Lee PrecisionReloading EverythingMidSouth Shooters SupplyWideners
Load DataRepackboxInline FabricationRotoMetals2
Titan Reloading

Thread: My homemade black powder

  1. #3841
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    63
    I did an experiment today trying to press some dried powder. All I can say is that you all must live in the desert! I dried the powder on the dashboard of a car. It was completely dry. I tried to make a couple of pucks amd they were brittle and crumbly. Now, without drying the powder, I'm able to press it just fine with only the moisture in the atmosphere. That's with it being bone-dry here. We haven't had rain in a couple months (normally a daily occurance around here). Grass that normally grows 1" per day, that grass hasn't grown in months. The ponds are 4' below normal. That's how dry it is here and I've been able to press pucks just fine.

    I took this batch, crumbled it with my hands, gave it a squirt of 70/30, swirrled it around, and put it on the workbench so it can equaliže with the atmospheric pressure. When it dries, I'll press it it.

  2. #3842
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    299
    Quote Originally Posted by Paramax55 View Post
    I did an experiment today trying to press some dried powder. All I can say is that you all must live in the desert! I dried the powder on the dashboard of a car. It was completely dry. I tried to make a couple of pucks amd they were brittle and crumbly. Now, without drying the powder, I'm able to press it just fine with only the moisture in the atmosphere. That's with it being bone-dry here. We haven't had rain in a couple months (normally a daily occurance around here). Grass that normally grows 1" per day, that grass hasn't grown in months. The ponds are 4' below normal. That's how dry it is here and I've been able to press pucks just fine.

    I took this batch, crumbled it with my hands, gave it a squirt of 70/30, swirrled it around, and put it on the workbench so it can equaliže with the atmospheric pressure. When it dries, I'll press it it.
    Interesting. I'm sure it has to do with handling and storage of ingredients too.

    I took what powder and meal I had left and decided I wanted to tumbled it longer and then press it again, letting it sit 10 minutes instead of 5.

    Well I tumbled it for 9-10 hours today and it was raining all day. So I was worried about how much water to add because it was noticeably more damp after sifting out the milling media.

    I gave it 4 spritzes per 60 grams instead of 5 that I had done last time. The 4 equated to 0.8-0.9g on my cheapo scale. When pressing, I didn't get any water droplets or ring of water at the bottom, but my pucks were rock hard. So, it's interesting that I used almost as much water as before even though it was raining all day, and no water release.

    I also bent the hell out of the top I beam on my press. I didn't press on it any harder than usual... I'm wondering if it had a weak spot. It was bent about a 1/4" where the press ram seats I to the top beam after last time.

    I think I'll have to see if I can do an exchange at HF this week

  3. #3843
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    1,124
    My hydraulic press I made myself about 10 years or so ago, and it's hell for stout. I don't think it would be possible to bend it. At least I've never been able to... It's ugly as sin though, rusted from being used outside when I lived near salt water. I need to sandblast and paint it. One of these days... maybe.

    ;~)

    Vettepilot
    "Those who sacrifice freedom for security, have neither."
    Benjamin Franklin. (A very wise man!)

  4. #3844
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    178
    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleBuck View Post
    ChrisPer;
    "Graeme's work showed that 'Nitro for Black' loads could substitute for black powder cartridges and operate at LOWER PRESSURE THAN BLACK! (I can look numbers up for a longer post if interested)"
    So, I assume he's talking Nitro Cellulose? That would be interesting for me, because, well....It's INTERESTING!
    Yes. For example, Kynoch used to actually load boxed commercial ammo for BP proved big game rifles labelled Nitro for Black.

    I have been using 85gn AR2213SC, with a 300gn hollow point, in the case that was made for 110gn BP but cannot fit that much in solid drawn cases.

    Other loads use about 40% of the weight of recommended BP loads, in a medium speed modern nitro powder. You need a filler to keep that load pressed against the base of the case , and fillers are a whole story as well.

    But I am going to use BP if I can... sorry this post os a bit Off Topic!

  5. #3845
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    3,702
    Quote Originally Posted by LAGS View Post
    I mark my powder.
    What Passes thru a 20 screen but will not pass thru a 30 is what I call 2f.
    What Passes thru a 30 but will not pass thru a 40 is what I call 3f.
    What Passes thru a 50 but will not pass thru a 60 is what I use for 4f.
    Anything finer is Dust to me and gets Re Processed
    Those grades work very good.
    And I don't see any need to buy more screens like a 25 or 35 to refine my powder to Factory Standards.
    I wonder what screens Danial Boone or Davy Crockett used ?
    Looks like i am running about 3 parts of a grade coarser than you blokes (not that it matters at all)
    my Fg is 12 to 16 mesh
    FFg 16 to 22
    FFFg 22 to 40
    FFFFg 40 to 100
    through 100 is mill dust, fines for reprocessing
    This works for me - didnt spend much on my screns.
    That leaves me oversupplied with FFFFg but working on a plan for that

  6. #3846
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    245
    You guys might try pressing pucks dry. I've never used water and, thus, never had to dry pucks.
    I add water as a safety precaution. Of all the BP steps, pressing to me is the most hair-raising. I figure I'm pressing 4-5 spoonfuls of black powder under 12 tons of pressure inside an aluminum hand grenade housing, and I'm pumping it with it about 8 inches from my torso. I make my meal as damp as I can without it leaking water when pressed.

    I went to a Victorian Rifleman's Shoot in Bowling Green, Kentucky this past weekend. I made up a bunch of authentic Enfield and Sharps cartridges with homemade BP. Worked great.

    My original Sharps shot quite well with home-made 2F and the Eras Gone Smith bullet:


  7. #3847
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    63
    That's a nice group. And there's nothing wrong with safety, but this is not the most dangerous thing I do by any means. I've tried to light part of a puck before. I set it on a paper towel and lit the paper towel. After the fire went out, and I still had a chunk of black powder, I soaked the next paper towel in alcohol. It took a couple of seconds, but it finally lit. And without gusto - it was more of a rocket fuel than gunpowder.

    Since I can press pucks with just the humidity in the air, and others are spritzing with water until just a drop comes out, it seems that there is a WIDE range that works. Personally, I would lean toward the minimum ammount of water that works instead of the maximum. But that's me. Since this stuff seems to absorb moisture so well, I'll bet you sould put it in a ziplock bag, give it one "spritz," shake it up and let it sit overnight to even out, and it would probably be ready to go.

  8. #3848
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    245
    That's a nice group. And there's nothing wrong with safety, but this is not the most dangerous thing I do by any means. I've tried to light part of a puck before. I set it on a paper towel and lit the paper towel. After the fire went out, and I still had a chunk of black powder, I soaked the next paper towel in alcohol. It took a couple of seconds, but it finally lit. And without gusto - it was more of a rocket fuel than gunpowder.
    Hmmm. My pucks are MASSIVELY energetic. I have lit chunks of puck before and they burn as vigorously as loose black powder, and the chunk flies off like a miniature rocket, burning all the way. No trace of it left.

  9. #3849
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    1,124
    Two questions. I watched an interesting video last night about a fellow using the CIA method. According to him, lot's of experimentation with homemade BP led to density less than commercial, as many here have seen, and velocities more or less equal to Goex if he loaded a 20% higher than normal charge.

    He then tried the CIA method, and was rewarded with shooting velocities notably faster than commercial BP, and I believe using standard load volumes at that. Has anyone here tried the CIA method and tested the resultant BP?

    Next question. I use homemade vacuum pumps to vacuum down and dry out auto air conditioning systems. It would be no big deal to rig a vacuum chamber to dry powder out, at whatever production stage desired. Anyone try this???

    I'm hoping the vacuum pump idea gets some positive input. It would give me an excuse to build a vacuum chamber, and I'm thinking my daughter would quite enjoy torturing marshmallows with It!

    Vettepilot
    Postscript: "Homemade" might be a misnomer regarding my vacuum pumps. I re-purpose refrigerator compressors for the task.
    "Those who sacrifice freedom for security, have neither."
    Benjamin Franklin. (A very wise man!)

  10. #3850
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Location
    Northwest Arkansas
    Posts
    665
    "My original Sharps shot quite well with home-made 2F and the Eras Gone Smith bullet:"
    That's looking pretty dang good, Maillemaker! You must be doing something right!

  11. #3851
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Location
    Northwest Arkansas
    Posts
    665
    "Two questions. I watched an interesting video last night about a fellow using the CIA method."
    Vettepilot, that's how I used to make my powder, before I ran into this forum, about three + years ago. We were making and testing a bunch of mortars, for fireworks. I guess I kind of use a combination, of several different processes, today.
    On the vacuum chamber deal, I don't see why it wouldn't work. I guess it would depend on how long it would take to dry up the moisture. Don't they leave air conditioner systems, for a couple of hours?
    A dairy farmer friend and I were talking about using his milking machine vacuum pump for a similar use, for what you are thinking. Not powder related, but as a dryer. I would think it would work very good. And, you could adapt it and vacuum pack your powder at the same time. One less thing, as Forrest Gump said.

  12. #3852
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    1,124
    A good vacuum down on auto A/C is an hour, which is what I do. Most guys only do about 10 minutes.

    Vettepilot
    "Those who sacrifice freedom for security, have neither."
    Benjamin Franklin. (A very wise man!)

  13. #3853
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    178
    The vacuum pump is an interesting idea. I once got a fridge compressor going using plastic bags, trying to dehydrate some books that got wet. The idea might have been good but my execution sucked. I did discover that those thick, strong plastic bags are still not airtight; they have a lot of little pinhole leaks.
    Another writer said that he had some problems with this approach for drying powder; can't remember who or even on what forum, but he said there was a big temperature drop he had not expected, due to the latent heat of vaporization. This worked against his objectives so it was not as successful as he hoped.

    However, in weather-related news a willow tree in a park near my home dropped a decent branch in the storms just now, and my deadfall willow stockpile is increased. Time for BBQ.

  14. #3854
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    63
    I've used vacuum to dry things in a mason jar. At room temp, almost nothing happened. When I hit it with a hair dryer (from outside the jar) it boiled rapidly as soon as the temp rose only a couple degrees. But it took a lot of effort for just a little reward - and that was with a "real" AC vacuum pump. The dashboard method is IMMENSELY more "bang for the buck."

  15. #3855
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    63
    On another note, I re-pressed that dry powder after wetting it and letting it sit out. It did just like I'm used to.

  16. #3856
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    1,124
    At least theoretically, water should not be needed for pressing powder, but I'll keep looking into what the commercial producers do when I get a chance. I'm off to get a worrisome heart checkup just now...

    Vettepilot
    "Those who sacrifice freedom for security, have neither."
    Benjamin Franklin. (A very wise man!)

  17. #3857
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    299
    Two nights ago I pressed some pucks that I re-tumbled that day. The top member on my harbor freight 12-ton press had started to bend, and then I figured there's no fixing it so I kept using it but making sure to not Max it out. I would get to a point where I could barely push it down with one arm and a tidy bit of weight behind it but it would bend the top member with every pump. So, I tried to keep it at that pressure and let it sit for 10 minutes. Those pucks feel Rock hard. So I guess it worked okay!

    well I decided to take the press back to harbor freight for an exchange today, because there's absolutely no way it would have lasted much longer. The welded started to break on the top and it would have eventually snapped. Well, I can say by your harbor freight press with confidence! They exchanged it no questions asked, other than what the heck did you do to that thing? they also let me keep the original bottle jack that came with the frame I returned, because I had already went through the trouble of putting good oil in it and bleeding all of the air out. They weren't all that excited about me digging the new one out of the box in the store to leave it with them, so they tried to get me to just take the new one and my old one! I did dig it out of the box though and left the new one with the old frame just because. So I'm back in business! I just have to figure out why that other one bent and make sure it doesn't happen again

  18. #3858
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    63
    I was in Harbor Freight today and I looked at the 12 ton press to see if they had changed the design at all. Yes they did. My top member is two pieces that sendwich the side members a lot like the moveable base. The new design has that as one piece. It looks sturdy, but who knows? I wish you luck and keep us posted.

  19. #3859
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    299
    Quote Originally Posted by Paramax55 View Post
    I was in Harbor Freight today and I looked at the 12 ton press to see if they had changed the design at all. Yes they did. My top member is two pieces that sendwich the side members a lot like the moveable base. The new design has that as one piece. It looks sturdy, but who knows? I wish you luck and keep us posted.
    Will do. I compared it to their 20ton frame when I was there. They use the same piece on the 20! That's crazy. The bottom piece and all the rest is more beefy... But I guarantee if you have your jack in good shape and max it out you're going to have a failure!

  20. #3860
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Jun 2020
    Posts
    71
    When pressing your powder into pucks be aware that the particles of powder do not
    compress and compact themselves instantly. It takes several minutes for the particles
    and the small amount of moisture in the pressing to re-arrange themselves into their
    more compact form with evenly distributed moisture.

    How much pressure is actually needed to press the pucks? Higher pressures will compress
    the mix more rapidly but lower pressures will also yield a very dense product with a little
    more time.

    Some have already discovered that the pressing operation must be done incrementally by
    several pressings at ten to twenty minute intervals. With each pressing allow the
    particles sufficient time to become more dense. With pressures as low as 500 lbs. the
    pressings will become equally dense given sufficient time for the particles to occupy
    their most dense positions.

    In the old days the pressing operation lasted nearly an hour for each batch with the
    lower pressures available then. That much time was necessary for a large batch of
    several layers in the machine. With today's higher pressures and smaller batch sizes
    the pressing can be done much faster. But never instantly. Time is necessary.

    Keep up the excellent work men! Your experiences and tips are very, very helpful.

Page 193 of 403 FirstFirst ... 93143183184185186187188189190191192193194195196197198199200201202203243293 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check