What? No stickies about shotgun slugs :-)

[Buckshot]

.............Just got a new rifled barrel for my Mossberg M500, simply for the fun of it and now I have to do a search!!! You guys make it tough, darn it

.............Buckshot

[mr_nice_guy228]

I think I know the problem. Shotguns are so much awesome that people can't comprehend.

I recently got a NEF Tracker II rifled slug gun, and it seems to like 690 roundballs in a wad. I'm repacking 1 1/8oz bulk walmart shot loads with them right now, so it's about a 1200 fps load. They work equally well in my smoothbores, so I don't feel so bad about butchering up a box of Winchester Universals at a time.
I was considering a full bore slug mold but since these 690's work so good I think I'll stick with it.
What molds do you have or do you plan on picking up for yours? I would be very interested in what you figure out.

Chris

[Whiterabbit]

fortuitous time. Too many irons in the fire, but I took my slug gun out last week and never had such good luck with it. Couldn't miss. That means I really should give it more attention to improve reliability, so it ALWAYS does that well! Can't do that with factory slugs at 3 dollars a shot. Then here we are, talking about the need for slug info!

I concur, really need some good info out there. I'm thinking info on proper ways to crimp, both magtech and plastic hulls, suggestions on how to duplicate factory loads for cheaper range time, hints on what to look for for sabots, suggestions on preferred vendors, how to produce inexpensive projectiles (ie do common molds do the job), and maybe, just maybe, load data.

there are bits and pieces of this around, but can't hit everything above. not easily, and certainly not all in one place. Would be a good bit of info to have compiled.



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It would be really nice to produce a cast load that has identical ballistics as the rem copper solids that shot so well last weekend within 100 yards so I can practice for pennies on the dollar. my light USH was shockingly fun, I forgot how fun it was to shoot.

really, 10 threads on how to crimp for shotshells, and nothing for slugs!

[Firebricker]

If slugs were a sticky a sticky for Lee,Lyman Foster, Lyman 525 and one for full bore slugs would work. FB

[Hogtamer]

some drama around this thread (don't ask) but a lot of folks comtributed a lot of info therein; it's pretty comprehensive and illustrated in many cases.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-Blazing-Sabot!

[Whiterabbit]

heck, if I could shoot my home cast .575 roundballs out of my 20 ga somehow and come up with a load that shot to the same POI at 100 yards as the coppers I would be on cloud 9, let me tell you!

[longbow]

mr_nice_guy228:

What brand of shotshells are you using the 0.690" balls in? I am wondering what the wad petal thickness is.

I ask because I have had no success at all using 0.690" balls in any wads I have tried in my guns. Mostly the petals are too thick and shear but even some that seemed to fit reasonably well did not produce decent accuracy. On the other hand I have gotten very good accuracy from 0.662" RB's, 0.678" RB's and 0.735" RB's ~ the first two obviously in shotcups and the 0.735" RB's loaded naked on a hard card wad column.

Just curious. I started out with 0.690" balls but never got decent accuracy with them.

Not sure why but I prefer these big 'ol round balls to slugs. Must be a genetic defect or something.

Longbow

[Whiterabbit]

I too am curious, as my .575 round balls might do well as a substitute in 5/8 ounce 20 ga shells, might be worth cutting open a few. How do you "crimp" your cut shells? Youtube says use glue, I don't like that idea.

[singleshot]

I'm with you longbow! I shoot a lot of RBs out of my shotguns these days. Just started down the path of building loads for the Lee 0.690" RB, so I'm wondering if I'll have the same results you had. I have a few tricks up my sleeve, so we'll see. Might have been the same ones you tried.

[singleshot]

I too am curious, as my .575 round balls might do well as a substitute in 5/8 ounce 20 ga shells, might be worth cutting open a few. How do you "crimp" your cut shells? Youtube says use glue, I don't like that idea.

I've used Elmer's glue, melted candle wax, hot glue...heck in a pinch one time I even used Liquid Nails and couldn't tell much difference with any of them. Traditionally you'd use an overcard and water glass.

[mr_nice_guy228]

I used the Winchester Universals, I believe the wad is a WAA12. At the time I didn't have a crimper, so I just sealed them with wax real good. Next batch I make I'll roll crimp them and see if they still shoot groups or go to patterns. I didn't use any sort of base under the ball and I have recovered some good looking wads and I have also recovered some with the bases blown but they still shot reasonably well to point of aim. I measured a couple Remingtons cut down and the wads are too thick in those, and I can't remember why I didn't use the Federals, I can pop open a Federal tomorrow and pull it apart and see how the dowel-push-fit works in my new slug gun.
I had bad luck trying to run them through choked guns though, all mine are now cylinder bore. Mod choke was shearing petals, and skeet choke was so-so, not near as accurate as just a cylinder bore.
I'll get back to you guys tomorrow on the Federals, and as soon as I order a box of wads I'm going to see how they do at about 1000 fps with some Titewad and some Clays.

[longbow]

I started out with my Browning BPS with slug and buck barrel with I/C choke and had no luck at all with 0.690" balls in any wad.

Then I went to cylinder bore and things improved with a variety of slugs but not those 0.690" balls. I had one wad that was thin enough to provide a reasonable slip fit but even those shot poorly and petals sheared. The worst of the lot in all my guns are Winchester AA Red ~ thick and soft.

I always use a nitro card wad or two and a scoop of COW under the ball or I find most wads show damage.

I get far better results using small balls that fit well into the shotcups I have (mostly Winchester white, yellow and pink and some Pacific Veralite) or the bore size (over bore size) 0.735" ball. Either will produce 3" to 4" groups to at least 50 yards.

Anyway, point is, I have not found the components that work with 0.690" balls as yet.

I guess this is drifting from Buckshot's issue so...

It depends on what you want to do Buckshot. I like round balls and got some darn good groups using 0.735" balls in a rifled Remington 870.

Personally, I think you are better off using bore size lead than lead in plastic in a rifled gun. Others may disagree but I like a bore size ball or slug.

For smoothbore, I find it easier and faster to load undersize balls in shotcups.

You are right though info is spread out all through these threads and opinions vary.

I was hoping to see more input on the long range slug thread because to me accuracy at 100 yards is proof of a good load. We are still in our infancy there and I have not managed to produce a worthy group at 100 yards yet.

Maybe a collection good slug accuracy loads should be created and stickiefied. Good idea Buckshot.

Longbow

Longbow

[jmort]

Buckshot, the forum has been neglected in regard to stickies. Did you get the 24" ported barrel? A good place to start would be to get some sabots from Ed aka Hubel458 as they take 58 caliber boolit. The Lee Precision Modern Minie .575-470-M would be a good inexpensive way to get started.

[cpileri]

dont forget this one:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...FH-Slug-Tester

C-

[cpileri]

Ill try to look thru them all for "sticky " candidates, to make it easy for any moderator who may want to use this thred as easy sourcing for stickies. Could use some help, though.
C-

[waksupi]

Ill try to look thru them all for "sticky " candidates, to make it wasy for any moderator who may want to use this thred as easy sourcing for stickies. Could use some help, though.
C-

If you are going through them, it might be good to cut and paste the good stuff into a document, then copy and past it into a new topic.

[Whiterabbit]

I've used Elmer's glue, melted candle wax, hot glue...heck in a pinch one time I even used Liquid Nails and couldn't tell much difference with any of them. Traditionally you'd use an overcard and water glass.

Awesome, canning wax would be excellent. Have you done this with 20 ga? Or are you just sharing your experience with 12 ga?

edit: Searched cast boolits some more (over half the 1st page hits on google are cast boolits, how cool is that). Anyways, Blammer apparently says Winchester hulls are about .570-.575 ID on the shotcup.

I'm trying to duplicate Remington 5/8 oz copper solid performance at 100 yards.

I'm thinking find some cheap 20ga shotshells, try cutting the crimp out, and seating a round ball in there (weighs about 5/8 oz) and sealing with canning wax. If that is even needed?

---

If group size is good but POI off, I can dump the powder and start over with bluedot, reseat the wad and round ball.

Sound like a good place for me to start?

[mr_nice_guy228]

Hey Steve, That should work with the 20GA as well. The need of wax depends on how tight or loose fitting they are, or if you just want to seal it. I haven't noticed any difference in waxed and non-waxed as of yet.
It's raining today so I just had time to fire a couple of the Federal bulk 1 1/8oz replaced with a 690 RB, They're flying pretty straight at 30 yards, Hopefully in a day or three I can cast some and get you guys some actual 100 yard group sizes.

The Federal wad is a good bit tighter than the Winchester Universal repacked with a roundball. I measured it at .740-.742 at the equator which I consider a lot safer than these guys swearing by cut-shell slugs where you send the whole hull down the barrel. I've been thinking and maybe a tighter fitting combo is the key to getting good accuracy.
It could also help that the loads are only moving along at about 1200 fps. What are your experiences in accuracy at a given distance with mild vs wild loads?

[Whiterabbit]

well, 25 yard accuracy wouldn't be all that bad (50 yards better). Would be a great 'gallery' load at the indoor range the few times I go. 100 yards would be better.

So they don't necessarily need ot be sealed, huh?

And what about doing it "right"? can the shell be cut RIGHT at the crimp, and a roll crimp tool used after the slug seated?

I'm glad you chimed in nice guy, googling found your posts on another board too. survivalists this-or-that message board.

[mr_nice_guy228]

That's what I have been doing, Cutting behind the crimp, and you have enough case left to roll. I popped the crimps on a couple of them and ironed them out with a piece of wood, and star crimped them again, but that was a lot of work.
The wax sealing is just a good way to hold loose balls in there if you don't recrimp.
I'm going to break out the roll crimper tonight and see if I can get it to crimp my last few roundball loads. Picked up an antique Ideal a while back.
I'll make sure to keep everyone updated on my progress or lack of, and you all can do the same. We'll get all of this figured out eventually.