Magnum Bias

[bowfin]

123456

[btroj]

So we each have our own biases, so what? Is that not the purpose of a question like was asked- to have people state their opinions?
I do think many think that a magnum cartridge makes them capable of long range shooting on game. They have no idea aout wind drift, bullet drop, or how well they can actually shoot at 500 yards. They just want the bragging rights that come with the cartridge. Is this everyone, no. But it is certainly enough of them.
I can see this group every year at the local clubs during sightin before deer season. You can quickly tell the people who have no business owning a fun, much less hunting. You want to hunt with the guy who bought a milsurp and some am,o and wants to shoot before even looking thru the barrel? The club uses a bore light on every gun before it gets shot. Barrel was full of cosmoline and junk. He easily could have been hurt.

Do we generalize at time? Yep. That is human nature. I will say that I know people who are excellent hunters but poor long range shooters. They always get a deer because they know where to find the game, how the get close, and can make the shot when it is given. I don't work on long range practice before hunting as I hunt in an area where 100 yards is a long shot. It is all about your perspective on things.

[Reload3006]

I cant get no satisfaction no no no, He cant be a man cuz he dont smoke the same cigarettes as me. I cant get no .... Satisfaction.

[x101airborne]

Yes, but have you "Tried"?

[JJC]

I have a family member that matches the above points almost to a T. He never listens to me about practicing and always makes the hunt extremely stressful. After the animal in eventually taken I hear the I should have listened to you BS. Same guy owns a $2,500 1911 that he don't shoot either.

[bowfin]

123456

[bowfin]

123456

[JJC]

The guy mentioned above bought a "out west rifle". It sat in the safe for atleast fifteen years. The first elk hunt he went on in Colorado was a bit of a cluster. The rifle was to heavy, and he was from sea level chasing elk around 9,000 feet. I wound up carrying the pack and rifle. Shooting started at about 250 yards and out to 5 or 600. Then a final shot was made about 80 yards to the shoulder (12 rounds later). Remember I said I had his pack? which included the rest of his spare ammo. I was on the hillside watching through binos. When it was all over I was the new owner if a Winchester pre 64 Classic 300 Win mag with a Leupold 4-14 scope. Take the same guy with an AR 15, 35 Rem or a 308 Marlin and he is deadly. Good with a bow too. Go figure

[JJC]

Same guy then goes and buys a Kimber 300 WSM with a Kahles multi plex reticle for antelope. You know where this goes.

[Harter66]

I do love the redhead/brunett debate.

No magnum bias here I used to think I wanted 300WM. I even own a magnum (alibi a 357).

Point of order we like mags because we need something bigger faster and better because we do.

Fact we killed everthing on this continent w/ 30-50ft lbs maybe less, shoot a stick bow through your chrony weigh the arrow, E= MCsq. The 45-110 will do everything a 458WM will do more or less LYMAN 48th 405gr SP. In Europe the 6.5x55 is a moose/red deer slaying machine.

Frankly if you have a 270/280/30-06' or a 7mm08/260/308 or a 6.5/7/8x55-57 you've probably enough gun for anything in the western hemisphere. Yes those are a little light for griz or polar bears but I've seen gobs of articals that say I gotta have a 300WM for white tail.

Yep, I'm 1 of those 06' guys.

A guy once said to me ,after I remarked about wrecking a 55gal drum at just shy of 200yds w/a PRB in a 50Hawkens over 100gr of FFG,"well yeah,a 45-70 will only take about 80gr under a 300gr bullet and we killed all the buffalo w/that (and 450-500gr over 65-70gr)".

Food for thought use it or disreguard.

[waksupi]

I did hunt with a .338 win Mag for quite a few years. Finally figured out I didn't need all the fuss and feathers. As far as "needing" a long range rifle, I have killed more than a few antelope with flintlocks and revolvers.

Sorry this is so blurry, tried to take a picture of a picture on my wall. All these were taken with patched round balls, in muzzleloaders.

[Reload3006]

My .02 if its worth that. I dont care what people use to hunt with. Provided they get out and practice with the rifle they intend to use. If you feel satisfaction making a 1000yd shot and you and your equipment are capable of doing that more power to you. If you dont think you will derive satisfaction shooting that far or you are not capable of doing that close the range. I have magnums I have the good ole thudy ougt six and the thudy thudy. I enjoy hunting with all of them. I even bow hunt as a lot of people say if i had to give up guns and shooting I wouldnt miss it because the rush of getting close enough to kill your prey with a bow is unexplainable. But if that is not your trip its not your trip. Why should I care that you want to use a belted magnum and snipe them at distance. Unless the truth be told I may be afraid you are going to kill a deer I want? or is it I am afraid your going to maim a deer that I am going to have to dispatch later? I think the truth is some where between or both. Lets get a grip I would encourage you all to take a deep breath use the gun you want practice with it and most importantly of all Self assess know what you are capable of. If that big magnum is kicking the snot out of you and your developing bad flinching habits maybe you should think of stepping down a little.

[Dirty30]

I'll freely admit that I have a bias, however it is not towards the cartridge but the average guy who uses them. You and your brother may well shoot very effectively with magnum cartridges but you are the exception not the rule. I hunted with a guy last year who spent the entire time telling my friend and I that we didn't have enough gun to kill an elk. I had a 30-06 and Nate had a 270. This guy had a .338 and couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with it. My biggest beef is the fact that people build their magnum sniper ninja guns and think they are now capable of long range shooting and they are not. I am not opposed to long range hunting because I believe an "ethical shot" is determined by your ability, and I have yet to meet a hunter shooting magnum cartridges who had any business doing so. Furthermore I just don't think they are typically necessary.

[bowfin]

My take is that an incompetent shooter is as likely to show up with a milsurp rifle, AR rifle, or granddaddy's .30-30 as with a magnum.

This is just my opinion, but the most important accessory for a 200 yard rifle is a 200 yard rifle range. For a 400 yard rifle, it is 400 yards of space between you and your target. If you don't shoot practice at 400 yards, you don't shoot game at 400 yards.

[JeffinNZ]

Hey BOWFIN. I think "Larry" has moved to NZ and is a member in my club!

[bowfin]

Do you have any .303 Enfields down there in New Zealand?

[btroj]

Ou think the most important thing for a person to have to shoot game at 400 yards is a 400 yard range. Problem is that many think all it takes is the latest, greatest magnum.

I don't have magnum bias. I have "guy who can't shoot but thinks the latest, greatest rifle/cartridge combo makes me cool and awesome as a hunter" bias.

The gun is just that, a gun. It is the idiot behind the gun I have problems with. I will say that the idiot with the latest, greatest magnum is far more likely to brag and be vocal aout his abilities than the guy with a milsurp. Sort of like a mall ninja, gotta have the cool stuff. Itis aout style, not substance for them.

[nanuk]

Most biases, I believe, stem from ignorance.

and we simply do not have enough of the old time shooters telling us Yung'un's how to shoot AND hunt!

the folks at my office used to laugh at me when I told them I could walk up within about 50 yds EASY to a whitetail doe.

one day, I showed 'em how it was done by walking up to a gopher with about 2 yds.

a "City Boy" couldn't believe it, so he had to try. He got within 2 feet using my technique.

my boss was absolutely amazed. but was too late with the camera.

[bowfishn]

Reading this reminds me of one deer season when I was 16, my cousin 16 , my brother 17 and a friend 18 were back at the car eating and being young we had the need to shoot a few rounds. We were parked at a gravel pit where a few locals always sighted in the rifles. We set up a few quart oil cans out at 50 yards and took turns trying out each others rifles. My friend had just purchased an Interarms 300 win mag so he could prove he had the biggest set off 8@!!$ We were shooting it off hand and my brother, my cousin and I were hitting over 3 feet high at 50 yards. Our buddy was actually hitting the can once in a while, I suspected the rifle was hitting high and he was flinching so bad he was pulling his shots down to the can. After I shot it I pretended to chamber a round and then put the safety on and handed it back to my buddy. He aimed at the can flipped off the safety and almost stuck the end of the barrel into the ground at his feet. That was the worst case of flinching I have ever witnessed.
I have talked with quite a few hunters who use 7mm Rem Mags and have noticed that many of them have no clue of the calibers ballistics. Most will brag about a 500 yard shot they made on a deer, they tell how they put the cross hairs right on the deers shoulder and squeezed the trigger, The deer dropped right where it stood. After questioning them on what yardage they had the rifle sighted in for they would tell me 100 yard or some 200 yards. Now if they had it sighted in for 200 yards and aimed dead on and hit right where they aimed that's not bad considering the bullet dropped about 36". Don't even get me started with the running shots at 100 to 200 yards that so many have claimed to have shot without any lead on the deer, same story hit the deer right where they put the cross hairs. I think some think a magnum travels just shy of light speed. I have learned to just say "huh, thats amazing" and just leave it alone.
Now I'm not bashing belted magnums or those who choose to hunt with them, there are many who shoot well with them. But as stated no matter what you hunt with know how it shoots, at the distance you will shoot at.

[x101airborne]

I will not bash magnum users. I used to hunt with 270 wsm, 300 win mags, 7 mags and on ultra magnum. The 270 WSM shot very flat. And when I finally got to kill a doe with it, it ruined the front half of the deer. Shoulder shot with a softpoint. My custom 300 win mag on a 03-A3 action shot laser accurate and accounted for more 500 yard steel targets than it had to. But heavy barreled at the cost of about 17 pounds, was not for a walking around gun. My 7 mag was a ruger and a very slick rifle. Not all that much accurate, but deadly to reasonable ranges. And down here that is about 300 yards max. Everything has it's uses and people to use them. A Ferrari is not for stop and go traffic.

We all buy some stuff that may have made sense at the time. But I learned. And I can hit anything with my 308 that anyone with a magnum can at the same range. But I wont say they are right or wrong,,,,,, it just doesn't work for me.