives me the best performance

  6. #46
    Boolit Buddy
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    Idz You give the relative power in inches. This is interesting to me How do you get this ? In my cap tester I can watch the nipple output and the hammer side at the same time. Many would be very surprised at how much power is lost on the hammer side of the nipple. I have tried many formulations to make percussion caps. Toy pistol caps .Up to 15 dots in the cup. Several attempts with matches. Toy pistol cap with black gunpowder. Of these the toy pistol caps with ten or more dots worked the best with my sidelocks shooting pyrodex. Best of all by far is the prime-all and FA-42. I don't know why the flame from this works better than anything else on pyrodex. Please note that these other formulations can work on revolvers with real black. The 22 reloader cap maker does work well and I have made thousands of cups with it. I also have a Forrester auto-cap maker from the 1900s .That is still good and works fine. I mostly use a doubled up pop can to make my cups.
    Stay safe and mix wet I Do
    n.h.schmidt

  7. #47
    Boolit Master
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    Prime All is basically an F48 mix done by volume.
    I found that it works better if you mix it by F48 ratios by Weight.
    Three of the chemicals from Prime All will work to make F42 if mixed by Weight.
    When I was very young , I use to use Mattel Greenie Stickum Caps for my primer material.
    But back then, the Toy caps had a lot more power and made more noise.
    But one dot in the primer cup got the gun to fire.
    Last edited by LAGS; 09-13-2021 at 07:08 PM.

  8. #48
    Boolit Grand Master In Remembrance
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    You could even 3d print the caps (I have not rounded the struck end of the caps yet, planned. Moving from this old machine to the good new fast computer.

    #10 and #11 caps shown, thinking on musket caps next.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    And I suspect you could make cap drawing dies that would last a few caps worth, maybe, by 3d printing them? Possible but not ideal for perfectionists

    I'd wear eyepro using plastic 3d printed caps but I suspect any good RSO would chew ANYONE out who didn't wear eyepro shooting metal caps, too!

  9. #49
    Boolit Bub
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    When punching my Percussion Cap Cups from Aluminum Beverage Cans I simply fold the flattened aluminum can cutout over to double the thickness.

    The double thickness makes quite a difference.

    Quote from N.H. Schmidt:

    I mostly use a doubled up pop can to make my cups.
    Yep, it works real good!
    Last edited by SeaMonkey; 09-14-2021 at 10:34 PM.

  10. #50
    Boolit Master

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    For testing caps i drop the weight down a tube at various heights. For estimate hammer strike energy i assume the hammer is driven by a linear spring and calculate the rest spring energy and subtract it from the cocked spring energy.

  11. #51
    Boolit Buddy
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    Idz Ok I understand now. Your test finds how much energy is needed to fire the caps off. You don't want that too light. What I would like to do is make a way to measure the cap output.That could be useful in itself.

  12. #52
    Boolit Master almar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LAGS View Post
    Prime All is basically an F48 mix done by volume.
    I found that it works better if you mix it by F48 ratios by Weight.
    Three of the chemicals from Prime All will work to make F42 if mixed by Weight.
    When I was very young , I use to use Mattel Greenie Stickum Caps for my primer material.
    But back then, the Toy caps had a lot more power and made more noise.
    But one dot in the primer cup got the gun to fire.
    I found that measuring by weight gives better results too, i add a small amount of aluminum powder for additional sparks. I use 0.005 brass sheets I can find at the local hobby lobby for a few bucks, It does not disintegrate like aluminum some are even reusable, most importantly they form a great seal during the blast unlike my experience with aluminum, there is no black residue on my percussion revolver hammer. I compress the primall into the cup and used to add one drop of a 50/50 mix of acetone and duco cement.

    Instead of duco cement, i now use a special glue i make for my combustible paper cartridges. I take a small 1cc scoop of smokeless powder and put it in a small sealable glass jar with acetone and leave it over night. The smokeless powder dissolves into a sticky goo, i add acetone and stir until i reach the desired consistency. this glue obviously burns up completely and forms a hard plastic that protects the mixture from moisture and keeps it in place, make sure its very liquid for percussion caps so that it permeates the primall. I like it thicker for cartridges.

    edit:another thing i noticed is that when i fill the cup too much with mixture, its too much of a cushion sometimes, you can get that familiar misfire where you have to hit it again to fire. By adding a little less mix into the cup, i get a much better reliability. I cant remember when i last got a misfire with my caps...its way more common with CCI #11 than with my caps on slixshot nipples i find.
    Last edited by almar; 09-19-2021 at 09:47 AM.

  13. #53
    Boolit Master

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    Commerical caps and primers specify a noFire and allFire energy using drop weights. It is only half the story since both energy and impact power are important but it gives them a convient test.

  14. #54
    Boolit Buddy
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    First I have heard of using smokeless powder as a binder.I will give it a try sometime. I do use shellac flakes in denatured alcohol .Elmer's white glue in water and duco cement.All three work fine for me .I use mostly two layers of pop cans.I also have used .005 copper.I will get the brass and try that. For single shot side locks anything will work for the cups. For the revolvers,they are more demanding if you don't want cap jams. The brass must be a improvement.
    I know that I have been making my caps too powerful for the revolvers. You don't need that much for them.

  15. #55
    Boolit Master

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    Some interesting drop test with EPH20 primer compound. First tests i filled the caps with EPH20, tamped it down, and then added a drop of ethanol/water to activate them. Both the musket caps and #11 caps required 4 oz@28" to detonate and blew the caps apart.
    I then reduced the cap loading to 1 scoop from my modified SPP spoon (about 0.24 grains of EPH20), tamped it down, and then added a drop of ethanol/water to activate them. The reduced load caps were much more sensitive requiring only 2oz@16" to detonate. They also worked fine in my musket and kentucky pistol.

  16. #56
    Boolit Master
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    I have heard of folks over here using the cap gun plastic caps for this purpose......cheap and work.... I do like the idea of making own percussion caps from scratch..... so have copied your how to link and shared it....far to good not to do so.

  17. #57
    Boolit Buddy
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    Following along, lots of good info and ideas.

  18. #58
    Boolit Buddy
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    Following along as well, as my cap maker is on order....

  19. #59
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milky Duck View Post
    I have heard of folks over here using the cap gun plastic caps for this purpose......cheap and work.... I do like the idea of making own percussion caps from scratch..... so have copied your how to link and shared it....far to good not to do so.
    I just tried the plastic cap gun caps this morning - 100% no go (A CVA that I have zero problems with ordinarily)

    - they just didnt have enough grunt to fire the charge - however - I used my flintlock primer to fill the nipple with FFFFpowder and then got 100% fired.

    Been messing with an adaptor for 209 shotgun primers - was hoping to get away from the little screw on cap thingy that commercial adapters have but thats a no go - the strongest sprung lock I have is a mississippi rifle and the 209 on its own blew the hammer back to half cock and the primer out of its adapter socket - back to the drawing board there I think!

    Last price I got on caps was around 20 bucks per 100 and likely going higher - thats some incentive for improvisation.

  20. #60
    Boolit Master Sasquatch-1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by indian joe View Post

    - they just didnt have enough grunt to fire the charge - however - I used my flintlock primer to fill the nipple with FFFFpowder and then got 100% fired.

    Just wondering how much of a delay did you have?
    A vote for anyone other then the conservative candidates is a vote for the liberal candidates.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check