Star Sizer - FRUSTRATED as all Hellllllll.......

[DHC]

Really good comments from everyone. Thanks.

Here are some of the things I've learned:

* Using While Label's Commercial 160 lube. It takes a bit more heat than their Carnuba Red. I finally managed to hit a 'sweet spot' - BUT - it doesn't last very long. Too many variables in my setup. The biggest variable is the Lyman heater. It just keeps on cranking until unplugged. Once I hit a 'sweet spot' it may work for 15 minutes or so, but then SOMETHING has to be changed - either the lube pressure or (more likely) fiddling with the heater (turning it on or off). The other variable is the amount of lube in the reservoir. Obviously, it is being depleted with each lubed bullet and as cbrick mentioned, there is a difference in viscosity at the top vs the bottom of the reservoir probably owing to a heat gradient.

* Some significant resolution to these variables are available with a different lube heater along with compressed air for the lube reservoir. The remaining variables should be a bit easier to manage once these are stabilized.

* On a sidenote, I learned something (the hard/messy way). At one point I decided to refill the reservoir with lube I melted. I studied the sizer for a brief moment to determine how much to put in the tube, but failed to notice there is a relief hole in the casting just above where the fill line would be. I filled to what I thought was correct and put the spring assembly back in the tube. Application of only a small amount of pressure made it abundantly clear my mistake. I had loaded too much lube and it was higher than the relief hole in the casting. Wet sticky lube spewed half way across the room from the relief hole as the spring applied pressure to the molten lube. It was impressive and disturbing at the same time. Some minutes later my trusty heat gun and rags had resolved the problem and I am now considerably wiser for the experience.

* Finally, I too ordered some different lubes from White Label. I want to see if one of them may be more forgiving in managing the variables necessary to find the Star's 'sweet spot.' I will say - once it is found, it is REALLY nice to be able to pump out a bunch of lubed/sized bullets.

IHTH

[A pause for the COZ]

Yes thats how its suppose to work.
Setting the die up is not a problem. The problem I am having is heat/ Pressure.
I suspect its mainly a issue with the lube in the tube being to cool/hard while the lube in the chamber is to hot/soft.
So I over pressure at 1st to get the lube moving, Once that cold blob moves it over pressures the soft, warm lube in the chamber. Then booop lube all over the nose.
Once every thing gets in balance it works fine. This last run I took a propane torch and heated the tube and got it going.
I think with moving to a softer lube will help me. Then I have my eye on adding air.
Will see. When it works its great, when it dont.... Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

[Oreo]

Perhaps you should turn on the heat a half hour before you start sizing. Go do something else while the whole sizer equalizes then try setting things up.

[birch]

I have a San Diego made .309 and the only way I can the die to run/lube 165gr and larger is to run the boolit base first. I probably had at least 4 hours of head banging before I accidentaly set a boolit in upside down and instead of turning it nose first, I pulled the handle. You will have to adjust your top punch accordingly.

[454PB]

I use BAC, which normally doesn't require any heat, but my shop is cold until the heater catches up. Even then, I rarely have the temperature over 60 degrees. Because of this, I made my own heater for the Star out of an old drip coffee maker hot plate. It's way too much (900 watts), so I built an in line rheostat from an old dimmer switch. I turn it on full blast for about 5 minutes, then dial it down to hold about 100 degrees, determined by used an infrared heat gun and then making some marks on the dimmer switch.

[A pause for the COZ]

Perhaps you should turn on the heat a half hour before you start sizing. Go do something else while the whole sizer equalizes then try setting things up.

Yes I figured that part out.
This last run I turned it on about 2 hours before I started to size.
I will say, That each time I use it. The time it takes to get good results gets smaller. You quit changing things that are not retailed to the problem.

I think were allot of new guys get stuck ( my self included). You see the U tubes showing guys hammering out bullets as slick as can be.
Then you get yours set up and your pulling your hair out and filling a coffee can full of lube globbed bullets or running the same bullet through 20 times before you get some lube on it.

All I can say is thank goodness for this forum. Dont know what we would do if you guys were not here to talk us off the ledge until we figure it out.
I think I have mine 80% figured out. Cant wait to try another run. I need to do some shooting 1st. I lubed a whole bunch last time.

[HATCH]

Keep in mind that sometimes you still pull your hair out.

Example...
I run a automated star so it uses a air cylinder to operate the ram.
Sunday night I sized up about 1K 32/20 boolits.
Everything worked great.
So Last night I went out there. I turned on the heater. Waited the 30 mins like I did the night before and I started sizing.
Problem is that now a boolit will get stuck in the die (operated automatic). I have to basically size a already sized boolit every ten rounds in order for it to work right.
I didn't have that problem the night before...

[trixter]

I have to basically size a already sized boolit every ten rounds in order for it to work right.
I didn't have that problem the night before...

My system is all manual and I do this all of the time, other wise the machine lets me know how unhappy it is by trying to seize up and squeaking a lot. My machine is quite old and was very abused before I got it on loan from a friend. I have replaced a lot of parts on it to get it as good as it is. I am thinking I probably need to step up and get a new die and punch. but it does what I need it to and is working fine at this point.

[DHC]

And Here we go again . . .

Things were going well with the earlier 45 bullets and then a switch over to some 9mm bullets. Then, when switching back to 45, I again ran into problems. Sooooooo . . . I'd appreciate review of my process. First up is the die. I am attaching a photo that shows how I've plugged the holes and those left open to provide lube. The photo also shows the measurement from the top of the bullet base to the top of the die while the bullet lube groove is aligned with the lube hole.

Does all look OK so far??

[runfiveslittlegirl]

just turn the heat down a little.
you can rig a dimmer switch in-line to adjust the power to the heater base.

[DHC]

just turn the heat down a little.
you can rig a dimmer switch in-line to adjust the power to the heater base.

I tried that - or, at least, I tried making adjustments by switching the heater on/off as I thought was needed. Unfortunately, I was chasing my tail trying to find the right balance. That is why I decided to go back to basics and ask about the die and lube holes - as a starter. Do you configure your die in a similar way?

[VHoward]

Go to Harbor Freight and get a router speed control. http://www.harborfreight.com/catalog...+speed+control It is $20 and will do what everybody is telling you to do. You can regulate the heat better with that than plugging and unplugging it constantly.

As for the die. Use the middle row of holes and plug the others, set the bullet punch depth accordingly and go from there.

[6bg6ga]

After reading this thread I've seen answers like tumble lube them and or pan lube them. Did the poster say they wanted to tumble or pan lube them? I don't think so. The thread starter clearly mentioned that they have a Star sizer so why on Gods earth would they want to take a step backwards?
Using a Star/Magma or Ballisti-cast isn't rocket science. You warm the lube if needed. Too liquid? Turn down the heat. Not filling the groves? Turn up the pressure and or heat and or both. My Magma and star run at about 35lbs with a 50/50 lube. The Ballisti-cast liked 50-60 psi with ref lube.

Its very simple to adjust both the temp and the pressure for the given lube and then record the results. I tried to start a thread and have people record the lube they were using, the temp, and the pressure to address this vary problem. Humm I guess it made no sense thus numerous threads like this one.

My suggestion is this.... someone other than me start a thread in which the lube, pressure, and temp could be recorded and threads like this wouldn't be necessary because already recorded information could be used.

[6bg6ga]

Just for the heck of it... 50/50 lube NRA formula 72degrees, 35lbs pressure Star/magma

Ballisti-cast MArk VI Ballisti-cast Red lube 106 degrees 55lbs pressure

[DHC]

After reading this thread I've seen answers like tumble lube them and or pan lube them. Did the poster say they wanted to tumble or pan lube them? I don't think so. The thread starter clearly mentioned that they have a Star sizer so why on Gods earth would they want to take a step backwards?
Using a Star/Magma or Ballisti-cast isn't rocket science. You warm the lube if needed. Too liquid? Turn down the heat. Not filling the groves? Turn up the pressure and or heat and or both. My Magma and star run at about 35lbs with a 50/50 lube. The Ballisti-cast liked 50-60 psi with ref lube.

Its very simple to adjust both the temp and the pressure for the given lube and then record the results. I tried to start a thread and have people record the lube they were using, the temp, and the pressure to address this vary problem. Humm I guess it made no sense thus numerous threads like this one.

My suggestion is this.... someone other than me start a thread in which the lube, pressure, and temp could be recorded and threads like this wouldn't be necessary because already recorded information could be used.

I like the idea of recording other's experiences so that we might all gain from that information.

You mention some of the symptoms such as the lube being "too liquid," and that is another thing that has proved frustrating. How do I know when the lube is too liquid? Does the fact that some lube is finding its way to the nose of the bullet while still filling the lube groove indicate too much heat? I would be really interested in seeing some sort of diagnosis and troubleshooting guidance addressing the most common problems, if one could be produced.

Thanks to all for the comments. Keep em coming as I am still struggling with this.

[cbrick]

That is why I decided to go back to basics and ask about the die and lube holes - as a starter. Do you configure your die in a similar way?

Yes except I don't use the calipers but doing so is fine. I line up the lube holes with the lube groove as you did but then just use the flat punch against the boolit base to see how far the punch enters the die on lube pump compression, then install die & adjust punch as determined. In other words, same difference as your doing.

Rick

After reading this thread I've seen answers like tumble lube them and or pan lube them. Did the poster say they wanted to tumble or pan lube them? I don't think so. The thread starter clearly mentioned that they have a Star sizer so why on Gods earth would they want to take a step backwards?

Well, some people are perfectly happy with their method having started casting in 1956 and have seen no reason since then to change anything & can't understand why you would want to do it any differently.

Rick

[cbrick]

I like the idea of recording other's experiences so that we might all gain from that information.

You mention some of the symptoms such as the lube being "too liquid," and that is another thing that has proved frustrating. How do I know when the lube is too liquid? Does the fact that some lube is finding its way to the nose of the bullet while still filling the lube groove indicate too much heat? Thanks to all for the comments. Keep em coming as I am still struggling with this.

If the lube is liquid at all it is way too liquid (hot) and will run all over as opposed to "flow" under pressure into the lube grooves. You only want to soften it some by being "warm" so that it will flow both easier and more uniformly. A specific chart of lube temps/pressure would be fairly difficult to produce accurately because of variables such as how long for the lube to reach a "good" temp with various room temps and a big factor is the actual temp of the boolits you are trying to lube.

Lube on the nose "could" be because of too much heat but is probably because of too much pressure and too much heat with emphasis on too much pressure for the lube temp.

It's not rocket science but there is a learning curve, it does get a whole bunch easier with experience.

Rick

[kayak1]

For Carnuba Red when I had the pid thermocouple clamped to the star I found 100F to be correct. Now that I have drilled and tapped the base for a new thermocouple 100F didn't work. I had to bump the temp up to 120F.

[BD]

There's another adjustment on the Star that is often overlooked
It's the bolt that the link acts upon to operate the pump at the
Bottom of the stroke. Back it out to get more lube pumped, tighten
It in for less.
BD

[runfiverun]

that little bolt hanging up can let a little pressure push some lube out the holes too.
but generally it is like rick pointed out too much heat for the pressure being used.

I set mine up with too little heat and let the heater cycle a couple of times this gets everything up to operating temp.
I run with my pressures a tick high to offset the lower temp.

many of the lubes I make myself take just enough heat to get them flowing and then I turn off the heater and they continue pumping until I run out of lube.