Prior to 1963 the Rem 870 and the Win mod 12 sold for about the same price. No doubt about this,it cost more to make the Mod 12 than the 870. The mod 12 used machined parts where the 870 was using stamped parts. Despite this,they were priced about the same and were fairly equal in sales. Had Winchester increased their price it would have ruined them(BTW same same with the Win mod 70 and the Rem 700). So Win cheapened their product and moved production to Japan. In my books the 870 does not compare with the Mod 12------but what do I know?,the 870 is probably most popular pump shotgun ever. How do you compare them?