Ram priming unit's consistency/accuracy with primer depth.

[.357MAN]

I have been struggling with consistency/accuracy with primer depth on my Lee single stage press, using the standard down stroke priming arm. I get primers from .001" above case-head to .003" below case-head. If the primers are above the case-head I try to push them in further, and they go as deep as .005" sometimes. I thought I would be able to learn to use the standard priming arm, but it's not working for me.

I have been reading "Lyman Reloading Handbook 49 Edition", and after reading the sales pitch on their "Ram Priming Unit" I started looking online at ram priming units. I like RCBS's unit best, but I am not sure a "Ram Priming Unit" will help me and my reloads. I am not concerned with my reloading speed - only
consistent/accurate depth with priming.

So my questions for all you are:

(1)Has anyone confirmed that there is less velocity deviation when seating primers to the exact same depth, or is it a marketing ploy?

(2) How consistent/accurate are seating depths when using a "Ram Priming Unit"? Hopefully no more then .002" variations, with sorted brass.

(3) How consistent/accurate are seating depths when using a "Ram Priming Unit" compared to using other priming units/methods?

Feel free to be as detailed as you wish with your results and opinions.
Thank you!
.357MAN

[UNIQUEDOT]

When you buy primers the anvil is not set due to pellet shrinkage. The proper way to seat primers is to seat them til they bottom out and then give them a slight nudge to set the anvil. It doesn't matter what tool you use to seat them as long as they are fully seated and not crushed. Perhaps you would be better served with a hand priming tool that gives you a better feel? your inconsistencies can be either due to your brass or primer cups and may have nothing to do with your tools or technique.

[Ben]

.357MAN

I really like my Lyman Ram Prime. You'll find however that when priming " mixed brass " head stamps that quite a bit of variation is present.

So.....I find my priming seating depth and consistency to be a lot more accurate when I prime brass in lots ( by maker ). The Lyman Ram Prime works very well for this purpose.

Ben

[Ickisrulz]

I've never tried one, but these seem like the most repeatable units I've heard of:

http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/pr...mer_gauge.html

[.357MAN]

Yes UNIQEDOT, good point. I have read about setting the primer anvil. I can't always feel the "stop" before the primer is seated, so I have to guess when enough pressure has been used to seat the primer. This makes me worried about crushing the priming compound.

My brass is sorted by brand and times they've been fired. Even after sorting there is still inconsistencies with the brass. I have measured brass from my lots and my new brass( Winchester ) is the worst I have seen ( Each cases rim thickness varies by .005" from one side of the case to the other, primer pocket depth differences from case to case is normal. ). But even before the new brass I couldn't get my old brass ( PMC, which was for the most part consistent ) to prime easily and consistently. I think my two problems are: Feeling when the primer stops before the primer anvil seats; and after seating to what feels right, then measuring the depth, and the primer is above the case head.

I think a hand primer would solve my problem, but I have heard lots of bad stuff said about hand held primers, so I am reluctant to try one.

WOW! Nice price tag on that K&M tool, Would last a lifetime.

I'll do a little more research before I pick something. I may get both the Ram Primer and a hand primer, just to see the difference. Which hand held primer do you guys suggest? And what's it's pros and cons.

[dillonhelp]

What is your bench top constructed of? We suggest a minimum of 1" thick particle board, and not to use plywood at all. Bench flex does prevent consistant primer seating.

[UNIQUEDOT]

Which hand held primer do you guys suggest?

\

I've been using the Lee for over 20 years. It has a thumb lever and offers excellent feel, but i have not tried the newer version of it. Lee has an large ergo hand primer that offers a comfortable grip and four finger operation with the feel provided by the tip of the index finger, but it won't be on their website til next month i believe.

Bench flex does prevent consistant primer seating.

Some things seem so obvious after someone points them out. I had never considered bench flex, but definitely see where it would present a problem.

[.357MAN]

I never thought of bench flex. Bench flexing may have been my problem when I was using PMC brass, but I reinforced my bench when I started phasing worn PMC brass out, now my bench is rock solid, and I recollect the feeling improved.

I just realized I've never reloaded new brass before. Could the lake of feeling and bad consistency be because of new brass? Maybe it's tight primer pockets?

.357MAN

[.357MAN]

My primer seating depths where inconsistent because the primer pocket uniformer tool I've been using was dull.

I got suspicious about the uniformer tool after I measured some primer pocket depths after I last posted. So I got some knife sharpening stones and sharpened the cuter, it cuts easer and to the same depth now.

I am sure the dull cuter was the majority of my problem with the new brass. I'm still interested in an alternative to seating primers than what I'm using now, so next time I'm at a sports store I'll get a hand primer.

Thank you for all your help guys!
.357MAN

[Bwana]

My primer seating depths where inconsistent because the primer pocket uniformer tool I've been using was dull.

I got suspicious about the uniformer tool after I measured some primer pocket depths after I last posted. So I got some knife sharpening stones and sharpened the cuter, it cuts easer and to the same depth now.

I am sure the dull cuter was the majority of my problem with the new brass. I'm still interested in an alternative to seating primers than what I'm using now, so next time I'm at a sports store I'll get a hand primer.

Thank you for all your help guys!
.357MAN

You could always get the Sinclair carbide uniformer. I've had my LR one for years and it still cuts like new.

[mdi]

Personally, I have the best "uniformity" seating primers with a Ram Prime. I've used Lee and Hornady hand priming units but after a hundred or so my thumb/squeezing hand gets a bit tired and primer depths may differ. I got a Ram Prime with a Lee Hand Loader several years ago and tried it when I had trouble seating some Wolf primers. Mebbe 'cause I am pretty mechanically inclined and have been working with hand tools all my life, I get a better "feel" with the Ram Prime. There is enough leverage with my single stage press that very little exertion is needed, but I still have the "feel" of the primers seating and hitting bottom...

[Reload3006]

I have the RCBS ram priming unit also have and much prefer the RCBS had priming tool. You can or at least I can feel the primer seat. for me as long as its below flush its good enough. I have never noticed any results on paper or game by measuring and being sure to have a consistent depth. There are too many things working against you to get exact duplication every time. the primer pockets have tolerance (can make it better with a pocket uniforming reamer) and the primer cups themselves have tolerance. Not much but it all adds up.

[Mk42gunner]

I bought a RCBS hand priming tool about twenty years ago, after using both an RCBS and Lee tool. I liked the way the RCBS felt in my hand better, but the Lee does an acceptable job.

The RCBS uses standard shellholders, with the Lee you need special shell holders for the autoprime.

I have never used any ram prime unit, but they should be very consistent.

Robert

[bbq223]

Had a Lee hand primer, Lever snapped off. Got the RCBS, 20 yrs. havnt looked back.

[Four Fingers of Death]

I have both the Lee and RCBS hand primers as well as the Lee Ram Prime.

The Ram Prime is out and out the most consistent system as far as seating depth goes (if set up properly). I find that the handheld units are fine, but there is no allowance for seating depth adjustment (which in reality is not really an issue for most ammo). For my hign vel/pressure rifle ammo where accuracy is the mose essential factor, I use the Ram Prime.

I think the secret to using the Ram Prime is to set it up so that it can be consistent. I place the ram at it's uppermost point and adjust the unit down onto it slowly. This way, once you are at the desired seating depth for the primer, you lock off the die using the locknut. This way, you completely 'close' the unit when seating the primer and the ram stops at exactly the same position every single time.

The only real critisism of the Ram Prime I have is the fact that it is a bit fiddly and if the right technique is not used a primer can flip over and jam up the works. I solve this by only lowering the press ram until you see the primer column move and no more.

The main advantage of the Ram Prime, apart from consistency is teh fact that it uses the standard shellholder. The Lee hand prime units require a different and special shellholder for each case size. The main advantage of the RCBS unit is that no shellholders are needed as the jaws are spring operated and pretty much take all cases.

Changing over is easy with the Lee, slower with the RCBS. I have ended up with two of each, one each for large primers and one for small.

Make sure your technique is spot on and the Ram Prime will turn out quality ammo.

[Doc Highwall]

I have both the Lyman and RCBS and have even bought the newer RCBS press mounted with the APS primer strips.

The unit should be set up so the ram goes to top dead center when seating primers, then the only varriation will be with rim thickness, providing that the primer pockets are the same depth.

[Four Fingers of Death]

I have both the Lyman and RCBS and have even bought the newer RCBS press mounted with the APS primer strips.

The unit should be set up so the ram goes to top dead center when seating primers, then the only varriation will be with rim thickness, providing that the primer pockets are the same depth.

Top dead centre, thats what I meant when I was waffling on above. It makes for consistency.

[.357MAN]

I was able to get to store today and got the RCBS hand primer that uses the plastic thing that inserts into a regular shell holder, but I couldn't find a ram primer, and I am thinking I won't have to. After I swapped the hand crippling return spring in the RCBS hand primer with a more mild return spring I could almost feel the primer cup seating, and it's really hard to put excessive pressure on a primer.

After uniforming all my cases, I primed a few cases on the press and the depths where .005"-.007" under the case head. The primer's depths I got with the hand primer was exactly .005" I tried to get the hand primer to seat to .007" and it was hard. So I think the priming I have been doing with the press has been exerting excessive pressure on the primers, and even more before I sharpened the uniforming tool.

I am satisfied with this RCBS hand primer, and if this uniforming tool I have dulls again I'll be getting that carbide uniformer Bwana suggested.

Thank you all for the advise and recommendations.

.357MAN

[SkookumJeff]

I've been using the Lee Ram Prime tool for years and love it. This tool gives me more consistent priming than any other priming tool I own, hands down. I also clean my primer pockets before priming and on new (or new to me) brass I uniform the primer pocket with a primer pocket tool (cutter) before priming for the first time. I believe you can not get consistent primer seating in primer pockets that are not clean and uniform. In fact, I often wonder how effective priming is for those people who recycle their brass when reloading ammunition on progressive presses...assuming they don't manually clean the primer pockets on their brass before reloading?...

[canyon-ghost]

I bought the RCBS ram priming unit originally as a safety measure, I'd just started reloading and it looked like it would keep me from making a mistake. I set it to seat primers at .004" below the case head and never looked back. You get two rods, one for small primers and one for large (just install the two cups on top).

I now (recently) have another Rockchucker to seperately seat primers. It's handy and I don't mess with it any. It's extremely convenient.

No high primers, no problems. Ram primer is stout enough to shove a primer sideways in the pocket without it going off (never had one go off yet). It's good, really good.

Ron