My homemade black powder

[trooperdan]

Vettepilot, I just sent you a PM. BTW, a HB barrel is harbor freight with fat fingers! Do you use your tumbler to make BP?

[LAGS]

I have been using a HF single drum tumbler for over 5 years without ANY problems.
I use it to make all my powder , and to tumble most of my cast Round Balls to remove the Sprue.
The lid has never popped off.
The tumbler limit is 3 lb.
So I do 2 1/2 lb of lead balls to 1/2 lb of powder meal or each of one of my three chemicals.
To tumble just the lead balls to make them more consistent , I tumble 3 lb of lead balls overnight.
I will be switching to media other than lead for milling my powder using either Zinc Balls or some kind of brass like zinc filled casings or zinc filled copper tubing media.
But I have found that things mill more consistent with Ball Media rather than odd shaped media.
I just haven't had the time to make up some molds and cast the ball media out of brass.

[trooperdan]

Great news Lags, thanks for that info! I am running my first charge right now, half way thru a 24 hrs run. I have 200 gms of comp and nearly 3 pounds of balls so I'll cut that down a bit in the future. I'm using a mix of sizes of powder coated lead balls, not sure the powder coat will stand up, this will be my first test.

[LAGS]

From a test I did recently, The PC will wear off the lead balls over time.
That will leave PC dust in your powder.
I would think that the contaminated powder might smell kind of funky when it burns.
I don't know if that burning dust in that small of amount will be toxic in any way.

[Vettepilot]

Hmmm... don't think that powder coat will hold up, sorry to say.

Vettepilot

[Vettepilot]

Ha! You were posting while I was typing Lags...

;~)

Vettepilot

[DoubleBuck]

I've been using a HF double drum tumbler, for about five years and several pounds of powder, and I'm with Lags, that I've never had a problem with mine. Well, one time, actually, because of my extreme stupidity. I had some powder that had drawn a little moisture, and was wanting to cake in the drum. I pulled it off the drive, and shook it violently and didn't hold the end and it blew off and made a minor miracle of a mess. But, it probably took five or six 'G's of pressure on a half pound of powder and three pounds of balls. I've since shaken it harder and longer, but I have NEVER forgot to cap my fingers over the top again. You CAN make a HF tumbler drum lid come off, if you choose to be as ignorant as I was. I can also tear up a steel ball, with a rubber mallet...

[HighUintas]

Yes I'd love to see someone blow up a HF barrel!

I've not had my lids come off yet. I think they're fairly snug but would pop off very easily if ignited or if I were to shake it as Doublebuck did.

Also, be careful doing that! There was an incident with a n amateur pyro guy who was shaking his jar to get it uncaked and it blew in his hand. He was using glass marbles.... So go figure. But, there could of course be a couple grains of sand/dirt/whatever that get in there and spark when you shake it.

[HighUintas]

I'm excited to get some more testing done sometime soon, but don't know if I'll get to very soon. Been really busy and hunting season is so close! I've got my hands in too many pots

[ChrisPer]

I rebuilt my tumbler. First tumbling run successful, now pucking with the thick Al tube cylinders - YES!

[HamGunner]

I make my own.
I managed to read most of this posted thread about producing ones own powder and there is plenty of information here to make it plain as day how to make your own Black Powder. So with the little knowledge I already had and the huge amount I gained here, I got it done. Feel free to critique any of my methods. My powder works very well and actually shows a bit more velocity by weight than Goex. My end product looks very much like the Goex or Elephant powder that I have had and used for years except that it is lighter colored since I do not graphite coat mine. Comparison tests show that mine is slightly lighter per volume, but when compared by weight, mine actually produces more velocity than the commercial powders. I start with grinding and screening (40 mesh) all the ingredients separately until they are a very fine flour. The high grade potassium nitrate that I buy is in prill form as it is fairly cheap to buy, but it does take a bit to grind it down. The really pure sulfur is fairly fine to begin with and I buy it in 5 lb. bags. The charcoal I make myself out of dried and debarked Black Willow branches (usually dead air dried branches) as per knowledge I learned on this forum. I already had air float commercial fireworks grade charcoal and I tried a bit of it in a 1/2 lb. batch before I gathered up some Black Willow, but it certainly is not the quality of Black Willow. It is dirtier and the velocity is lower. Fine for fireworks, but not for burning in firearms. I use a 20 lb. Lee casting furnace with a couple of pounds of lead in the the bottom for my metal charcoaling container to float on to make the charcoal. A 1 lb. coffee can fits inside just fine and with one 8 penny nail sized hole in the center of the resealable lid I can produce some high grade charcoal out of dried Black Willow branches. I heat it until the escaping smoke gas becomes flammable and then light the gas. I try to keep the heat under 750 degrees while charring. When the flame goes out from the lack of escaping flammable gas, the char is done. I grind the char in a small hand meat grinder and screen it. Any larger granules that will not pass a 40 mesh screen I grind in an electric coffee grinder and screen again. Next, after all the ingredients are screened, I blend enough together to make a 2 lb. batch and place in my rubber lined brass tumbler along with a good amount of 12 gauge lead ball as well as some 36 cal. ball and mill for 5-6 hours. I run the mill outside, but I think the likely hood of an explosion is very slight as long as one does not place anything in the mill that will spark, no matter what the naysayers will tell you, I think this is safe enough. It apparently is and has been done like this by thousands of people and I have never heard about a mishap. I do keep the mill running in a safe place, just in case. Next up is the compression of the black powder flour after sifting out the lead milling balls. I have a 3" diameter by about 2 1/2'' steel die and an aluminum mandrel to compress the powder into thin wafers. The flour is moistened very slightly with a spray bottle of water until it will just start to form into a ball with hand pressure. Not much moisture is needed as I have read and I found out just how much very slightly moistened actually means as my first 1/2 lb., using the commercial fireworks airfloat charcoal, had just a bit of moisture pressed out during the compression stage. Now for the compression stage. The SLIGHTLY dampened flour I placed in the compression die in three layers with thin plastic discs separating the layers. Under 12 tons of pressure in my hydraulic press ( according to the math that someone already done, requires at least 3K lb. psi, which is a bit over 10 tons for a 3" die) the three layers of flour are compressed down from 2 1/2" into thin wafers or (pucks) that are each perhaps 1/4" thick. They are allowed to dry for a few days and then I bust them up with a ball peen hammer into small enough pieces so that I can grind them in a (CERAMIC BURR) coffee grinder for screening. Steel burr grinders are not to be used. (More good advice that I read here.) I use a 20 mesh screen to separate out the larger granules and anything that does not pass through the 40 mesh is just right at FFFG size. The larger granules can be ground again or used for FFG. The flour that passes through the 40 mesh can be moistened and compressed again for another run through the ceramic burr grinder. I find that about 60% can be used as proper sized granules per grind. I have not actually worked out my cost down to the Penney, but I think I can produce 1 lb. for around $6. Since the granules are not coated with graphite, they are slightly lighter colored and perhaps a slight amount softer than commercial powder and may perhaps absorb moisture more readily? But that does not seem to create a problem and I have not noticed all that much of a difference except that my powder does have a very slight amount of dust in it. Just enough dust to notice. I suspect that the dust is lost from commercial powder during their coating of the graphite. As for moisture absorption, I really doubt it is a problem at all if stored properly. Like the old pioneers always said, Keep Your Powder Dry. Thanks to all who contributed to this forum subject with their knowledge and advice. Again, feel free to critique my methods or offer any advice.

Edit: Oh, and I also make my own caps out of .004 thick aluminum soda cans with a Tap O Cap type tool and although I have had mixed results in an attempt to produce my own percussion material, toy pop gun caps work really well, especially if you can find any that were not produced in China. I use a paper puncher to cut out the little discs of percussion material from the roll caps and I press TWO discs into my aluminum caps with the end of a small chainsaw file. I have seldom had any that did not fire a load of BP in either rifle or revolver. I make my own paper cartridges for my revolver out of beautician perm papers and they ignite just fine using the toy pop gun caps as well. I can shoot all day, heck all week, for virtually a few cents.

[SeaMonkey]

Excellent and most informative report HamGunner!

For how long a time are you applying pressure to your slightly moistened powder to form them into solid pucks?

Are you applying pressure several times over that period of time?

Some who are making Black Powder videos on the various video sites show breaking up of the pucks while still damp to reduce the dust accumulation and make granulation easier.

Glazing, for those who do it, is also more easily achieved when the grains are still slightly damp.

[HamGunner]

I have been compressing the powder and then waiting for a minute or two and compressing again and holding it for maybe 15 seconds.
At first I waited about 4-5 days to bust up the pucks, but like you stated, I thought they should be busted up before they are completely dry and maybe even the same day that they are compressed. Might try that next batch. There really is not much moisture in them anyway and they will be drying all the time one is grinding and screening and such. Much easier to dry when in granules anyway. I have not tried glazing with graphite, but may give it a try on my next batch. That might knock down on the dust, although mine are not really all that dusty, but it is noticeable.

[ChrisPer]

Great work HamGunner!

I just finished pucking and started the next batch milling. I measured the puck thickness out of my new 50.8mm (2") die, and weighed the damp pucks and I get 1.84 as a calculated density. So dry they should be 1.78! I am putting as much pull as I can into an 8 ton jack, and letting it sit for 8 minutes. Not cycling the pressure.

[SeaMonkey]

Quote from HamGunner:

I have not tried glazing with graphite, but may give it a try on my next batch.

Graphite is an option when glazing the grains but is not a necessity.

Tumbling the still damp grains will round off any sharp edges of the grains which effectively converts the grains from example: fffa to fffg.

Glazed grains (fg) were preferred over the Unglazed grains (fa) for use in guns as they resulted in consistent and predictable ballistics.

Graphite was included in the glazing process to make the grains more resistant to moisture absorption but made the powder somewhat more difficult to ignite.

Glazing can be done with or without graphite, based upon personal preference.

[MrWolf]

Nice writeup HamGunner. Keep saying one of these days but recenly realized how long it has been since I actually even reloaded between the divorce, moving, and medical issues. Great to see what you folks are doing. Keep it up.
Ron

[DoubleBuck]

HamGunner, I'm with everyone else, that you did great, it sounds to me like! Keep it up and please continue to share your results.
2 questions. If I understood your post; you said you use a Lee 20 pound furnace, with two pounds of lead in it, to make charcoal. I'm not following. So, do you set your coffee can in the molten lead, to make your charcoal? Or, are you pouring lead and just killing two birds with one use of your furnace? By the way, I'm not sure I know what a Lee furnace is, but will look one up. Sorry if I sound ignorant.
The third question is if you would post a picture of your "rubber lined Brass tumbler"? That sounds highly interesting!

The 4th question of 2 is; is that your badge in your profile picture? I have a 72 year old cousin, from Vacaville, who retired from the California Prison System. I bet there aren't many people who can display an Alcatraz Prison Guard badge!!! That's cool as it gets, right there!
One last thing, thank you, for your service to our Country!
Kick it back.

[HamGunner]

I use an older model of the Thumblers Tumbler rock polisher similar to their Model B with a 15 lb. capacity to clean my brass using tiny stainless steel needle bearings and a table spoon or two of citric acid along with an oz. or so of Wash & Shine car wash. The Wash and Shine has a bit of detergent and a small amount of wax. The citric acid along with the detergent cleans the brass inside and out with the help of the tiny needle bearings, including primer pockets, and it leaves a slight film of wax on the brass to help prevent tarnish. I simply take out the bearings and replace with a dozen or more 12 gauge ball and maybe 2 lbs. of .36 cal. ball to mill the mixture of BP. I can not post pictures or at least I have not relearned how since I started using a Linux computer. Here is a link to the Thumblers Tumbler. http://www.thumlerstumbler.com

Well, my 20 lb. Lee casting furnace, like many of the Lee furnaces, developed problems with the bottom pour mechanism.It did not drip like most, but the valve mechanism itself would hang up and pour hot lead all over my casting table before I could get it stopped, so I just removed the bottom pour mechanism and simply ladle or dipper pour my castings. I actually prefer dipping anyway. But since the furnace is wide open I have room for a 1 lb. coffee can to fit down inside. I simply leave a couple of lbs. of lead in the bottom so that the Black Willow wood filled coffee can sits on a small layer of molten lead. The furnace is decently regulated and I try to keep it under 750 degrees, which is supposedly the upper limit of heat to give us the best charcoal for BP from what I have read.

The avatar I have posted is a replica of an old Alcatraz badge. I did work for the US Bureau of Prisons for 30 years starting in 1979, but of course never at Alcatraz. Alcatraz closed in the 60's. It was closed actually because it cost too much to run the facility since everything had to come to the island by boat or ferry. Plus the thing was so old that it was becoming a problem to keep it up. It did not help, of course, that there was an escape. The prison at Marion, Illinois took it's place for many years and now the ADX in Florance, Colorado is the new Super Max. When I first started working for the Prison System, I did work with a few old timers that had worked at Alcatraz. They always had plenty of good stories to tell about the inmates of course. As do I, after supervising inmates for 30 years. People are people no matter where they are, but it just seems that inmates come up with things that most folks on the outside would not believe.

Anyway, I am happy so far with my home brewed BP and grateful for all the shared information on this very long forum subject.

[DoubleBuck]

Thanks, HamGunner! You have some great info! I forgot to mention the caps. I have a lot (500+) of used Musket Caps. I saved them back because I couldn't make myself throw them away. They're like used guitar strings, there must be a use for them. I've thought about cleaning them up, like you do your brass and try to reload them. Never pursued it, but the toy caps sound too dang easy not to try. I'm going to for sure give that a try! The four wing caps will press right back into shape with finger pressure, and I bet a couple of caps would do the trick. It's too easy to try, not to. Thank you, for that info, for sure!

[almar]

I was doing some research on making my own BP for use in my cap and ball revolvers and I came upon this thread so I decided to join this forum although I typically never do. I’ve made my own BP in the past (10 years ago) but it was not corned but was screened.
For the last month or so I’ve upped the game quite a bit and started making corned BP. I have a black willow tree on my land and from what I see they are rather rare around here so I feel kind of lucky. I made a few samples of willow BP, it was ok, but not as good as goex.
However from my research I found that plum tree wood as well as buckthorn alder make a better BP (cleaner and faster), I am about to test my plum powder when It dries (0.7464 KNO3, 0.135 carbon, 0.1185 suplher)
It seems that ham gunner and I both developed the almost exact same process (all the way down to the ball peen hammer) however I find that processing the pucks right after the pressing is better than waiting for the pucks to dry.
The hardest thing to deal with here in the armpit of the country is the humidity, ball milling is difficult because it turns into a powder cake after only an hour or so. I have to go back every 30 minutes or so after that to break things up. I built a highly efficient ball mill though and use a fast spinning grinder beforehand to make the powders as thin as possible. Ball milling more than 1.5 hours may not be adding much benefit.
What is currently driving me up the wall is why I cant get the same density as swiss or goex that have about 30gr weight to 30gr measure density whereas mine has only 26gr-27gr dry. Oddly my FFFG is less dense than my FFg. I may need more polishing.
I have a die and pressure gauge from woody’s and I crank it up to 15000 lbs and there is no more plastic flow at all after 5 minutes or so.
My velocity with willow is as I read here at or slightly better than goex ffg with the same weight.
Can anyone explain why our density is lower? How long do you polish the powder afterwards?

I also make my own #11 caps with prime all from 22 reloader. But instead of using soda can aluminum i use 0.006 thick brass sheet from hobby lobby. Its about 3$ a sheet but this brass is thick enough to ensure that the cap does not fragment and properly seals the gas blowback unlike the soda cans caps that fragment and do not as one can attest to with the fouling on the hammer. I put one drop of acetone/Duco cement mix (50/50) in the cap and let dry.