New Starline 38 spl brass - a couple ? on resizing and lube

[bedbugbilly]

A week or so ago, I posted a query in regards to 38 spl brass - and I sure appreciate the kind responses in regards to it. I'm new to reloading - just got my equipment in the mail today. Before I get started . . . a couple of "noob" questions on sizing new Starline brass.

I have 500 new brass cases. On my previous post, it was mentioned that when the new brass is sized to be sure to lube the inside throat of the case as Starline washes their brass after production and there is no left over lube in the neck.

I've read the sticky on lubes . . . and because I'd like to do it "right" (and not stick a case in the die) I have a question on the lube and such.

I have a tube of the Lee sizing lube . . . I know there are probably cheaper/better "homemade" varieties but it was cheap and I thought I'd pick it up just in case I needed it.

I have heard of some folks using saddle soap - I do leather work so have plenty of it on hand. If I wet a sponge and work some of it in to the sponge, roll the outside of the case over the sponge - will this work for lubing the outside of the case . . . or should I go another route? Would it be better to put straight saddle soap on my thumb and forefinger and roll the casing between them before inserting it in the shell holder?

For lubing the inside of the throat prior to sizing . . . how? Take a Q tip, get the lube on it and just do a quick swab around the inside of the throat?

I'm thinking that if saddle soap will work - it should come off O.K. if I wash the brass after sizing (being water soluble)?

But . . . would this cause a problem with the inside of the die or the throat sizing plunger? Would it make a case more likely to get stuck over another method?

I'm 60, of the old school where "if one nail holds, two will hold better". So just how much sizing lube on and in the case is enough. I'm sure that after I've done it a few times it will be "old hat" but I'd like to prevent the problem of a case stuck on the inside of the die.

For lube in my Cap and Ball revolvers, I mix a pound of Crisco with a beeswax toilet ring - it's stiff but not too stiff. I could easily use this as well on the thumb and forefinger but being greasy like it is, I'm not sure how to clean the cases afterwards to get it off and out of the throat. I'm assuming that the inside of the case wants to be clean and the lube on the bullet lubricates as it is seated. Is this correct? (so that if there were any lube left on the inside of the case when the slug is seated, it wouldn't push it in to the cavity and spoil the powder? Or am I making too much out of all of this?

Thanks for helping me out on this. I really appreciate your suggestions and comments.

[r1kk1]

I use a Q-tip and case lube. Not every case but maybe every 5th or so. Another way is a quick 15 minute tumble with car wax and media.

Take care

r1kk1

[Love Life]

Spray with one shot, size, tumble, done.

[Zymurgy50]

Are your dies Carbide or steel?
no lube required for carbide, but it does help with the amount of force required to size. Steel dies will require lube to keep from getting a stuck case.
Personally I would get a case lube pad and whatever case lube your LGS has in stock (should be less than $20 for both). Or try the Imperial sizing wax, one tub will lube tens of thousands of cases.
For the case neck the first time around dip the case in some powdered graphite or mica and have at it.

[Huntducks]

if that brass fits in your cyl why size it, it's brand new, no lube inside on straight walled cases just put a little bell inside the mouth all will work fine

[44Vaquero]

You are confusing reloading rifle brass and pistol brass, two different animals. No lube is need for pistol calibers if you are using carbide dies. I do lube the exterior of my .44 magnum's just to making sizing easier even though I am using carbide dies.

The reason rifle calibers require inside neck lubrication is due to the fact that the neck expander is located on the de-capping rod in the sizing die.

[bedbugbilly]

I have the Lee carbide dies.

The reason I asked about the lubricating is in my thread that I posted in regards to new and used brass, one individual who responded that new Starline brass had to be lubricated in the neck as their mfg. process removed any lube on the inside of the throat - at least that's how I interpreted it.

In looking at the description of the Starline 38 spl. (I went to the Midway site to look it up) this is what is posted in the description.


"Preparation:
Due to the manufacturing process and/or shipping, case mouths may not be perfectly round. To ensure a round case mouth, cases must be sized (or have the expander ball of the sizing die run through case neck) and deburred/Chamfered prior to loading." (source: Midway online catalog)

Since it can be "out of round" (new, unused casing) . . does it need to be put in the sizing die and belled to make sure it is "in round" and then debarred/chamfered? And am I misunderstanding that the belling is done in the sizing die as a one step process?

I know that your are not supposed to need lube in a carbide die but I read posts where even in pistol cases some use some lube just to make sure it doesn't get stuck. So, is it a good thing to do on any case, regardless of rifle or pistol?

Or . . . if the brass is a little out of round, will putting it in the bullet seating die and seating the bullet in the case take care of the "out of round" once the bullet is seated since the 38 is a straight sided case?

[44Vaquero]

BBB,

In a pistol die set case mouth expansion referred to as belling in some case takes place in the 2nd step after sizing. In a rifle die set the case mouth is uniformed during the sizing process (1st step) by the expander button located on the de-capping rod.

Midways catalog explanation is somewhat generic and references both rifle and pistols cases in one swing! I hate when they use canned responses.

Run your Lee carbide dies as instructed by Lee and don't worry you will not stick a case or have any out of round case mouths. Lube is not required inside or outside of the case in this situation.

[HATCH]

On new starline 45 colt brass it helps for me to add a little lube to the cases when I size them for the very first time.
This is using Carbide sizing dies and brand new brass.

If I don't lube them then my arm will get sore after a couple hundred.

[44Vaquero]

Hatch, one thing I have noticed is my Hornady T.I.N. sizing dies require less effort then any of their plain carbide counterparts from other manufactures!

I also lube the outside off my .44 mag's it makes the progressive run smoother for sure!

[bedbugbilly]

44Vaquero - thanks - appreciate your thoughts and suggestions. Before I do something, I have a tendency to "over think" the process and I just didn't want to start out on the wrong foot with the 38 spl Starline brass. I appreciate you "straightening out" my thinking on it. Just starting out in reloading and being an "old guy" - I was thinking that the 38 spl case should be pretty simple and straight forward - then I read what I quoted in regards to the Starline brass and what was suggested in regards to it when I posted on my query in regards to utilizing used casings and new brass - thanks for putting my mind at ease that it isn't going to be as hard a process as I was trying to make it. I appreciate that "reinforcement"!

[44Vaquero]

Not a problem BBB!

When anyone first starts reloading they are inundated with tons of information and some of it may be conflicting. The 38 special is a very straight forward cartridge to begin reloading and not too hard on the pocket book either.

Since you are a Muzzle Loader here is some reloading porn for you! My Remington 1858 w/Kirst .45 ACP conversion installed.

[220swiftfn]

Hey Bedbugbilly, welcome aboard!!! As others have mentioned, a case lube *on the outside* of the case makes things smoother with carbide, but isn't necessary (as a leather worker, I'm sure you probably have my favorite case lube in your house, Bag Balm and a little goes a looooooong way.) Just enough to get your thumb and forefinger "greasy" will be enough to swipe 20 cases or so.... As to the Starline "warning", as you found out, their cases are indeed squeeky clean when you get them, and tend to be grabby on the bell/flaring die which wreaks havok if you're charging the case on press (makes for fluctuating powder charges.) One way around this is to toss the cases into a walnut or corncob tumbler for 15-30 mins. Just the media dust left is enough to solve the problem.... This also happens if you use the stainless steel wet tumblers, the cases get CLEAN!!!!



Dan