Loading Data 180 grn casr in 6.5 Jap and 6.5 Swed

[Muskyhunter1]

Picked up a Lee 180 grn GC mold for my 6.5 Jap and a 6.5 Swed. Molded and sized a punch of slugs at .266 and then realized I can't find any data for a 170 grain slug. Does anyone have any or can direct me to any data with Unique/Hi Skor 700X, etc.

i am just looking for something to shoot holes in paper, ring the gong and hit cans.

Thanks in advance,

Musky

[Dutchman]

For a time I named my jpg files for what data was used:

caliber bullet powder wgt. type
65x55-170-13-8-2400a.JPG
170 gr Lee .267" 13.8 grs 2400

50 yds m/38 Carl Gustaf. These were the original Lee single cavity molds. Current 2 cav from MidSouth suck canal water and are, IMO, useless with the Swede. Too big. Don't think I've used Unique or 700X with this bullet though I have used both with Lyman 266673 and 266469 with 266473 being the superior cast bullet I've shot so far.



MidSouth Cruise Missile mold current production flies like a flock of birds... every which way but straight. Notice 3 of them had nose dipped in Lee Liquid Alox to see if that made things better. It did but only 3 out of 5 rds. One missed the target completely @ 50 yds. Wasn't the shooter or the rifle.

You will get more satisfaction from the current Lee mold by throwing it out in the street and watching a truck run over it.



Lyman 266673 13.5 grs 2400 @ 50 yds. Five shots. Why waste time with anything else?

[Muskyhunter1]

Dutchman,

Sound like i got one of those double cavity flyers. Oh well. I got it, molded some bullets with it and will go from there I guess and try it. Looks like you 13.8 grains of 2400 is the way to go. In the meantime I guess I had better shop for a new mold.

Some good shoot there.

I hate to ask but has anybody even tried that bullet in the 6.5 Jap?

Thanks

[45 2.1]

I hate to ask but has anybody even tried that bullet in the 6.5 Jap?

The original single cavity boolit mold from the first Lee GB, that casts to specification, has been tried in the 6.5 Swede, 6.5 M-S, 6.5 Carcano and 6.5 Japanese. When loaded properly it has shot well in all of them. Please note this caliber (6.5mm) in the military cartridges are trying for most reloaders, especially with the heavier weight cast options available. The current MidSouth offering does not meet the original specs as outlined by me, but there is a GB in the Active GB section that does.

[Muskyhunter1]

I am stuck with this mold now and before I throw it under a truck I need to try to load some rounds. Anybody have some light data for the 6.5 Jap they can give me to try - please?

[WILCO]

Picked up a Lee 180 grn GC mold for my 6.5 Jap and a 6.5 Swed. Molded and sized a punch of slugs at .266 and then realized I can't find any data for a 170 grain slug.

I'm confused. What mold do you have exactly?

[swheeler]

Gotta be the cruse missle 170 gr

[curator]

Try Dutchman's load of 13.8 grains of 2400. Actually you might want to try several variations from 12 up to about 16 grains and see which shoots the best. I too experimented with the group buy "cruise missile" .268/170 and found it is a bit too long to stabilize in the Swede's 1 in 7.5 inch twist and even worse in my Jap's 1 in 8.5" twist. However I did have fun shooting it and at 50 yards I had acceptable accuracy. That loooong boolit will go through a lot of water-filled milk jugs! After first trying 8, then 10, then 12, I ran out of jugs before I captured a slug. Too bad it won't shoot accurately at longer distances it would probably be pretty effective for hunting thin-skinned game animals

[Skunkworks]

Try Dutchman's load of 13.8 grains of 2400. Actually you might want to try several variations from 12 up to about 16 grains and see which shoots the best. I too experimented with the group buy "cruise missile" .268/170 and found it is a bit too long to stabilize in the Swede's 1 in 7.5 inch twist and even worse in my Jap's 1 in 8.5" twist. However I did have fun shooting it and at 50 yards I had acceptable accuracy. That loooong boolit will go through a lot of water-filled milk jugs! After first trying 8, then 10, then 12, I ran out of jugs before I captured a slug. Too bad it won't shoot accurately at longer distances it would probably be pretty effective for hunting thin-skinned game animals

Looking at Midsouths page the boolit measures 1.25" long
That will stabilise in a 1:10" twist barrel. The original 96 battel is stated as 1:7.8"

At least according to the calculators i have tried.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...,d.bGE&cad=rja

Maybe something else was amiss?

[swheeler]

My calculator also shows it will stabilise in a 1:10 twist AT 2500 fps, but that ain't goin' to happen

[45 2.1]

The cruise missile could be shot at 2500 fps and be stable and accurate in a 1:10 twist, but that ain't going to be in the 6.5 Swede or Jap because it's outside of the loading ranges for either cartridge..... the 264 Mag would be a candidate though. Actually, the 6.5mm with heavier cast boolits is a caliber for those that have mastered everything else. It requires a different technique than is used for jacketed or low velocity cast. Same thing as loading for other powder types. Try it your way and you'll likely fail.

[blixen]

Muskie, I appreciate your efforts. These threads are getting me prepared to take on my Swede. Sorry about the frustration.

[jonk]

The thing that bothers me here is, apparently someone worked up a great load for 6.5 Swede, and somehow got in a snit about safety and got it deleted, so no one else can try it.

I've only ever had miserable results with this bullet in anything I've tried it in, I think it's just too long. My opinion. I do think for a longer mag cartridge with good lube and hard lead it would be the bee's knees.

[curator]

Skunkworks:

Re-calculate with 1600 fps which is a reasonable expectation with cast boolits. Pushing the cast lead boolit past 1800 fps in the fast twist Swede is a recipe for fliers and key-holes as the soft alloy can't stand the centrifugal forces.

[Buckshot]

The 132gr 6.5mm Kurtz Group buy, and the "Oldfeller" cruise missile (original single cavity). They are both seated to engrave in my M96 Swede. Gotta say the original GB Oldfeller fits to a 'T'. However I can easily drive the lighter slug to 1800 fps without much effort at all. But that long 170gr slug will shoot though a telephone pole lengthwise at a modest velocity

...............Buckshot

[Skunkworks]

Skunkworks:

Re-calculate with 1600 fps which is a reasonable expectation with cast boolits. Pushing the cast lead boolit past 1800 fps in the fast twist Swede is a recipe for fliers and key-holes as the soft alloy can't stand the centrifugal forces.

[45 2.1]

The thing that bothers me here is, apparently someone worked up a great load for 6.5 Swede, and somehow got in a snit about safety and got it deleted, so no one else can try it.

The 6.5 Swede elicits a lot of heartburn among "staff" here. We also have some other worthies that love to dump on it. The thread your looking for is in the "Military Rifles" forum and is titled "Milk Jug 300 Yard 6.5 Swede". Those directions will enable you to learn a loading technique which will do the things others say is impossible with this cartridge, if you persevere and follow them all to the end (it will take a good while too). You need a cruise missile mold cut to the original dimensions (there is a GB for one now). This boolit has been taken to the 6.5 Swede's cartridge/rifle limits by a couple of us, but due to the atmosphere here about these things, you won't hear about that.

[junkbug]

Thank you for the link, 45 2.1 . I also am interested in this. I have a mid-south single cavity, which is probably not the same, but I will give it a go in my CZ550 FS sometime soon.

Just as an aside, why is it so difficult to find a 6.5mm mold that is designed to cast less than 140 grains. A 115 grain mold would seem to have a lot of utility for reduced loads and small game.

[Skunkworks]

Thank you for the link, 45 2.1 . I also am interested in this. I have a mid-south single cavity, which is probably not the same, but I will give it a go in my CZ550 FS sometime soon.

Just as an aside, why is it so difficult to find a 6.5mm mold that is designed to cast less than 140 grains. A 115 grain mold would seem to have a lot of utility for reduced loads and small game.

I know why 139grains is a limit in Europe (and 156grains)
In the mid 50's the Swedish gobberment realisied that there was umpteen rifles in Sweden that they didnt have any control of.
Many (over 100,000) Husky's in 12.7x44R.
So to make a long story short they made arbitrary energy numbers based on the Swedish 6.5x55 that would render the BP loaded firearms obselete with a pen stroke.
Now all old rifles had to be turned in and folks had to buy nre rifles that the gobberment knew of and where they went.

Oh the rules:
More than 9gram~139grains bullet weight = E100 2700joule~2000fps
More than 10gram~156grains bullet weight = E100 2000joule~1481fps

[45 2.1]

Thank you for the link, 45 2.1 . I also am interested in this. I have a mid-south single cavity, which is probably not the same, but I will give it a go in my CZ550 FS sometime soon.

Just as an aside, why is it so difficult to find a 6.5mm mold that is designed to cast less than 140 grains. A 115 grain mold would seem to have a lot of utility for reduced loads and small game.

The cruise missile was designed for the military 6.5mm cartridges (specifically the Swedes, but all seem to be carbon copies of each other in the throat area).... they all load about the same with this boolit. The throat is loonnnggg in these rifles. Check out Buckshot's picture and note that the bearing body of both boolits is about the same. A boolit weighing in at 129 gr. barely has enough body to fill the throat up in these military firearms. Commercial rifles usually have normal small diameter short throats. What your CZ550 throat length and diameter is like I have no idea....... seat a bullet backward to find out.