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Thread: simple Hi-Tek coating

  1. #14821
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jatz357 View Post
    Aqualube is great stuff, has many uses. Non contaminating is a big plus. It can be applied to a surface and adhesive tape will stick but the surface is slick, very interesting material. One of my sizers was used by a commercial caster and we later swapped it with a revised design machine. When we brought the sizer back I noticed it was very slippery and greasy feeling, coated with what appeared to be a silicone based product. I spent a lot of time cleaning to remove that product for the fear of silicone contamination with other products and paints we use. The machine still feels greasy and adhesive tape has trouble sticking to the painted surfaces. Still concerned about shop contamination. Don't have that problem with Aqualube.
    As you are aware, all Silicone lubricants are a plague on society. They contaminate and are spread everywhere by simple transfer by touching surfaces that has Silicone on them.
    It is almost impossible got get rid of it from a contaminated area.
    In Automotive industry, if you try to enter any premises after you had visited any other site where Silicones were used, they may put you against a wall and shoot you. Not really, but that is how drastically seriously this is being taken as Silicone really messes up any painting and surfaces and cant be removed, and it is spread like crazy.

  2. #14822
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    Well I guess Iím headed back to the drawing board again. Just got a new toy and loaded up some bullets Iíve had sitting a while. I had thought they had passed all the test back when I made them but maybe not. It looks like they are failing the smash test now.

    I had a little leading after about 100 rounds and so I cleaned the barrel completely and pushed a few bullets through to check the diameter. I saw that the coating was rubbing off on two of the riflings. So I tried the smash test and sure enough I had small flakes coming off.

    My lead is kind of unknown as it is a mixture of coww and soft lead with tin and antimony added at a 2% 5% rate. So not sure which ingots were in the pot when these were cast but the lead is at least about 12 bh. I am getting about 950 fps average with the load developed.

    Since I have unknown lead, I might try some Muratic acid on a few and coat and see if I can pass the smash test.

    I seem to get excited about shooting for a while, run into a leading issue, try to fix it and before everything gets ironed out I have something else that comes up and I forget about the problem until next time. I may just get it figured out this time before giving up. The leading isnít that bad and a good hour after shooting itís all gone again but it would be nice to get it down to a quick wipe down the barrel cleaning like the .45.Click image for larger version. 

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  3. #14823
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  4. #14824
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    Quote Originally Posted by flybyjohn View Post
    Well I guess Iím headed back to the drawing board again. Just got a new toy and loaded up some bullets Iíve had sitting a while. I had thought they had passed all the test back when I made them but maybe not. It looks like they are failing the smash test now.

    I had a little leading after about 100 rounds and so I cleaned the barrel completely and pushed a few bullets through to check the diameter. I saw that the coating was rubbing off on two of the riflings. So I tried the smash test and sure enough I had small flakes coming off.

    My lead is kind of unknown as it is a mixture of coww and soft lead with tin and antimony added at a 2% 5% rate. So not sure which ingots were in the pot when these were cast but the lead is at least about 12 bh. I am getting about 950 fps average with the load developed.

    Since I have unknown lead, I might try some Muratic acid on a few and coat and see if I can pass the smash test.

    I seem to get excited about shooting for a while, run into a leading issue, try to fix it and before everything gets ironed out I have something else that comes up and I forget about the problem until next time. I may just get it figured out this time before giving up. The leading isnít that bad and a good hour after shooting itís all gone again but it would be nice to get it down to a quick wipe down the barrel cleaning like the .45.Click image for larger version. 

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    flybyjohn
    thanks for posting. Just a couple of questions on your findings.... how long ago did you do that coating? The reason I ask, is that with some alloys that are from unknown compositions, can cause such reactions of crumbling or flaking from alloy with time. As you may be suspecting, there seems to be a reaction taking place between coating and alloy. Generally, it could be a sort of Oxidation taking place on surface of alloy, causing coating to lift. If coating had previously passed all tests, it can be deduced that all was well. If you have some of the original uncoated casts from that alloy, it would be interesting to see what the surfaces look like, then, acid treat them and do a comparison... If there was some surface contaminant on uncoated alloy, the acid treatment should change surface appearance. Before and after acid treatment, photos of surfaces should provide some answers. After acid treatment, coat some, (not all) and have a look at stability afterwards with storage of both coated and uncoated casts. It would be interesting to learn if the acid treatment had stopped formation of surface oxidation process or not... I suspect that it will be OK.

    I refer to making fishing sinkers from mixed alloy that was made from all sorts of scrap. After casting, product looked absolutely shiny and smooth. these were stored/stockpiled on a steel shelf in my shed. When I went to get some to go fishing, all of them, to various levels, had a white powdery growth/formation on the alloy surface. Some were worse than others in same pile as this powdery formation became more crystalline on some. I washed them with diluted Hydrochloric acid, which removed the scale, and these had no more reoccurrences of this powdery film formation. I am suspecting Zinc and possibly Magnesium, and or Cadmium as primary contaminants in alloy, but there could be other metals as well. Very interested in your results. please post it and photos if possible.

  5. #14825
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    I'd say the mystery metal is letting you down.
    I have some 230gn RN .452 that were cast and coated 8 years ago.
    from 2.6.92 alloy.

    Fired them a few weeks ago and no issues...
    Hooroo.
    Regards, Trevor.
    Australia

  6. #14826
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    It’s been about 1.5-2 years since I cast and coated these. I cast some 10 mm during the same session and they don’t look oxidized yet. I will throw them in some muratic acid for a while and see what I get. I smashed a few more 9 mm from the same casting and coating session and they didn’t seem to lose as much coating as the first ones I smashed. They don’t seem to have lost any coating on the hammer or the concrete surface that they smashed on. They lost the coating where the bullet squished and folded. They were getting pretty hard. It took 3-4 hits with a 14 oz hammer to get them to this point. One hit barely squished the nose.

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  7. #14827
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    Quote Originally Posted by flybyjohn View Post
    It’s been about 1.5-2 years since I cast and coated these. I cast some 10 mm during the same session and they don’t look oxidized yet. I will throw them in some muratic acid for a while and see what I get. I smashed a few more 9 mm from the same casting and coating session and they didn’t seem to lose as much coating as the first ones I smashed. They don’t seem to have lost any coating on the hammer or the concrete surface that they smashed on. They lost the coating where the bullet squished and folded. They were getting pretty hard. It took 3-4 hits with a 14 oz hammer to get them to this point. One hit barely squished the nose.

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    Just a couple of things...
    I have forgotten to ask,, what was the increase in thickness of casts after coating them? How many coats were used? From some of the photos, it seems to give the impression that coatings are quite thick. I am wondering if coating thickness may have been a contributing factor for the cracking and splintering. Two coats usually is about 1.5 thou. and that easily passes smash tests even after a long time. Just curious...
    Last edited by HI-TEK; 03-02-2024 at 11:44 PM.

  8. #14828
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    I think it was 3 thin coats. You could still see the lead after first coat and two more coats of the same thickness. Some of the sized bullets you can see some lead through the coating like it is slightly transparent.

    I will cast some more up in the next few days and try just two thin coats.

    9mm is the only caliber I ever have problems with leading. 40 ,10,and45 never have any leading problems with coating applied same process.
    Last edited by flybyjohn; 03-03-2024 at 01:42 AM.

  9. #14829
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    Quote Originally Posted by flybyjohn View Post
    I think it was 3 thin coats. You could still see the lead after first coat and two more coats of the same thickness. Some of the sized bullets you can see some lead through the coating like it is slightly transparent.

    I will cast some more up in the next few days and try just two thin coats.

    9mm is the only caliber I ever have problems with leading. 40 ,10,and45 never have any leading problems with coating applied same process.

    If you are using same alloy, after casting, please acid treat before coating and after you had dried it well after acid bath.
    I am also thinking that if you only have problems with to 9mm and all other calibers are OK, I am continuing to suspect your alloy is not adequate for that use.
    Depending on the coating selected, some cover better with a single coat than another color will. I am not surprised that using one coat you may see the alloy through a thin first coat.
    The Black K-15 coats and covers alloy extremely well with first coat using a very thin coating. It is almost impossible to see alloy after first coat. The color you are using on failed casts are appearing to be the Gold 1035. It is metallic in appearance and will highlight the alloy with the one coating film.

  10. #14830
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    HI-TEK I found a new use for your Aqualube today works fantastic on the sizer ring on a 12 gauge reloading press. You can really tell the difference in effort to size the steel headed cartridges

  11. #14831
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    Quote Originally Posted by smlekid View Post
    HI-TEK I found a new use for your Aqualube today works fantastic on the sizer ring on a 12 gauge reloading press. You can really tell the difference in effort to size the steel headed cartridges
    That is great. How did you think about that use? The best thing with Aqualube is that it is a dry non contaminating lubricant, and works well with smallest film. I would love to see what you did as I am not familiar with shotgun loading presses. Never had the opportunity to see one in action. I dont know if you saw the test results done quite a while ago, when the coatings and Aqualube were used and the pressure force needed to push through with sizing. Results were amazing as with coating and Aqualubed casts needed 50% less force to push through sizer. The guy doing the testing plotted the pressures to do comparisons. He did quite a few, and what became obvious is that the force pressure required became very even and consistent. This was rationalized as being very good for reproducible accuracy, as all finished sized casts had almost exactly same force required to push through.

  12. #14832
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    Well I was thinking if it worked for sizing boolits maybe it would help with sizing 12g cases. Most cases these days use a brass or Nickel coated steel case head (the premium cases still use real brass and require very little effort to size). The sizing die is just a hardened steel ring the swages the case head back to size on my press the ring can be unscrewed. I removed it thinking I might be able to put a bit if a chamfer on it to help align the cartridge. I grabbed the aqualube and a cotton bud used it straight out if the bottle let it dry and well it fixed the issue I had
    It's a bit hard to see in the picture but the case on the left was done before using the Aqualube the right hand side is after. The sizing ring I just put the Aqualube on the shiny part this has probably done around 200 cases

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    Last edited by smlekid; 03-31-2024 at 08:33 AM.

  13. #14833
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    Quote Originally Posted by smlekid View Post
    Well I was thinking if it worked for sizing boolits maybe it would help with sizing 12g cases. Most cases these days use a brass or Nickel coated steel case head (the premium cases still use real brass and require very little effort to size). The sizing die is just a hardened steel ring the swages the case head back to size on my press the ring can be unscrewed. I removed it thinking I might be able to put a bit if a chamfer on it to help align the cartridge. I grabbed the aqualube and a cotton bud used it straight out if the bottle let it dry and well it fixed the issue I had
    It's a bit hard to see in the picture but the case on the right was done before using the Aqualube the right hand side is after. The sizing ring I just put the Aqualube on the shiny part this has probably done around 200 cases

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    That is pretty clever thinking.
    In the past I used to get a lot of questions about the effects it has with Powder load, same with the cured coating. Once these products are used dried and or baked, they have no reactivity , especially with Aqualube, the dry film will not react to any other cleaner, or synthetics or chemicals or powder.

  14. #14834
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    Quote Originally Posted by smlekid View Post
    Well I was thinking if it worked for sizing boolits maybe it would help with sizing 12g cases. Most cases these days use a brass or Nickel coated steel case head (the premium cases still use real brass and require very little effort to size). The sizing die is just a hardened steel ring the swages the case head back to size on my press the ring can be unscrewed. I removed it thinking I might be able to put a bit if a chamfer on it to help align the cartridge. I grabbed the aqualube and a cotton bud used it straight out if the bottle let it dry and well it fixed the issue I had
    It's a bit hard to see in the picture but the case on the left was done before using the Aqualube the right hand side is after. The sizing ring I just put the Aqualube on the shiny part this has probably done around 200 cases

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    I've been doing this for years with my 12ga loads. Just never thought to mention it.
    The Lee sizing ring. I now is a MEC collet Sizer press.
    Hooroo.
    Regards, Trevor.
    Australia

  15. #14835
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    Joe
    There is a mention of your coating in the Hodgdon 2024 Annual Manual Reloading page 32. Article contains range data. Which was, of course , of interest to me.
    While I work at it, it is by God's grace that it happens. So it is best I ask him what, how and when before I start..

  16. #14836
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    I tried the Aqualube on my squeaking door hinge on my pickup. Nothing I have tried has lasted over a day or two. Two weeks after using the Aqualube and still no squeaking. I wish there was some way to get information out to the world how good this stuff really is.

  17. #14837
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avenger442 View Post
    Joe
    There is a mention of your coating in the Hodgdon 2024 Annual Manual Reloading page 32. Article contains range data. Which was, of course , of interest to me.
    Thanks Avenger
    I cant get to that mention. Do you have a copy or can you please post the relevant page and details?
    Thanks much

  18. #14838
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDriller View Post
    I tried the Aqualube on my squeaking door hinge on my pickup. Nothing I have tried has lasted over a day or two. Two weeks after using the Aqualube and still no squeaking. I wish there was some way to get information out to the world how good this stuff really is.
    Thank you for posting your finding on Aqualube.
    The problem we have is, that even if everyone knew that the stuff works, ( being able to dry lubricating virtually any two surfaces) it is a difficult marketing and distribution barrier. The other considerations is, that so little is required to get maximum results, so selling retail packs becomes a packaging and concentration selection problem.
    The concentrate as supplied, a 50 ml of the concentrate makes about 2.5 to 3.0 liters of ready to use lubricant, possibly more in some other end use applications, and it is difficult for home users to be able to apply and use up such large amount of lubricant on surfaces. Using the concentrate as is , will work well, however the excess residue of product is wasted, as excess is simply wiped off... For years, this product was used in aerosols as a very diluted spray, sold as a dry film spray lubricant. The aerosol was expensive, so retail market was limited. Product has been used as a diluted mixture on Automotive rubber seals on doors to stop squeaking and sticking as well as repelling dirt, but downside is, that residue does leave a whitish film on the rubber surfaces. Many, many years ago, the product was used in car steering columns to stop squeak of metal to plastic as drivers were turning the steering wheel. The plastic bushes were eventually replaced with a self-lubricating plastic that solved the steering squeak. As you indicated, the product is very good but has limitations in retail market.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check