I bought a CVA Missouri - I have a few questions for the board

[bubbapug1]

I bought a CVA Missouri - the gun appears to be near new. The original owner tells me he put 30 rounds through it, which appears to be about right

I have a few questions for the board. The gun is labeled 50 cal. Do I use 0.491 patch balls with it? I have some pre-lubbed patches for 50 cal that might work.

Any idea on load? I have goex FFg powder for it. I have some speer 0.491 balls.

Any idea where a manual may be procured for this gun?

[frontier gander]

.490 with .015 patch or .018 patch

100gr 2f max load

[405]

First, yes the .491 ball should work fine. Then you can fine tune the patch thickness for the balance between convenient loading and accuracy. Search the local stores that sell cloth by the yard after you determine how the patches you have work- pillow ticking is a universal standard for many shooters using patched roundballs. Measure the thickness of the patches you try then take a mic or calipers to the store. Use natural tight weave fabric- cotton ticking is just such a fabric. I'd start with 50 gr of FF blackpowder and see how it shoots. I have no clue where to find a manual for that gun. Lyman publishes pretty much the standard manual for muzzleloaders. Older versions are called the Lyman Black Powder Handbook and the newer versions are called the Lyman Muzzleloaders' Handbook. You could look around the used book section on Amazon, B&N or the local booK store or sporting goods store. The data and instruction on muzzleloaders really doesn't change much so any of the manuals you find will be fine.

[bubbapug1]

Thanks fellas...I'll try it thursday or friday

[bubbapug1]

Finally got this out.....put 15 balls through it and the gun works great. I lost the tamping rod about the 7th shot, it cracked at a grain area. Wouldn't of lasted too long anyway.

The gun is very repeatable, but at 50 yards it's shooting 6" low and 2" left. The groups aren't too shabby considering I was using a powder dispenser and roughly charging 60- to 80 grains per shot.

Can after market adjustable sights be had for these guns or is there a better replica for use in muzzle loading replica matches? One which won't break the bank??

[rhbrink]

I'm not familiar with the CVA Missouri but if the rear sight is dove tailed to the barrel it can be drifted to the right. If the front sight is a blade take a file with you and file a very small amount off the top to raise the impact. Take a few strokes and shoot a couple of rounds and repeat to get the desired results. I actually prefer to do this over a couple of days with different lighting conditions before I call it good.

RB

[Pb2au]

What he said^.
Also, try and nail down the powder charge. Varying 20 grains of powder will have an effect. An El-Cheapo fix is to get a couple of cartridge cases and cut them down to hold certain powder charges and work from there.

[bubbapug1]

When I settled on 80 grains of FFG the group settled in at 4 balls into a 2" pattern at fifty yards. The 60 grain load was a bit lower.

Both sights are dovetailed. I'll lower the front one after trying tests at 100 yards.

I used a .490 Speer ball and a pre lubed 0.10" patch cut for the 0.49 balls.

I use this calculator to determine my sight adjustments.

http://www.sdmfabricating.com/sightcalc.html

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

I run a cva kentucky with a marbles bullseye http://www.midwayusa.com/product/132...35-height-blue , if yours has a dove tailed rear sight the drivig out the old one maybe a little file work for fit on the new one and it fits in and works very well but is not considered traditional but it doesn't look out of place like a scope either. I like the sight picture much better and it doesn't cost much.

new front sight blades can be had in varying heights also raise it to hit lower lower it to hit higher usually you lower it with a file till it is just right

if it is a 50 you may want to start with 50 gr of powder at 50 yards and see what your groups look like then go up to 60, 70, 80 ,90 some where in there you should find a sweet spot and then it will open up again when you find where it opens up again go back to your tightest group and start there with 5 gr changes

wipe the barrel between shots , for sighting in patch lube and fun shooting i like 1/3 rubbing alcohol , 1/3 hydrogen peroxide , and 1/3 murphy's oil soap mix this and put in a dark colored spray bottle , spray on a patch to make it damp then swab the bore between shots , you can also use this on the patches you shoot as it works great for that also , and run several wetted patches of it before you leave the range and it will make clean up at home much easier.

you may already know but since your asking beginner questions about muzzle loaders , remember clean after every use the same day , fully dissemble , wipe down the outside of everything wilt a damp cloth then oil , and scrub the bore with hot soapy water get a clean hot water rinse and then when dry oil

[bubbapug1]

thanks for the info. I am new to muzzle loaders. I did wash out the barrel with window cleaning foam (from Costco) followed by rubbing alcohol to remove the water, than a patch with wd 40, than one with light oil. It looks good. The window cleaning foam works killer on the black powder residuals. I use the same regiment on my BP pistols and they clean up in seconds.

I want to try Western powders Blackhorn 209. They claim it can produce higher velocities per unit pressure and it has no residuals. I think the residuals ruin accuracy eventually, plus they gum up the trigger mechanisms in my pistols something fierce.

I did find a sight set on amazon for my gun. I am going to give it a try.

[johnson1942]

if your useing blackhorn 209 which is a very good choise, you will have to put a magspark 209 primer nipple on your gun. i havent read every post after your post so forgive me if you stated already that you have a magspark nipple on your gun. i have several side locks and all have the magspark nipple and i shoot 209 powder in all of them. just as accurate as real black and no cleaning between shot. as ive said many time here the blackhorn powder is only 15 mile away and the real black is 140 miles away when i need some. also ive cleaned enough barrels between shots over the years i want to kick back a little and shoot and shoot with out cleaning. i fixed up a gun like yours for a local pastor only in .45 roundball cal. it was the most accurate .45 roundball ive ever shot. at 100 yards it could keep a tight cluster.

[Zymurgy50]

For punching holes in paper I use 30gn of REAL BLACK with a RB, for punching holes in deer I use 80gn with a RB.
I could never get any CVA traditional muzzleloader to work with any BP substitute without using either 10gn of real black first, then the substitute, or a nipple with a flash hole so large that a reasonable load would blow the hammer back to half cock.


.490 or .495 RB's. a supply of patches in thicknesses from .010 to .025, a couple pounds of 2F and 3F, and a day or two of experimenting is all you need to tell what load combination this rifle will like best.

[AlaskanGuy]

Here is where you can download the manual...... Just click on the link for older cva breakopen rifles at the bottom of this page.. http://www.cva.com/Muzzleloading-Res...area=Manuals#t

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

777 3fg may work for you as a sub or pyrodex P they are a little easier to get lit than some of the others

but getting shot to shot accuracy real black almost always wins you may want to try this place http://www.murphypowder.com/reloading-powders.html it is also in southern California and the carry GOEX whitch is good stuff I like 3fg even in a 50 cal for paper punching with a round ball you get away with less of it for nice groups and decent velocity compared to 2fg but in the end you have to let the rifle tell you what it likes

I am Leary of any powder that claims it cleans easier , because you need to clean black but it isn't that hard , my wife however does not like the smell as i was cleaning last night at the dining room table and she thought the dog had gas

[dondiego]

Sure.......blame the dog!

[bubbapug1]

Thanks for the tips guys. I especially appreciate the Murphy lead. I have a fair amount of goex FFG but I'd like to try the substitute to cut back on fouling. I don't like how the pistols eventually freeze up from all the residuals after 50 rounds or so.

I'll find a good sweet spot next trip and post some groups.