My homemade black powder

[almar]

I don't know what to say....this is 78-12-10 with the brown charcoal...the 1860 colt felt like it was going to jump out of my hand compared to the other tests. I think I got my recipe down now.




density was only at 24.6 gr/30 gr vol though i compressed it too dry. maybe that could be the reason...but dang.

[almar]

The next step will be to increase the density by wetting the powder more before compressing and now that i think this is it for messing around with powder ratios and charcoal charr i can deviate from my baseline and reduce the grain size dispersion by excluding anything under 50 mesh.

[SeaMonkey]

The Waltham Abbey Book, which you graciously provided the link for, is truly a treasure trove of Black Powder Information.

It predicts the sort of performance you've just experienced with your Charcoal.

Quote from the Book:

Underburnt charcoal, that is, charcoal prepared at a very low temperature, is at once known
by its reddish brown colour; overburnt charcoal by its hardness and density. The former is
greatly more inflammable than the latter...

Underburnt charcoal has found favour for some small-arms powders amongst private makers
in this country and in France. It certainly appears to render the powder more inflammable
and consequently quicker...

That underburnt charcoal produces a very marked effect there can be no doubt. Recent
experiments at Waltham Abbey have proved that if two powders be made identical in
all qualities, the one with black charcoal, the other with red or underburnt charcoal,
the latter will give a higher velocity to the projectile than the former.

Great work Almar! You've proved the book to be absolutely correct.

Another important quote from the Book:

It is of the highest importance that the charring of the wood should always be conducted
as nearly as possible at the same temperature, for the chemical composition of the charcoal
and the temperature at which it will ignite is undoubtedly affected by the temperature at
which it has been charred. Charcoal prepared at a low temperature is softer, more inflammable,
and contains more gaseous elements than charcoal prepared at a higher heat...

Thanks to your work and the Book, we all now know the SECRET to making really effective Charcoal!

Quote from DoubleBuck:

You post some cool stuff, bud! Those were both a couple of good reads.

All I can say is The Web has some amazing stuff if one is able to find it!

Today all of the stuff that was so hard to find a few years ago is readily available for perusal.

My thanks to the people who take the time to create the informative web pages which are so very helpful.

[almar]

Seamonkey, thank you, i love that book, i even ordered a printed copy!

[Maven]

According to the lat E.H. Harrison, brown powder also substituted sodium nitrate for potassium nitrate since NaNO3 was cheaper at the time brown powder was patented [by Lamont DuPont] in 1857. It is markedly more energetict han KNO3-based BP (and more hygroscopic) and was largely used in mining applications. This is from the NRA publication, Handloading edited by Wm. Davis, Jr., p, 23.

[almar]

According to the lat E.H. Harrison, brown powder also substituted sodium nitrate for potassium nitrate since NaNO3 was cheaper at the time brown powder was patented [by Lamont DuPont] in 1857. It is markedly more energetict han KNO3-based BP (and more hygroscopic) and was largely used in mining applications. This is from the NRA publication, Handloading edited by Wm. Davis, Jr., p, 23.

Thats an interesting piece but after trying this stuff i made today, i don't think i want more energetic, im already 100 fps over the swiss powder with the same charge or 26% more energetic. I am actually toning it down by reducing the amount of small particles in my 3f some and maybe give it less of a recoil and consistency. im not sure these pistols were meant for too much power. This was only a light 220 conical with 25 grains, i have modern flat top 250 grain conical that will take a 30 grain charge under it. Now imagine my dragoon or walker with 40 or so grains.

[mmb617]

After my unsuccessful attempt at making charcoal yesterday I did get some made today. How good it will be remains to be seen. At least it all cooked, is shiny black and breaks apart with my hands. I stuffed a one gallon paint can with 1/2 of a cedar fence picket and it made enough that it will take quite a few loads in my HF ball mill to get it all ground up. Two hours per batch seems to grind it all very fine.

I think I have everything I need in hand now except the potassium nitrate and Fed Ex has had it for almost a week now so I'm hoping it won't be much longer. With any luck I'll turn out my first batch of black powder sometime this week.

[SeaMonkey]

Almar,

How would you rate the "cleanliness" burning of your Brown Powder?

Any better or any worse than Black?

Would a reduced Brown Powder load result in performance closer to what the Swiss Powder is noted for?


Mmb617,

We too are eagerly waiting to see how your first batch turns out!

[almar]

Ill test again tomorrow, first impression is that its similar, i used less charcoal in this mix and more potassium for a cleaner burn. But not much difference.

[Vettepilot]

I don't know what to say....this is 78-12-10 with the brown charcoal...the 1860 colt felt like it was going to jump out of my hand compared to the other tests. I think I got my recipe down now.




density was only at 24.6 gr/30 gr vol though i compressed it too dry. maybe that could be the reason...but dang.

HOLY SMOKES ALMAR!! That's unreal!

Yeah, you keep going and pressures are going to be a concern, if they aren't now. This is just flat amazing!

Ok, I gotta go ahead and build a kiln!!

Vettepilot

[Vettepilot]

I missed it. Can someone point me to the Waltham Abbey book again??

Thanks!
Vettepilot

[almar]

I missed it. Can someone point me to the Waltham Abbey book again??

Thanks!
Vettepilot

https://books.google.com/books?id=F6...page&q&f=false

You can download the pdf with the e book free button. Its also on amazon in print form.

[lbrowning]

I have found a ton of good ideas in this lengthy thread. Wondering if anyone has any creative ideas for pressing pucks. I'm thinking of homebrew or cheap hardware store items. Anyone want to share?

[DoubleBuck]

Congratulations Almar! I'm glad to hear you kicked it! It gives a guy something to strive for, sure enough!

[ChrisPer]

mmb617, good work! I don't ball mill my charcoal, I crush it in the pot with any suitable tool, then sieve it and grind the coarse from the sieve in a blade type spice/coffee mill. Although I most recently used a kitchen sieve, the fines just fall through and much of it is down at 60# - 100# (which I have also used). Same for KNO3 and S.

[ChrisPer]

lbrowning, I made a press like the one Skylighter built with 4 threaded rods, 2 thick steel plates and a hydraulic bottle jack. By the time I bought the threaded rods and nuts retail, and an 8 tonne jack on special at Auto Mart, I was in about $150. The steel plates were scrounged from a street rubbish collection pile a while back.

For the puck die I started off using 50mm white pipe with plugs of sand-filled resin cast in the white pipe, as the pistons. It was reinforced with 3 steel hose clamps around a joiner collar. It split. I went to a custom aluminum shop and bought 5mm thick Aluminum tube, 2" internal diameter. Now I am a lot less worried about the tube busting open, but my resin pistons are not as durable as I would like. It would be good to step up to a turned die and piston.
I separate my pressed pucks by putting scissor-cut aluminum spacers (coke can or similar) in about 4-5 mm apart (ie insert spacer, scoop damp meal, insert spacers, scoop meal, repeat 4 to 6 times).

My best suggestion to get a cheaper press, is to make friends. The friend who helped me drill the plates had TWO floor stand shop presses right there in his garage workshop, mostly never used. There are always retired people not using their workshops or selling up to move into smaller homes, and if their workshops have a press they may just want them out of the way.

But please tell US: have you discovered cool things in your search? What, and where?

[Vettepilot]

Say, do you guys run your powder granulated by moistening and screening, through grading screens when it dries, or do you only screen grade your pressed powder??

I was watching a bunch of you tube vids about black powder with my daughter this evening, just for grins. The only ones screen grading were the ones that pressed their powder. I noticed many, if not most of them were using their granulated powder without screen grading it. Once the powder was dry, they went straight to loading and shooting it.

That surprised me and made me wonder what you guys do. I screen grade all my powder; granulated or pressed.

Vettepilot

[Nobade]

I mill, press into pucks, break them up, grind, then run through screens. Anything too big gets ground again and anything too small gets pressed into another puck. I had been letting the pucks dry for a while but yesterday I tried breaking them up right after pressing and they behaved pretty much the same way, so from now on I'll do it that way. Once it's granulated it will dry a lot faster so I should have usable powder in a few days instead of months. One benefit of living in NM, stuff dries out pretty fast!

[Eddie2002]

Vettapilot, you asked "do you guys run your powder granulated by moistening and screening, through grading screens when it dries, or do you only screen grade your pressed powder??"

I'm strictly a screened powder guy and have found that screening and grading my finished powder give a more consistent result. Since my screened powder is only about 60% by weight when compared to the commercial stuff I've found that a courser grade seems to work better. Not sure why but the course screened powder burns better in my .50 calibers. My best results are with powder which I classify as a 1F - 2F and gives a faster burn than my smaller grained 3F down to fines home made. One thing I've found with screened powder is that I need to pack the load down hard with the patched ball to get decent results. Anything smaller than 2F gets reprocessed and screened a second time.

I'm not shooting enough to justify spending the cash needed to move up to pressed and corned powder manufacturing which is a bummer cause it looks like fun.
Going to give making some brown charcoal a try out of Brazilian Pepper for my next batch just to see if I can.

[HamGunner]

I made up two stainless steel screen frames that ended up 10 1/2"" square inside the frames. One #20 and the other #40 mesh. I crush and grind the raw ingredients separately and screen through the #40 screen before mixing and milling. After pressing and grinding I screen through both screens stacked with the #20 on top to give me around 2F and larger, 3F, and finer flour that I just dump back into the next batch for pressing. I normally just keep the 3F size for my small calibers, but have saved a bit of 2F and approximately 4F just to have in stock just in case. I now mill the granulated powder to help make it more consistent in size and then of course screen again with a small fan to the side to separate the dust from the granules as the granules fall into my large catch pan leaving me with a fairly clean and more uniform size granule powder and a small pile of dust flour for recycling.

My last batch of Brown Willow that I cooked a bit longer and lower temperature came out under 5% ash, but was not quite as brown as Almar's. I compared it to my almost 10% ash overcooked Black Willow charcoal powder and it gave almost the same velocity. The lower ash powder I did mill the granules and so it shot more accurately than the other batch that was just screened once. For my next batch, I will be milling longer and pressing a bit longer and milling the granules a bit longer as well to see what improvement in velocity I might get. I am already faster than Goex, so I am happy enough at that, but like most everyone else, I want to reach out for more perfection. That is part of the fun of making the stuff. I will be going out soon to try and find some of the Alder Buckthorn (Rhamnus Fangula) that is the same as the European " Black Dogwood". I will likely end up with more powder than I really need, but heck it keeps well enough in a sealed can.