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Thread: defensive ranges are very close, 10 ft

  1. #1
    Boolit Bub
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    defensive ranges are very close, 10 ft

    or so, and the pattern of your shotgun is but 1" wide per yard of forward travel from the muzzle (unchoked barrel and 00 buckshot). Most attacks are not made with a gun, check out the Dept of Justice website for the Annual Crime Survey. So it makes far more sense to ccw a pistol around your house than to count upon being able to run and get any sort of longarm.

    you also want a AA cell flashlight, preferably also always carried with you, at least when it's dark, with a side button, not the silly, expensive ones with the button on the butt of the light. Then, your weak hand's thumb can encircle the light, holding the light and gun in a normal 2 handed firing position, not some hokey, bass ackwards version of a grip! The side button lets you turn the light off and on.

    Me, in my house, I'm TURNING ON THE LIGHTS if I think there's an invader. I'm not wanderiing around in the dark, showing a light, letting him see and hear me coming, and letting him "jump" me, throw a crowbar at me from the dark, etc. The flashlight is just for checking unlighted sheds, the yard, etc, and you really SHOULD have a dog and lights back there, anyway. Few burlgars, etc, carry guns, or can hit jack squat with one if they do have it. Pointing a gun-light and the gun, too, at people is a bad idea. I want the light held separetely from the gun. That "invader" is probably your kid, come in late, etc. Don't risk suffering the horror of shooting a loved one, guys.

    It doesn't need to be a big, mean dog, just one that barks at strangers. Big dogs are too likely to get you sued for tearing up some little kid that lets him out, and they cost a lot to feed, too.

    A fast man, starting from a standing position, can cover 10 ft in 1.0 second, 20 ft in 1.5 seconds, 30 ft in 2.5 seconds, having built up some speed as he came, you see. Drop a coin from as high as you can hold it, it will hit the floor in 1.0 second. Drop it from waist height, it hits the floor in 1/2 second. You can and should learn to get 5-6 hits per second with a good handgun, guys. Don't hesitate, don't turn your back, and be sure to wear ear protection and use cover whenever possible.

    A powerful gun, used indoors, is horrifically loud. In fact, the flash and blast of a 12 ga load is so bad that it can nearly make you drop the gun! I kid you not! The difference between magnum buckshot and a trap load is tremendous, when fired indoors, don't kid yourself about this. If you can go get a gun, you have time to put on a set of electronic muffs, too, and turn them on, or insert a $30 set of Norton "earvalve" ear plugs. Then you can hear normal sounds, but your ears will be protected by the blast. the flashes, at night, indoors, will steal your (night-adapted) vision, rendering you blind in the dark, if you don't have a light. Bird shot pellets often bounce back from even telephone poles. I had a bunch of such pellets almost imbed themselves in my shins after such a shot. So they can strike your face after hitting, say, the refrigerator! There's a LOT more to having the odds heavily in your favor in a defensive situation than simply picking up a 12 ga.
    Last edited by trench; 12-02-2011 at 06:16 PM.

  2. #2
    Boolit Bub
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    My wife puts up with a lot, like me using the stove in the kitchen for making boolit lube. Unfortunately, she draws the line when it comes to shooting my 12 gauge indoors.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master


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    [QUOTE=trench;1486379 Drop a coin from as high as you can hold it, it will hit the floor in 1.0 second. Drop it from waist height, it hits the floor in 1/2 second.


    You can and should learn to get 5-6 hits per second guys.

    .[/QUOTE]



    Some of what you say is somewhat sensible. The coin to the floor, well, not so much. Slept through science class, did we?

    Five or six hits per second? My, that's some fast shooting there pard.

    Did you used to have a tactical wheelbarrow? You do sound familar . . .

    Hastings,

    That was funny right there.



    Cat
    Cogito, ergo armatum sum.

    (I think, therefore I'm armed.)

  4. #4
    Banned


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    I wonder how the DA would spin it if you actually were forced to shoot an intruder with a 12-gauge pumpgun while holding the appropriate side-button light and while wearing electronic, amplification/suppression earmuffs?? Really, is a jury going to believe you were FORCED to if you shoot a bad guy while so equipped?

    Gear

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    I can appreciate the idea of using hearing protection while shooting, but personally, I have fired weapons indoors without hearing protection, and I dont recommend making a practice of it without protecting your hearing. BUT, there's a huge difference between protecting me and mine with all the adrenaline that goes with it, and practicing. If practicing, and you have a way to practice live-fire indoors, absolutely protect your ears. However, if a situation actually happens, my hearing is the least of my concerns. I would rather live than waste time.

    As to the light, well, we do need to be absolutely sure it is a threat and not a loved one, but there's different training levels represented here on this forum, and we all need to practice and see what each of us prefers. What works for one may not work for another, but as long as we all survive the incident (or even better not have it happen) there is no wrong way, just different ways. I will personally use different tactics if it is just me and the threat as opposed to if it is me trying to deal with a threat while having loved ones too close for comfort. And I'm sure most feel the same way.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    I have to agree on choice. I could do a lot better with my glock than my 870.
    17 rounds is a lot better than 5

  7. #7
    Boolit Master

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    Pointing a gun-light and the gun, too, at people is a bad idea. I want the light held separetely from the gun.
    I don't think it's as bad an idea as shooting a 12ga. magnum load with one hand.

    YMMV

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    No shotgun, and yes, they are all loud. Surely a handgun will work.
    In all, the .41 Magnum would be one of my top choices for an all-around handgun if I were allowed to have only one. - Bart Skelton

  9. #9
    Boolit Grand Master







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    Bedroom gun: Short bbl but legal 20 g. Cyl&Cy. Rest of the house handgun of choice.
    1Shirt!
    "Common Sense Is An Uncommon Virtue" Ben Franklin

    "Ve got too soon old and too late smart" Pa.Dutch Saying

  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy
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    Maybe we should sleep with our electronic ear muffs on

  11. #11
    Boolit Master

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    Maybe we should sleep with our electronic ear muffs on
    The woman that sleeps next to me snores loud enough for them to kick in.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master

    Kraschenbirn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1Shirt View Post
    Bedroom gun: Short bbl but legal 20 g. Cyl&Cy. Rest of the house handgun of choice.
    1Shirt!
    +1 'cept mine's an old 12 ga. Rossi "Coach Gun" with #7 1/2 skeet loads in both barrels (with my SP101 and a full cylinder of 125 gr +P JHPs as back-up).

    Bill

    Oh yeah, the wife keeps her 4" Diamondback in a drawer of the nightstand on her side of the bed, too.
    "I'm not often right but I've never been wrong."

    Jimmy Buffett
    "Scarlet Begonias"

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by geargnasher View Post
    I wonder how the DA would spin it if you actually were forced to shoot an intruder with a 12-gauge pumpgun while holding the appropriate side-button light and while wearing electronic, amplification/suppression earmuffs?? Really, is a jury going to believe you were FORCED to if you shoot a bad guy while so equipped?

    Gear
    That would never come up unless you got a bad case of the stupids and diarrhea of the mouth at the same time. The DA wasn't there. You would need to take off the muffs to call the cops after the event was over, anyway. It wouldn't be prudent to answer the door with the shotgun and flashlight either. Say as little as possible to the cops and let your lawyer do all the rest of your talking for you.
    Rule 303

  14. #14
    Boolit Master



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    Officer I was scared to death and don't even remember exactly what happened.
    Last edited by Buckshot; 12-03-2011 at 02:42 AM.
    Marty-hiding out in the hills.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by Piedmont View Post
    Say as little as possible to the cops and let your lawyer do all the rest of your talking for you.
    Excellent plan.

  16. #16
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Five to six shots per second, huh? Sure, that ain't no problem. I can give Jerry Miculek a run for his money any day, right?

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    It is good to have a plan and stick with it, I agree. These kind of things happen in the middle of Vanna White sitting next to you at your private beach outside your chalet in the South of France, and right as she fetches you your second mint julip...YOU WAKE UP and wonder what the heck woke you up. Then you hear something again. Was that the dog barking? YEP GLASS BREAKING for sure!! There aint no time to be some kind of Hank Hill and put your hearing protection on for cripes sake. Just get armed get your family safe and take cover and don't turn the light on behind you. You don't want some hearing protection dulling your senses, don't give away your position by shining a tiny light somewhere.

    I am blind, and dang near stone deaf. A little dog or two are a real bonus for guys like me. The dirt bags that dropped off my dogs to let them starve are probably the same ones that will come and rob me later so the dogs might eventually get their revenge.

    One of our friends spent over 100 thousand dollars on a security system and another 200 thousand on a fence!! They can call it and view their house on the net, and on and on. A guy can get carried away I think. Those little dogs are at least half as good as their system so is that 150 thousand? And I got them for free! You get a couple of little dogs around and they don't miss much. They can even tell the mail mans car from a stranger! Can a security system do that?
    Last edited by Suo Gan; 12-03-2011 at 02:58 AM.
    Lotta people die in bed: Dangerous place to be!

  18. #18
    Boolit Master ku4hx's Avatar
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    Hmmmm ... six hits in 1 second. Assuming the clock starts on shot one and ends on shot six, that means an accurately placed shot every 200 milliseconds on average. I 'spose it can be done. But as most of us who happen to be married know, we men can't reliably hit the water in the dark in the middle of the night. And the water ain't even moving.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master



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    we men can't reliably hit the water in the dark in the middle of the night. And the water ain't even moving.

    that's a good one ku4hx!
    ARMY Viet-Nam 70-71

  20. #20
    In Remebrance


    Bret4207's Avatar
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    What exactly is the purpose of the OP beyond starting a conversation with your opinions? Is there some event that triggered this post or something in the latest issue of American Handguner or what?

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