First And Last Equipment

[SciFiJim]

I started with a $5 mold, a $1 soup ladle and a sauce pan from Goodwill. What I learned making round balls one at a time taught me the things that helped me decide on equipment. I also learned things like what lead looks like while heating from solid to liquid. What the sprue looks like while cooling and to watch for the sprue to develop a dimple just before it gets solid as it sucks in more lead.

Someone said that you can't buy experience and that is true. However, you can buy inexpensive training that will help you later. Figuring out whether the problem is equipment or operator related is part of the learning process. If you can't figure it out with simple equipment like Lee, you won't be able to find the problem with expensive equipment. Think of the first purchase of inexpensive equipment as training aids. We all took baby steps in the beginning. I don't know of anyone that started off at a dead run.

Once you progress to your final equipment, you can always hand off the learning equipment to another new beginner.

[cbrick]

Tell me this: if I went with the Master Caster, and just pulled the lever, is there anything that I'd miss learning?

Hhmmm . . . Am I reading this wrong? Are you refering to the automatic casting machine? If that is correcct that is NOT what was recommended, the recommendation in this thread is for the Magma 40 pound bottom pour casting pot ONLY.

I mightily recommend AGAINST starting with and learning casting with an automatic machine just like I always recommend not learning reloading on a progressive press.

Rick

[mold maker]

Most of us start casting to save money. It hardly ever works out that way, but it's a good excuse.
If price is no object, and speed is everything, Buy factory. If you want to start a new hobby, casting is great.
You didn't learn to drive with a 10 wheel tractor pulling a double trailer, and you will never cast really good boolits starting out with all the bells and whistles.
There is a learning curve, that starts with the basics. Regardless of how big of a hurry your in, or how much you spend, it demands the basics first. The process involves 700 degree splashes of liquid lead, and the finished products if not properly done can kill you.
The basics can best be learned with basic equipment. The first basic you must have are Lynan (or others) cast bullet hand book. That knowledge must be transported to your brain. You have to know the dangers in order to recognize and avoid them.
Your never get all the bells and whistles working if you don't know the principal of what they are supposed to do. Keep it simple (KISS) means exactly that. Learn, and relearn till you get a through understanding of the process, before getting excited about speed.
I would never advise a new caster to outspend his knowledge. It's a sure route to a fire sale in disgust, if not a tragedy.

[mooman76]

I agree with Buckshot here. Go cheap. None up the stuff we mentioned here is poorly made and will all work to produce thousands of good bullets. Also anything you buy can easily be resold here if you decide to go another route. A lee 6 cavity mould and a pot will crank out lots of bullets and the Lee 6x moulds are built better than their smaller ones. You will learn allot more by doing it yourself. Maybe you can find someone in your area that will show you what they got and even let you cast a little.

[canyon-ghost]

The problem with the old manual 5 & 4 gearbox, if you ever lug it, it jams in gear! Dang thing wasn't right.

Anyway, I thought you could use a few ideas. The Magma you were looking at, the guy never changes the mold because it's extremely hot. Just pulling the lever is done after he knows the lead is up to temp, fluxed and clean, and ready to pour. The problem- it's more lead than you'd need for a weekend of shooting.
My afternoon casting sessions get me about 350 good bullets, and I'm picky! I weigh mine. So, I may start with 400 to 500 in a 3 lb. coffee can. It's about 1/2 a coffee can of bullets, if quantity makes it easier to visualize.

I'd recommend an electric pot, in 110 volt. The idea is not to have to chase propane tanks or cylinders around (the supplies gotta come from somewhere).

My small scale set up may seem to old fashioned but, it supplies : 22 hornet, 32-20, 32 magnum, 9mm, 7mm, 41 magnum and 44 Special. I also have duplicates, two guns in the same caliber. I make enough to keep me shooting.

[Jammer Six]

And I appreciate the information!

Talk about relevant, on-time information... Ballista-cast, you made your company look good.

I thought the Master Caster made two or four boolits every time you pulled the handle. Looking back at the video, I have no clue where I got that idea, probably a case of seeing what I wanted to see rather than what was there.

If each pull is one boolit, that changes things. Mainly, it changes how interested I am in machines in the beginning. Particularly if any moulds I buy can be adapted later to the machines.

I'm fairly sure I'm going to go with the consensus, and go with a cast iron pot, a ladle and the hotplate I own.

So, on to specifics and moulds. I want to start with a .45 round nose, at 230 grains.

In addition to the pot, studying the book the Los Angeles club put out, I need:

• A mould
• Mould handles
• Thermometer

With a towel and piece of wood (both of which I have a lot), I should be able to produce a boolit.

First, I'm going to slug my barrels. I've been putting that off, because I remember it being a screaming pain, and I have a delicate hind end. It's why I look so good in pictures.

[13Echo]

Well as to the Lee pots I'm still using my 20lb pots after 10 years and have had a 10 lb pot for over 20. If you ladle cast the Lee is just about as good as any. The bottom pour pot has the reputation as a dripper. For moulds until you develop some skill you will likely destroy or otherwise screw up one or more. So I would recommend starting with Lee moulds till you develop technique. You can go through quite a few of them for the price of a top of the line and there are several bullet styles Lee has that are excellent. Lube sizer - take your pick or pan lube or use Lee tumble lube and push through sizers - they work really well. If you want to ladle cast then Lyman or RCBS ladle (the Lee is pitiful). The equipment can be easily upgraded as you gain experience and the equipment you started with is still useful. My 2cents.

Jerry Liles

[Jammer Six]

Alright, I'm convinced.

I've seen new apprentices work, and I don't assign them to either high dollar equipment or high dollar material. You guys finally got through.

The decision is made, a pot, my old hotplate, a ladle and one small mould.

Once I've learned what that has to teach, I'll be back with more questions, I'm sure.

(I said the same thing to dad in about 1983. I was an apprentice, and I had just come off a huge job out of Local 131 setting cabinets in a skyscraper in downtown Seattle. Dad and I were setting cabinets, and I made a suggestion. He looked at me, and with a perfectly straight face, told me to do it his way, until I had learned everything there was to know about his method, and then we'd compare our methods. I figured that would take about a week, so I said "okay, that's what we'll do." That was 35 years ago, and he's gone, but I haven't finished learning everything about his method.)

Oh, and lugging that damned Peterbuilt down and jamming it in gear with 30 yards of pitrun behind me was exactly how I almost killed myself! I'm still not sure how I made the corner, but I remember standing on the brake with both feet, and ruining a perfectly good set of Carhartts.

Now, which mould?

[Mal Paso]

977 Huh? You ARE Experienced!

Lee sizers will work and you aren't out real money. My regret was not bypassing the Lyman/RCBS sizers and getting a Star Sizer.

[Jammer Six]

977 Huh? You ARE Experienced!

Yar. Took me all summer to get a full bucket and load trucks without breaking sideboards, and I never was any good at getting it onto a lowboy.

Don't tell me that there aren't any 977s anymore. You'll break my heart.

[1bluehorse]

Far as I'm concerned you could have quit reading after post #12, CBRICK nailed it just about perfect, with maybe the exception on the pot. I'd go for the RCBS pro melt, not that it's a better pot cause it ain't but it's about as good as it gets and it's 22lbs instead of 40. After all you've been through I really doubt you want to sit and cast 40lbs of 230gr. 45's. Your back will feel like you were still packin that 2 bag cement thing....

[Buckshot]

.................Jammer 6, there is or seems to be a certain amount of voo-doo in casting. Some moulds are as eager to please as a spotted puppy, and others are like, ...................... an ex-wife? NOTHING seems to work. When things are perking along and bright well filled out boolits are falling like rain from the blocks, it is sublime and interuptions are not suffered gracefully. In order to appease the casting gods I have found that experimenting with your dress can have an effect. I've settled on a campaign hat, jock strap and hurache sandles as Costume de rigueur. I know that 9.3x62Al's utilizes a beanie with a propeller on top, as I lent him one of my spares. But as to what else, he keeps it a secret.

..................Buckshot

[Jammer Six]

I have a speedo. That's my plan, a speedo, a Sparks VMII, cowboy boots and a face shield worn backwards, to keep splashes of lead from going down my neck.

[Jammer Six]

Okay, step one.

I slugged the barrel of the first weapon I will cast for.

A Springfield milspec 1911. Lots of modifications.

I remembered that slugging a barrel took 14 times as much force as I thought it would, so I brought a bigger hammer this time, and drove a lead sinker through the barrel.

With my cheap calipers, the largest measurement was .4515, but I don't believe the last decimal place, I don't believe these calipers are that accurate. So I'd say the barrel is between .451 and .452. There were places on the slug that measured .450, and even some that went down to .449, but the large measurement is the one that matters, isn't it?

If I understand everything correctly, a .452 mould is what I want.

[Ford SD]

And I appreciate the information!

Talk about relevant, on-time information... Ballista-cast, you made your company look good.

I thought the Master Caster made two or four boolits every time you pulled the handle. Looking back at the video, I have no clue where I got that idea, probably a case of seeing what I wanted to see rather than what was there.

If each pull is one boolit, that changes things. Mainly, it changes how interested I am in machines in the beginning. Particularly if any moulds I buy can be adapted later to the machines.

I'm fairly sure I'm going to go with the consensus, and go with a cast iron pot, a ladle and the hotplate I own.

So, on to specifics and moulds. I want to start with a .45 round nose, at 230 grains.

In addition to the pot, studying the book the Los Angeles club put out, I need:

• A mould
• Mould handles
• Thermometer

With a towel and piece of wood (both of which I have a lot), I should be able to produce a boolit.

First, I'm going to slug my barrels. I've been putting that off, because I remember it being a screaming pain, and I have a delicate hind end. It's why I look so good in pictures.

I could be wrong (as there is a lot of different caster on here)

My best casting session to date has been with the below equipment
20 lb bottom pour pot
2 4 cav H&G 45acp moulds 200g (Balallist-cast moulds)
Yes two identical molds casting at the same time

I had problems keeping the pot even 3/4 full adding ingots slowly every so often to keep level up (so temp stayed up) So i wish I had a bigger pot

2nd best day was with 2 rcbs molds (at same time)

If you are going to ladle pour, you almost limit your self to a 2 cav mold
and you will spend all day casting and you will be casting/ lubing/loading every week

I Have also bottom poured a 4 cav and 2 2 cav molds at the same time
and on another day did a 6cav and a 4 cav and got ok but I find my reject rate goes up casting different molds / size cavities

So my best result have been with 2 molds from the same manufacture
with almost the same weight bullets

Different Maufactures mold retain heat differently,
I have problems, some will say they don't when casting at the same time

So I would recomend to spend less time in front of a lead pot
Get at least a 20 lb bottom pour pot and 4 or 6 cav molds

You could still use the bottom pour pot for ladle casting

if you cast 230g bullets you will go through a pot of lead fast
Have you thought about 200g or 185g bullets for the 45
1 -20lb pot of 230g is less than 600 boolits

If casting in the basment you are going to have to rig up a exaust fan to the out side
Kitchen range Hood with back and sides will work, get one with high cfm

You can even get lexan. plastic window in front at the top and it might save you a few splashes (lower part open for hands)

[SciFiJim]

If I understand everything correctly, a .452 mould is what I want.

Yep, .452 is a great place to start. It is a very common size. You will need to decide on the sizing system you want. I have a Lyman4500 and I use the Lee push thru sizers with tumble lube. It just depends on what I want to accomplish.

[ReloaderFred]

Just for information to correct Post # 46, the Master Caster drops two bullets with each pull of the handle.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[cbrick]

Just for information to correct Post # 46, the Master Caster drops two bullets with each pull of the handle. Hope this helps. Fred

That's correct, Magma offers two nozzles for the Master Caster Pot, the normal single spout and a dual spout for filling two cavities at one time, this is an awesome feature.

Rick

[ballisti-cast]

The Master Caster uses one mold with 2 cavities where our machine uses two molds. The casting machines only take 1 or 2 cavity molds so if your looking at that route in the future and want to be able to use the molds you already have get 2 cavity ones and not 4 or 6. Granted you can cast a lot higher quantities per hour with a 4 or 6 cavity mold.

[Jammer Six]

Took my first action, slugged my barrel, and made my first purchase.

I ordered the current edition of Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook from Midway.

First money spent, Project To Date total: $32.29.