C. Sharps (the other white meat) long

[Kenny Wasserburger]

Rich,

As Always your much more eloquent then I am! The Garbage truck oh boy that was a good one. As these days my sillywet ranking? in the tank dont shoot it much anymore after making AAA then bumped then bumped again after making AAA a second time? Lost interest still enjoy it, but not my passion anymore.

Longrange is where its at always was in truth. There, well My record is pretty clear as to my ranking.

I look forward to meeting this Sharps-shooter guy' someday perhaps he can show me how its done. Last match I just shot in, I only avg 1.4 MOA at 550 yards. Sides maybe he can give me And Steve Garbe some lessons on 100 rod shooting.

Sharpshooter, I must admit if I was to take the time, with A C. Sharps I might be able to get one to shoot like you mentioned.

However knowing what I do about the outfit I would not touch one let alone spend my hard earnd cash on one.

As for a Pedersoli, well built rifle for the money-a few years back yes! Not so now in my opinion not what they cost today. And to hold one feel heft one, they are cluby in my hands compared to a Shiloh or even a C Sharps.

Rich is correct in that C Sharps is no factory in Big Timber, were as Shiloh's, the foundry is right next door and they make everything there except growing the wood and the barrel steel. Much different kind of operation, and the people, the family, sorry there is no other firearm company in the world that compares.

To me this is a lifetime passion-persuit, I figure I cant afford to not have the best. I work hard to make a very good living and Play even harder. Dont Smoke-dont chew anymore, and Drink only in the company of some good friends and get to as many long range matches as I can.


you all have a good evening!

Kenny Wasserburger

[SharpsShooter]

[QUOTE=Kenny Wasserburger;149377]
I look forward to meeting this Sharps-shooter guy' someday perhaps he can show me how its done. Last match I just shot in, I only avg 1.4 MOA at 550 yards. Sides maybe he can give me And Steve Garbe some lessons on 100 rod shooting.

If I recall correctly, I made no reference whatsoever to "showing you how it is done" You imply that I did and it is both untrue and in poor taste. I made no claim to being even in your ranking or realm of ability or Garbes for that matter. Read the post again, it is in english.


Sharpshooter, I must admit if I was to take the time, with A C. Sharps I might be able to get one to shoot like you mentioned.

That was intended as a compliment to your skill as a rifleman. It is patently obvious that you have skillsets to accomplish the task. Notice that I can disagree with you and still give you a compliment,


I dislike the misrepresentation of my post. It was baiting of course and now you have my answer.

SS

[Kenny Wasserburger]

Sharps shooter,

ahhh never mind!

You know I set down typed out a real Eat----t remark and its not worth it my friend.

we all got our preference and well Rich and I just know more of the rest of the story is all.


Have a good evening,

Kenny Wasserburger

[MT Chambers]

I don't know about these folks that think they know it all and can slam other products, I'm sure that they are both good products and I'm sure that there are many self proclaimed experts that can shoot alot of diff. makes well? I'm sure there are people that own Meacham Hi-walls, or CPAs that would turn their nose up at a cheapo Shiloh or C. Sharps......It's just ones opinion and nobodys right and nobodys wrong. The main thing is you're happy with what you've got, and you don't have to prove anything, most of what you hear from the so-called experts is hot air anyways.As this thread has proven.

[John-n-va]

I have read this thread with much interest. One point I see popping up alot are folks complaining about the long wait for a Shiloh. I look at it this way.....I waited 14 months after finally deciding on Shiloh for my rifle. I actually got a little break by trading with another guy who wanted a little more time to come up with the money. During that 14 months I read everything I could possibly find on BPCR's. I learned to anneal cases and cast 540 grain boolits. I made informed decisions on what to get accessory wise and spent the time getting 100% ready for the day my rifle arrived. I fired up an old lathe at work and made myself a compression die and a cool reloading press mounted wad punch.

It was like being a kid again waiting for Christmas to come only it lasted over a year The wait wasn't a burden for me it was a fun time. I actually refined my boolit casting skills by starting to cast for my 9mm and an old 7.65 Carcano I had laying around. Before that I had only cast for muzzle loaders.

When the day finally came and I opened that case and there she was, it was Christmas again for an 8 year old getting his first BB rifle It has only gotten better since that day.

I came very close to buying another brand and was right down to planning a roadtrip to the nearest Cabelas but changed my mind at the last minute. I am confident that if had I decided on another rifle that I would have been just as happy.

Believe me, the wait and the resulting productive time was almost as much fun as finally holding my Shiloh.....almost

[NickSS]

Everyone has a preference and I love my Shiloh rifles but I also love my C. Sharps rifles. I hapen to have more C. Sharps rifles than Shilohs only due to the waiting period and my nature to want something right now. I got my first C. Sharps when the wait was two years for a Shiloh and four months for a C Sharps. Gun for gun I would take a Shiloh everytime but I have been totally happy with the shooting characteristics of the C. Sharps products. In fact I shot my 38-55 C. Sharps high wall at the last 200 yard reduced target silhouette match I went to last weekend and shot very well for me with it. However, my long range rifle is and will continue to be a 45-90 Shiloh Sharps long range express as its my most accurate long range rifle.

[montana_charlie]

During that 14 months I read everything I could possibly find on BPCR's. I learned to anneal cases and cast 540 grain boolits. I made informed decisions on what to get accessory wise and spent the time getting 100% ready for the day my rifle arrived. I fired up an old lathe at work and made myself a compression die and a cool reloading press mounted wad punch.

I consider that to be an admirable use of your time.
My experience was similar, but about half as long.

Having used your 'waiting time' well, I am sure that your first question on a shooting forum was to clear up a vague point, or to pick out the advantage of one 'trick' over another - something specific that the more experienced guys could speak to.

IMO, that beats the guy who opens up with 'Hi, all. Finally got my new (pick any name) and I need you guys to tell me everything I should to know about it. Don't be shy...all advice appreciated.'

That kind of opening is what you would expect from a guy who just won a Sharps (or something) as a door prize...not the guy who's been saving up (or waiting) for a year or more.

I guess this is a short rant about the instant gratification types, who want to get the whole education...all packaged up...before the next commercial.
CM

[John-n-va]

I appreciate the compliment Charlie. Although I think my first question over on the Shiloh forum was probably one that the old timers had answered a couple hundred times. Mr. Ray Newman quickly straightened me out with his vast knowledge and posted enough internet links to keep me reading for at least 12 months

I do feel that the waiting time was well spent and I feel like my rifle is a little more special since it was made for me....I had several conversations with Heather and Lucinda making some changes and getting some advice. You just can't get that type of interaction in a gun shop or especially Cabelas.

My 9 year old grandson already knows that granpa had that rifle special made and that someday it will be his. He went with me last weekend to shoot it and told me I would never hit that target so far away (100yds). He was amazed that I put 2 touching in the bull and 2 touching just outside the bull and a doggoned flier in the 9 ring. The 4 shots went into 1 3/8". Should get better as I am still working up a load. He kinda wants to shoot her but I don't think he's quite big enough for a 45-90 and don't want him to develop a flinch so young.

I have a good friend who lives in Ronan. He wants me to come out and pan some gold. Wish it wasn't a 3 or 4 day drive!!!! Howcome they put Montana so derned far away?

[montana_charlie]

I think my first question over on the Shiloh forum was probably one that the old timers had answered a couple hundred times.

They've ALL been answered a couple hundred times. You and I just never managed to find those answers...until we did a few things, and discovered the right question.

At least you didn't start off with a question that required a couple hundred answers...

How come they put Montana so derned far away?

That depends on where you start out from. I came up from Texas...but I took the long way.
CM

[Bear Claw]

I don't know about these folks that think they know it all and can slam other products, I'm sure that they are both good products and I'm sure that there are many self proclaimed experts that can shoot alot of diff. makes well? I'm sure there are people that own Meacham Hi-walls, or CPAs that would turn their nose up at a cheapo Shiloh or C. Sharps......It's just ones opinion and nobodys right and nobodys wrong. The main thing is you're happy with what you've got, and you don't have to prove anything, most of what you hear from the so-called experts is hot air anyways.As this thread has proven.

You are so right....

Isn't it great that you can come to places like this forum,read, ask questions, and learn from fine folks who dont get their nose up in the air just cause you can afford a gun or ask a dumn question with out getting put down.

In a sport thats always under attack you would think we could all stick together,but some still look down their nose's and make thinly vailed rude comments about ( you name it ) for whatever reason.

I know I have asked my share of dumn questions here, but then If I knew it all I wouldnt be here....I guess it's kinda like CB radio's " there is always some jerk who has to stir trouble or put people down to make up for their own falts.
OH well jerks come & go let's just ignore em

Bear Claw

[MLR]

I'm to busy having a blast shootin to be worried bout what others think of my rifle. I'm having fun and thats what counts.

Michael

[highwallbo]

I received my first Shilo about one year ago(Sporter #3 .45-2.1)Finest rifle being built in this country bar none.Ordered my second Shilo 5Nov05, on it's way to me now(LRE 32" half/round .40-2.5)
I think every time I get a new Shilo I'll order up another and always have one being built

[appleseedgunsmith]

Perhaps the issue of c. Sharps not placing in the top 3 has nothing to do with quality. Seems to me that the winners are a rather small, tight-knit group of repeating competitors, with a lot being from the western states (montana, idaho etc). Perhaps the issuse is nothing more than these select few simply choose NOT to use a c. Sharps. I've read many forums and even own a c. Sharps. And I can't say I've heard a lot of grumbling about their quality(except for maybe a fellow with a bent firing pin). They certainly use the same barrels as other winning guns have used. perhaps the folks in charge there don't have the best demeanor. Perhaps their business practices are questionable. Something tells me that if the mighty mlv or someone else WANTED to win with a c. Sharps......they could and would.

['74 sharps]

Perhaps the issue of c. Sharps not placing in the top 3 has nothing to do with quality. Seems to me that the winners are a rather small, tight-knit group of repeating competitors, with a lot being from the western states (montana, idaho etc). Perhaps the issuse is nothing more than these select few simply choose NOT to use a c. Sharps. I've read many forums and even own a c. Sharps. And I can't say I've heard a lot of grumbling about their quality(except for maybe a fellow with a bent firing pin). They certainly use the same barrels as other winning guns have used. perhaps the folks in charge there don't have the best demeanor. Perhaps their business practices are questionable. Something tells me that if the mighty mlv or someone else WANTED to win with a c. Sharps......they could and would.

+1 I was looking into buying a C Sharps last year at around Christmas time when they were doing a 10% discount. Had several communications from them, and all
was handled by them very well. Decided not to order, as at that time, I did not have a good handle on bp shooting. Do now, as my Eyetalian '74's (Pedersoli) will shoot moa @ 200yds ( my longest available ) if I do my part. I'm happy as a duck in water with those rifles, and will stick with them.

[appleseedgunsmith]

Let's put the pepsi vs. Coke challenge to an end. How about a quantitative analysis of the differences between c. Sharps and shiloh INCLUDING accuracy, tolerances, durability. Perhaps a torture test. Someone out there with the money and moxie to make it happen & publish it? Whaddya say MLV? Kenny?..........Bueller?

[Kenny Wasserburger]

Gee Whiz,

Last time I posted on this Thread was 5 years ago fellas.

3 years ago I found out I was terminally Ill. I been busy with that. I been busy shooting too, FWIW, I wore out 2 shiloh barrels and factory replaced both at no charge-Original Owner. You will not get that at any other maker. Period.
All are fine Rifles C Sharps I own one a 22, I do not own a Pedersoli, but they are a good rifle no longer the bargin they used to be with Euro vrs Dollar thing.
A little FYI: I have won 2 of those 5@200 that Pedersoli used to host at Raton with My old Shiloh 45-110, one with a Grease Groove Bullet and 1 with Paper patch. The PP Group is still a world Record in that match for Paper patch btw, 2008. My good friend Jim Kidwell has won 3 or maybe 4 of them with his Shiloh 40-65. Something of a testimony of the Accuracy of a Shiloh, however, it also boils down, in the end to the quality of the ammo, and the Shooter. One thing to note, A Pedersoil has never won that match?

Last major Match I placed well in was Phoenix in March this year, the end of the first day 2 of the top 4 rifles where Shiloh's the others were Rem Hepburn and a Original Sharps Borchardt, I do believe with Badger Barrels. I also know at the end of the match, there were at least 3 shilohs in the top 9 the #2 Slot was a Shiloh so was #8 and #9, and a the hepburn and Borchardt along with a browning or two. No C. sharps no Pedersolis. A few weeks later I spent 4 days in CCU at the local hospt, with Pneumonia, been rough year since.

Give it a rest.

The Lunger

[cal50]

Bear Claw:

Bill Goodman, at <www.goodmanguns.com>, or (406) 587-3131 has standing orders with Shiloh and keeps several of them in stock at any time for immediate delivery. Worth checking with him to see what he has on hand.

floodgate

+1 on the Mr.Goodman option.

I currently have a #1 sporter in 45-110 on order and should arrive shortly.

I always get a kick out of the various Sharps threads becasue they almost always gravitate to which one makes the "best" rifle. That is a somewhat loaded term and needs a little more specificity.

Shiloh does make an extreme quality / handmade rifle in their one and only shop. They make the entire gun minus growing the wood. Its truly a handmade item.
The fit of parts and wood is the standard to which others are compared.

C. Sharps makes excellent guns as well. I think they use Badger barrels now and are top quality. Fit in finish is top notch and perhaps a tad below Shiloh. Before C.Sharps moved there are some early guns that have a generous amount of free bore in the breech area which can affect accuracy if your a target puncher.

Pedersoli-

A LOT of what I call Sharps snobs like to slam the Pedersoli rifles and I always get a kick out of it. Pedersoli makes excellent guns as well. Their barrels are top quality and tapered / choked at the muzzle. Their receiver are FORGED which neither the Shiloh or C.Sharps rifle are ( cast steel). Pedersoli guns hold numerous records and they are solid competitive rifles. They use to be a good value but recently their price has been creeping up. The Pedersoli wood is nice but not as nice as either of the other US makers. Fit & finish is very good and not "as nice" as the other guys.

I own a Pedersoli Quigely in 45-90 and its an excellent rifle. I have my Shiloh 45-110 on order becasue I want the 110 and had some play money and wanted a Shiloh because I admire precision and quality (toolmaker by trade).

I like them all , they all shoot better than most guys behind it and like to see people shooting anything Vs talking about who's is better.

[gandydancer]

the owner of C Sharps (John Schofstall) used to be co owner of Shiloh arms with Wolfgang. at one time both C Sharps & Shiloh shops where about 200 yards apart from one another in Big Timber Montana not sure if that is the case today. and C.Sharps use Badger barrels on their rifles. Shiloh makes their own barrels in house. (thanks to cal50 for pointing this out to me) and one is as good as the other in MO & american made. GD

[cal50]

the owner of C Sharps (John Schofstall) used to be co owner of Shiloh arms with Wolfgang today both C Sharps & Shiloh shops are about 200 yards apart from one another in Big Timber Montana. and they both use Badger barrels on their rifles and one is as good as the other in MO & american made. GD

Shiloh has their own rifling equipment and I am pretty certain they make their own barrels.

[gandydancer]

Shiloh has their own rifling equipment and I am pretty certain they make their own barrels.

you are right. the last time I was in either shop was almost 20 years ago. GD PS I also like the ones made in Italy they shot very well.