Dipping makes better bullets that a bottom pour pot but why?

[PS Paul]

Best post of the topic. Put a big smile on my face.

Me too!!

[MtGun44]

Wikipedia as a reference source on something that is controversial?


LOL!!!!

Zero accuracy checks on Wikipedia, ANYBODY can write or "correct".

I've done some ladle casting, and the pressure casting aspect helps
fill out, it seems, in my limited experience. However, I do manage to
make some pretty darned good boolits with my bottom pour pots.

Not calling anybody wrong, but seems like 'different strokes'
kind of discussion. Ford is better than Chevy. NO, Chevy is better
than Ford. . . . . No answer in reality.


Bill

[detox]

Taking advice from members here today i casted some verygood boollits using the bottom pour. Fluxing only once with pea size parafin and keeping my melt temp between 650-700 produced some verygood results with only about 5% rejects. I used linotype as my alloy. I am getting better with the bottom pour.

I held my mould about 1/4" from spout then poured leaving a small puddle on top. I also adjusted for faster flow thru spout.

I loosened sprue plate so that it would swing freely and just rest on top of mould. This produce boolits with square bases.

I was fluxing way too much in past sessions resulting in too many dirt specs and cavities.

Lower casting temps of 650-700 resulted in larger diameter boolits. Before hand i was casting around 725-775 resulting in slightly smaller diameter boolits.

I also drain and wash my pot after every session. Water allways comes out looking dark and dirty.

Thanks,

[Ben]

I've been reading this but have not made a comment.

Well, time to change that.

I've seen molds that would not cast a good bullet unless they were under a " pressure pour " situation with a ladle.

I've also seen molds that form whiskers when subjected to this technique.

Many molds do well with bottom pour.

I think it is hard for a right handed person to switch over in life to being left handed.

Likewise, if you've developed successful patterns of casting and those techniques are yielding good results, it isn't likely that someone with a different view is going to persuade you to do it differently.

Which is better than another..... ? ? ?

[TheCelt]

I like my Lee bottom pour!!! Mine Doesn't drip (much) and it's real easy to control the sprue size.

[Texantothecore]

If bottom pour is better, or at least as good, why do all the top notch BPCR shooters use ladle. Maybe you haven't enlightened them. Perhaps one of you could go shoot in a big match and show everyone how it is done.

The most likely physical reason is that the ladle takes from the top of the stack of lead and may have more tin in it than a bottom pour pot that is isn't fluxed frequently.

[10-x]

Each to his own............Been casting BP for 30+ years and only do the ladle for "Old Timey" casting for round ball Black powder.

[detox]

Each to his own............Been casting BP for 30+ years and only do the ladle for "Old Timey" casting for round ball Black powder.

Nothing wrong with that. I just purchase the smaller Lee 5 lb pot for quick ladle casting. I am now convinced that both methods produce good boolits once you learn how.

[sergeant69]

ladle casting is the BEST and ONLY way to cast. why? cause my WAAGE pot doesn't have a bottom hole or a lever to operate said hole on it. so....theres your proof!

[shadowcaster]

I think that when it comes right down to it... To Each His Own! I do way more bottom pour than ladle, but they both peform well for the job intended.

Shad

[Awsar]

had a bottom pour given to me so its all ive ever used and thanks to the great people on this site a few mods to it and it does everything i could ask.
boolit goes bang and hit near where i aim it--all good

p.s boolit more accurate than i am im sure

[cbrick]

The most likely physical reason is that the ladle takes from the top of the stack of lead and may have more tin in it than a bottom pour pot that is isn't fluxed frequently.

Not possible! Tin will not - cannot separate and drift to the top of the pot from a lack of fluxing or stirring or anything else. The only loss of tin will be that which is already at the surface of the melt and in contact with oxygen which will oxidize.

Rick

[Lloyd Smale]

correct answer. Once alloyed with lead it cannot seperate and the lead at the top of your pot is the same as whats at the bottom.

Not possible! Tin will not - cannot separate and drift to the top of the pot from a lack of fluxing or stirring or anything else. The only loss of tin will be that which is already at the surface of the melt and in contact with oxygen which will oxidize.

Rick

[cbrick]

From Wikipedia:

Linotype Casting section

The continuous heating of the molten alloy causes the tin and antimony in the mixture to rise to the top

That's pure BS.

Lead easily evaporates form the molten mixture and enters the respiratory tract, and both lead and antimony have a tendency to be absorbed through the skin.

And this is even bigger BS. Lead does not evaporate at anything even close to casting temps, you can get lead vapor when over 1,100 degrees. Lead cannot be absorbed through the skin. To get lead poisoning you have to ingest it.

So much for Wikipedia . . .

Rick

[sergeant69]

ya mean like in the good old days when roy rogers and john wayne caused the bad guys to "ingest" some lead? hell yea!

[mrbukers]

And this is even bigger BS. Lead does not evaporate at anything even close to casting temps, you can get lead vapor when over 1,100 degrees. Lead cannot be absorbed through the skin. To get lead poisoning you have to ingest it.

This isn't accurate. You can get lead vapor at any point after the lead is molten. It's typically a very small amount that grows as you approach the boiling temperature. This is why you should always work with molten metals outdoors or in well ventilated spaces. Just because it's a very small amount of lead vapor doesn't mean you can't ingest it. This is a large concern because your body gets rid of lead very very slowly.

[cbrick]

ya mean like in the good old days when roy rogers and john wayne caused the bad guys to "ingest" some lead? hell yea!

Yep, that is one form of acute lead poisoning.

Rick

[cbrick]

This isn't accurate. You can get lead vapor at any point after the lead is molten. It's typically a very small amount that grows as you approach the boiling temperature. This is why you should always work with molten metals outdoors or in well ventilated spaces. Just because it's a very small amount of lead vapor doesn't mean you can't ingest it. This is a large concern because your body gets rid of lead very very slowly.

That is accurate, lead does not vapor at melting temps. Of course good ventilation should be used, lead is not the only thing in your melt. Your odds of getting any lead poisoning at melting temps is quite remote. If you have elevated levels of lead in your system you ingested it one way or another. I highly recommend washing your hands after handling lead and no thumb sucking until you do.

Rick

[EDG]

I think we need a different forum for people that cast for handguns and those that cast for rifles.
The two groups often cast with different techniques, alloys and have different criteria for a good bullet.

BPCR shooters want MOA results to 400 yards or more.
Pistol shooters often do not even have a way to measure the accuracy of their bullets.
A bullet produced for plinking at 30 feet does not necessarily meet the demands of long range rifle shooters.
Yet the two groups argue about technique - when the two groups have completely different requirements.

[Threepersons]

I ladle pour. Because I'm to cheap to buy a bottom pot.
Now for all you folks wanting to know about Linotype machine. I was
a Linotype operator in the 50's and 60's. Linotypes casts under pressure. They had
a piston, which I removed daily, cleaned and fluxed the pot.