Pat's 45 PB GC Maker.

[PatMarlin]

Believe me... I could say one helluva lot more than that, but I think I have made my point.

I'm sorry Mark, but I just don't have the time and energy to deal with manipulative folks who will not accept a refund, but yet reserve the right to attempt to demean my character and integrity online here.

One (1) other member here at CB, and he knows who he is, has gone as far as reporting me to the Feds with a frivolous mail fraud complaint because he has not yet received his 45 Cal dies, knowing the fact that pre orders from me buy you a position inline for my new caliber dies when they go into production, are manufactured, available to ship. Yet he will NOT accept a refund.

I made the mistake of telling Mrs. Marlin about the fraud complaint and it about broke her heart. As if this undertaking hasn't been hard enough on her.

Here again are my Terms regarding purchases:

Terms and conditions:
You can wait until I have stock on hand or you can send payment to pre-order. A pre-order gets you a position inline. It's your choice. Prepaid orders ship first, in the order they are received. I'm a one man CNC shop and working daily to add new calibers, increase production and shorten wait times, but I cannot give a ship date. Calibers in production ship within 15-20 business days on average barring any unforeseen delays. If you can't wait for me, please hold off on ordering.

Refunds are issued within 30 business days.

If you would like to proceed with an order, send me your mailing address (and brand of press) and I'll send an order confirmation with instructions.

Kindest regards,

Pat

Patmarlins™ -Specialty Products for Casting and Reloading
West Coast Engineering
http://www.Patmarlins.com

[ReloaderFred]

Good products are worth waiting for. Several years ago a very good friend of mine ordered a Sharps rifle, knowing that there was a 4 year wait at the time. About 2 years into it, a guy called him out of the blue and offered him $500 for his place in line. He naturally refused the offer and when he received his rifle 2 years later, he said that refusing the offer from the stranger was one of the best things he ever did, since the rifle is a joy to shoot and behold.

I've received two of Pat's Check Maker dies and I'm really happy with them. I'm waiting for the third one, and I ordered it knowing that they weren't in production yet, and that it would be sometime before I would receive it. That's just part of doing business as far as I'm concerned. I'm used to waiting for what I want, since I grew up before the age of instant gratification. Patience is a virtue that many of the current generation lacks, and that's sad.

It does absolutely no good to gnash your teeth, and posture around, if the product hasn't been made yet. You can't get what doesn't exist. Pat was very clear that he was taking pre-orders for some of his products. If a person doesn't read all the words in the post that state that, then it's not Pat's fault. It's the fault of the reader, period.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[7of7]

Good thing he didn't order a Boeing 787... I'd sure hate to hear him for as long as it has taken to get the first plane delivered... 3 years later than planned..
With Pat's misfortune with the weather, machine difficulties and then lighning strikes.. I'd say he is doing well on catching up on his backlog..
I too am anxiously awaiting a 45 PB... not upset, just anxious to get it in my hot little hands because I know it is going to be really good..
I am very happy to have received my new 35 cal checkmaker (thanks Pat) so now I can get to work on putting checks on some of my other bullets..

If it were me, I wouldn't be giving some people choices in whether they get a refund or wait for the product.
To insinuate that the delay is the result of being dishonest is way out of line.. I don't think for an instant that there is anything dishonest going on here..
I am sure that had Pat not had the setbacks earlier this year, we'd have our 45PB checkmakers.. The good thing, is Pat isn't a quitter, as easy as it would be for him to just quit this venture.. he isn't. That says alot about his character.

Thanks Pat, keep on putting out the good stuff..

[Markbo]

You know how you build character and a reputation and prove your integrity? By saying what you are going to do and doing what you say. I personally have never insinuated you are dishonest but I will not join the line of sycophants who sing your praises incessantly when I have been told - by you Pat - 'Any day, any day" and it has been a year.

You have said over and over what you are going to do and you have never done it. Don't blame me for that. I don't believe in holding grudges or getting back at people, but I won't be bullied into not speaking the truth either.

Fred you are absolutely right that you can't get what doesn't exist, but he sure took my money with promises of it. Used to be a man promised a product and took your money he got the product even if it was a loss to him or he didn't take your money. That's how I do business. I don't know if taking people's money to pay for other people's stuff is illegal or not, but it sure sounds like a ponzi scheme... doesn't it?

Pat, I am manipulating nothing. I am posting my own personal experiences here. Everything I have said is fact. Prove me wrong! I dare you! To have to ask for a PM to "find" my information to issue a refund is proof to me that you are so disorganized you don't know who is in line where for what! So if you feel you are being attacked, then do the right thing... do what you say you are going to do, that's all!

Or is that asking too much?

[buck1]

I never recived a delivery date on my stuff.

I too will post my personal experience With Pat. I have a pile of special made stuff I bought and paid for from Pat. These things are made very well and often offered only by Pat.
Some things came very fast and some took quite a wile. All things work great. The stuff pat sells is basicly custom grade with every part being concived, tested, and made one at a time by the inventer.
I have other things on order from OTHER craftsman here on this board that have been on order for MORE than a year. But thats ok. When its my turn my order will be filled. To request special made tools requires paticence and understanding and good old basic manners.

BY THE WAY....


sycophants n. A servile self-seeker who attempts to win favor by flattering influential people.

That term is just wrongly used.
Its a insulting word to be sure, and I do'nt think Pat will be sending free dies to everyone who supports him.
How about replacing it with.."satisfied customers".
At least then the statement would be true.

[GUINEAPIG WITH AK47]

Just wanted to post MY experience with Pat...Ordered a 35PB, asked for the occasional update, and it took as long as it took.

Got it, tried it, will order or my other calibers when I can afford it. They'll take as long as they take and ARE WORTH THE WAIT.

Kyle

[PatMarlin]

I am sure that had Pat not had the setbacks earlier this year, we'd have our 45PB checkmakers.. The good thing, is Pat isn't a quitter, as easy as it would be for him to just quit this venture.. he isn't. That says alot about his character.

Thanks Pat, keep on putting out the good stuff..

Ding, ding, ding! ... 7 gets it. I've suffered close to a total of 4.5 months downtime with my main CNC lathe this year, and that is the 45 holdup. Enough to make anyone quit.

Unfortunately, I cannot remember everyone by their CB handle. So many members, sometimes it's hard to connect the name. I don't think organization has anything to do with it.

Thanks for all the kind words and support Guys. You have my gratitude and loyalty.

I just can't please everyone in this business. Thankfully, I please most all of them.

[PatMarlin]

You know how you build character and a reputation and prove your integrity? By saying what you are going to do and doing what you say.

And I have just done what I said I was going to do. Enough Mark.

Your pre-order payment for your 45PB cal dies has just been refunded to your PayPal account. Check your email. I added 10% to cover any loss or suffering you may have had, or interest that may have accrued these past months.

Hopefully that will relieve your thoughts of a "Ponzi" scheme as well.

[roundgun]

My .357 rossi 92 Keeps asking me, dad Is it here yet? I just tell her, not just yet honey, but soon. And when is does arrive, the reward will be that much sweeter. Then we gather round the computer and page through all the beautiful custom bullet molds on the CAST BOOLITS website and dream of wonderful days of using our own hand made gas checked boolits, courtesy of MR PAT, to bust big hogs!!! Thanks again Pat for the fluffy dreams.

[BD]

Some of you guys need to lighten up a little on Pat. He's not some big company with 10,000 sg ft of shop space and 100 employees. He's a one man show making something to order that is not readily available anywhere else. And, he's making them in different sizes as well as "custom" to order. If you can't afford to let your pre-order money hang out there until the dies get made, then don't. Buy checks, or a free chex tool instead.
BD

[Beekeeper]

I do not post here much anymore but I do read most of the posts.
I have watched Pat struggle with this since the beginning.
It was originally intended to be something for a retired friend to do.
After major health problems Pat took over the work.
No shop, no machinery. no stock, and no machining knowledge.
I ordered a .30 cal checkmaker from him and watched the struggles he went through to get them done, same with the .32 and .35 cal ones I now have.
Having been in business for myself , had I been in Pats shoes I would have refunded everyones money and said enough is enough!

Pat didn'tand has done great things, aquiring Machines, Building a shop ( no small task in itsself) and learning CNC for lathe and Mill.
Some of you doubters should try to understand CNC programming. Maybe then you will understand the learning curve you have to go through.!

I have a .45 checkmaker on order and it will get here when it gets here and it will make me one item less dependent on someone else.

My father taught me many things during his lifetime.
One I have never forgotten is " before you condem another walk a mile in his shoes"
Maybe some of you should try it.

As for me I am content to wait for my checkmaker as it will get here when it gets here.

So for all you people that think it is easy," Get a Life", as in todays world of instant gratification it still takes time to get something of quality.
If you want junk go to home depot or walmart

Nugh said, Hang in there Pat"

Now I will go away again and forget how to post here.


beekeeper

[Markbo]

And I have just done what I said I was going to do. Enough Mark.

Your pre-order payment for your 45PB cal dies has just been refunded to your PayPal account. Check your email. I added 10% to cover any loss or suffering you may have had, or interest that may have accrued these past months.

Hopefully that will relieve your thoughts of a "Ponzi" scheme as well.

I thought I was pretty clear that I would hold out Pat. Now I have to go research an account I don't even use anymore. Thanks for that too I guess. I am glad that other happier customers are posting too... gives a more balanced view. I suppose if I had orde3rd a custom Sharps rifle I would have been prepared to wait a year or more. Then again... they don't promise it "any day now", do they?

buck1, I'll tell you what. You choose your words and I'll choose mine. I'm old enough I don't need a grammer lesson from you.

[carlsonwayne]

I'm new to this site, and have been reading a LOT of different threads. I have never seen anyone whine so much over a few bucks and extra time to get the product. I haven't ordered anything from Pat yet, but mark my words, as soon as I can afford it I will. Very few people who do work like he does offer a 100% no BS warranty, and offer to provide as much assistance as possible if it is needed. And then to whine that the money was returned!!!!!. Pat, I am impressed at your patience with this man, and for refunding more than he paid. When I can afford to place my order (30 cal, 35 cal, 40 cal, 44 cal, 45 cal, and 50 cal) you can rest assured that I will be content to wait my turn, even if it takes a year or more. I will be ordering both standard check makers and Plain Base. I'll probably have to order one or two at a time, but I will. Thank you to all who have spoken highly of Pat and his products, it is partly your fault that he will be taking my money.

[PatMarlin]

I see I've made the big time on the net. Bernie Madoff, look out! ...


http://patmarlins.pissedconsumer.com...922263574.html


Uh oh...

Now I'm part of the G-Pal fraud in California. Hmmm.. I didn't know I accepted GunPal? Learn somethin' new every day ..

http://patmarlins.pissedconsumer.com...924263878.html

[ReloaderFred]

Well Pat, there are now two postings refuting the original post.

Fred

[carlsonwayne]

Maybe someone could post a link to this thread so anyone who sees that can read the truth for themselves?? I just can't believe anyone would whine so much when Pat has done his best to get things worked out. Its a shame the whiner can do things like that with no proof, or even posting his name. If I were a customer yet, I would post everything I could to prove that that whiner is lying. Now I really wish I could afford at least one tool, just so I could be there supporting Pat. When I contacted him to check on prices, he made it clear that things are first paid, first shipped. If you can't wait, don't order. Now why couldn't Mr. whiny liar comprehend that. My 10 year old did.

[carlsonwayne]

Quote: "Terms and conditions:
You can wait until I have stock on hand or you can send payment to pre-order. It's your choice. Prepaid orders ship first, in the order they are received. I'm a one man CNC shop and working daily to add new calibers and shorten wait times, but I cannot give a ship date on pre-order new calibers. Calibers in production ship within 15 business days on average. If you can't wait for me, don't pre-order please." How much more clear is that???? Like I said, my ten year old understood it.

[mold maker]

I ordered a check maker from Pat early on, in his venture. Yes it took longer than either he or I expected. I love the tool and have made a bucket of checks.
Would I do it again?? HECK YEAH.
The very next time I need more than ,a few checks ,in another caliber, Pat will get an order.
Pat isn't a re-seller, He hands onmakes the darn things, one at a time.

[mold maker]

I ordered a check maker from Pat way back in the beginning of his venture.
Yes it took lots longer than either he or I expected.
Would I do it again??? HECK YEAH! The very next time I need more than a few checks for a new caliber, Pat will get an order.
Pat isn't a warehouse re-seller. He hands on makes these things one piece at a time, per order.
You'll have to be patient, and wait your turn, but in the end, you'll be satisfied, and the results will be great.
If you simply have to have it yesterday,,,, Ya should have ordered it a long time ago.

[PatMarlin]

Thank you for your comments guys.

I'm working my hardest here. I can see why so many guys that start up these cottage manufacturing business's in the shooting industry just plain quit.

I'm truly tied of excuses. I don't make excuses, I simply try to explain the issues and hurdles I have to overcome on a daily basis. It's hard enough to do this in a city with grid power, suppliers, and a competent USPS mail service. All of which is another battle I have to deal with daily by not having the benefit of.

But to some folks it makes no matter. They want their order. I understand that, but I don't understand the flat out rudeness of some people.