French Gras single shot rifle

[Frank46]

Maybe having way too much time on my hands recently. One of my brothers neighbors gave him an 1874 Gras rifle. He described it to me as being dirty,greasy, and has about an inch of dog hair on it around it and in it. Seemed she kept some type of very hairy dog around. Anyway,he has no use for it and maybe one of these days I'll be getting a brown package. Has anyone ever done or heard about a 45/70conversion on these rifles? I'd just get the barrel relined and go from there. It is asingle shot so no mag conversions will be needed. May have to get a ring soldered on the bolt face for the smaller 45/70 case. Thanks,Frank

[I'll Make Mine]

I'd worry about someone, sometime loading a modern smokeless .45-70 factory round into that old black powder barrel. Given the original round was 11x59R, the bore is probably too small for .45-70 anyway -- it's more like a .44 than a .45, and as you note you'd have to have a ring soldered into the chamber to prevent brass splitting.

Better to get some reproduction brass, slug the bore and get the right size mold, and shoot it with original black powder loads and paper patches. More fun than .45-70, I'd guess, and the brass will last virtually forever as long as you don't let the black powder corrode it.

[Frank46]

Well will find out when I get it. Being a single shot bolt action would be easier to convert except for the bolt face. He just retired from the post office and figured that he spend some time cleaning up all of the junk he has collected. Frank

[Cactus Farmer]

Why convert? It's costly at best. Until you see the bore you don't know what you have. I have a few "special" calibers that shoot quite well in their original size. Even with dark bores. I know a fellow who had me clean and shorten a badly butchered 6.5 Carcano. The bore looked like a well used water pipe,BUT it shoots great with Prvi Partizan Ammo. He bought the dies and when he gets some brass shot up we will reload for it and see what else it can do.I have a41 Swiss,577/450,11.4 X 52 Nagant, 8mm French Ordnance,310 Greener to name a few. All shoot well enough to be a fun afternoon and there is the thrill of knowing that you res-erected an oldtimer. hunting with an odd ball is fun too. Many funny looks until I shoot a few times. A full game bag is proof enough for the doubters.

[Wayne Smith]

I don't know that brass but I agree with others. You are much better off keeping it as it is if it is safe to shoot. I have a Cape Gun in 10.5x47R and enjoy shooting it. Fireformed 9.5x47R brass, but could have cut down and necked 11mm Mauser, the parent case for both.

The French tend to do unique stuff, so finding the brass may be problematic but I would look at Huntington's and Buffalo Arms first.

[I'll Make Mine]

Buffalo Arms has 11x59R loaded black powder rounds for about four bucks each (of course, that includes reloadable brass) and Graf's has imported Bertram brass for barely less than the loaded rounds, but that profile looks similar to .43 Spanish; it might be possible to form the brass from somewhat cheaper 24 ga. brass shotshells or .348 cases, as can be done for .43 Spanish (I found a reference on the web that says the head is the same, but I haven't found the other dimensions) -- one might even be able to fireform .43 Spanish ammunition in the gun, though I'd take a chamber cast before trying it.

[Frank46]

Well my brother isn't the fastest person in the world. Will see what it looks like when and if it ever gets here dog hair and all. I have all the stuff for the 45/70 so doing a rebarrel would seem to make sense to me rather than hunting up the brass, dies,and bullet mold. Frank

[Wayne Smith]

Granted, it would make more sense, maybe. Not nearly as much fun, in my humble opinion.

[smokemjoe]

I fire form 348 brass and my bore is .457, use about a 330 gr. bullet.

[Frank46]

Thanks Joe, haven't received the rifle yet and from my brothers description grease,dirt, and dog hair may or may not be shootable. Will find out when and if it ever gets here. Frank

[Ivymike]

I have a 1874 Saint Etienne Infantry Rifle that has been professionally converted to fire 45/70 cartridges and I do shoot it often with black powder and mild smokeless loads. Loads safe in Trapdoor will be safe. Starline 45/70 brass and 350-400 lubed cast bullets. The conversion appears to be the spud method where the original barrel was cut removed just forward of the throat then drilled and tapped to receive a new barrel with threaded spud barrell and 45/70 cut chamber. Shoots great and raises eyes at the range. I got it 20 years ago and love it. I do not know who did the conversion. Mike H

[GregLaROCHE]

Keep it original. The cost to have it converted can be used to by the needed reloading components. They are available, but ma take a little looking.

[samari46]

Seems like this post has taken on a life of it's own. Originally posted on 01/03/13.
Got the little carbine and has an excellent ore after the dog hair and other junk was removed. Came with no bolt head but got a complete bolt and just swapped out the bolt head. Still missing the screw that serves as a bolt stop. Has brass barrel bands, forend cap, trigger guard and buttplate. Calls it the pirate gun. Frank