My homemade black powder

[RufusBuck]

I'm interested in how BP is made. I don't know that I'd make any. I don't even own a BP rifle but I'd like to know how it's done.

[trooperdan]

I am using powder coated lead ball in my Harbor freight and they are standing up well after about 30 hrs of milling so far.

[trooperdan]

You have to insure that the media is non-sparking! As we know, HF stuff is all Chinese and they play very loose with specifications and standards!

[almar]

I tried to do a bunch of testing over 9 round 2 read right the others were errors both were 726 and 750 all were loaded with 21 grains of that low density stuff which is right were that 25 grain volume is. This isn't conclusive because this stuff compresses a lot more. By weight 25 grains is about 30 volume so it reaches a better compression in that cylinder, possibly affecting the results. 21 grains just isn't enough powder it seems.

I might have to do tests with more powder. there is more to follow, im going to work on some stuff and report back in a bit.

[Nobade]

I'm interested in how BP is made. I don't know that I'd make any. I don't even own a BP rifle but I'd like to know how it's done.

Well, if you read through this whole thread you will most certainly know how black powder is made. Welcome aboard.

[ChrisPer]

Rufusbuck, welcome!
This is the web post that started it for me:
https://www.skylighter.com/blogs/how...d-black-powder

Skylighter's blog posts are very informative about the methods and tools. What he doesn't do is make clear that for use in guns, the wood for charcoal must be better than the pine he uses in his tests here. That's what most of us put our effort into as we get going. Dont read the whole thread here - life is just too short. Go back from this end.

[ChrisPer]

I tried to do a bunch of testing over 9 round 2 read right the others were errors both were 726 and 750 all were loaded with 21 grains of that low density stuff which is right were that 25 grain volume is. This isn't conclusive because this stuff compresses a lot more. By weight 25 grains is about 30 volume so it reaches a better compression in that cylinder, possibly affecting the results. 21 grains just isn't enough powder it seems.

I might have to do tests with more powder. there is more to follow, im going to work on some stuff and report back in a bit.

Compression is important, and was demonstrated to me with a 6" difference in poi on a 25m pistol target using a winning underhammer target pistol. I have been considering making a spring-loaded rammer handle to feel as the spring reaches target pressure.

[almar]

Compression is important, and was demonstrated to me with a 6" difference in poi on a 25m pistol target using a winning underhammer target pistol. I have been considering making a spring-loaded rammer handle to feel as the spring reaches target pressure.

Yes it does, I know this stuff is really kicking already but there are things to fix. I have to find a way to limit the density when I compress it but also get something constant. Moisture level plays into it a lot.... so no more adding water. The powder moisture level should be enough with ambient levels. Just when I thought I was done...

edit: Waltam Abbey book chapter 8, they discuss all of this! Great book indeed. Its all there.

just a small bit they explain:

[Vettepilot]

Yeah, thanks for the link. I ordered a printed copy for my reference library as well.

As regards compression, yeah, I've given that some thought too. I've thought of making a ram rod that gives an audible beep when you hit where you want to be. That'll be cool. I'd love to do it electronically with a load cell, but will likely keep it simple with a spring system.

Jeez! Retirement is supposed to be "relaxed"! Way too much to do here in life changes, then way too many interests and projects also...

Vettepilot

[ChrisPer]

YAs regards compression, yeah, I've given that some thought too. I've thought of making a ram rod that gives an audible beep when you hit where you want to be. That'll be cool. I'd love to do it electronically with a load cell, but will likely keep it simple with a spring system.

I played with a shiny coffee tamper that had a 30lb clicker in it. The clicker was broken, but the spring pre-loaded so you could have two preset pressures that were silent and easy to feel - one when the loaded spring lifted from the seat, and one when it touched the stop. I wonder if a valve lifter spring might have the right size and strength to cannibalise.

[HamGunner]

I got a chance to go tromping around in the forest a bit today in search of some Alder Buckthorn. I thought I found a big bunch of it, but my plant ID app on my phone said it was Northern Spicebush. Certainly looked very similar except that the bark was a bit different. Leaves and berries sure looked close and it was not far from the trail. Well, I continued on and got a bit farther out into the forest for an hour or so and looked up and down at various elevations with little luck. Returned to my rig and noticed that I had indeed found something. Seed ticks. A hundred on each ankle. I had noticed a few buck rubs on some saplings so I guess I crossed a few deer trails and they always carry ticks. Now that just about ended my quest.

But just a few hundred yards on down the trail I had to pull up to a halt as I saw something that certainly looked like Alder Buckthorn right off the trail. It was indeed, but this variety is called Carolina Buckthorn (Frangula Caroliniana). My app does not even show the (Rhamnus Frangula) that they use in Europe and I am thinking that it might be a rarity in the States and likely in Missouri for sure. It is considered an invasive plant where it has been found from what I have read. Anyway, I got a small sample of the Carolina Buckthorn by just trimming some 1 to 1 1/2" limbs off of a couple of 15 ft. tall saplings. Then I high tailed it home to tend to the dang seed ticks.

I debarked the samples and charred all that I had being careful to keep the temperature under 600 degrees and then tested the ash content. Low and behold I was now down to ( 2.6 % ash). That is just half as much ash as my best charring of Black Willow so far and the color of this ash is lighter than the Black Willow. Looks promising. Now I will have to process it into a small test batch of BP and see how it shoots. Dang ticks.

[SeaMonkey]

RufusBuck,

There are still a number of videos on YouTube done by those who make their own Black Powder.

Here is the DuckDuckGo search result for Black Powder videos.

Some of the videos are quite good and show a lot of detail.

There are ways to download the videos for future reference in the event YouTube takes them down at some time.

[almar]

Hamgunner: Thats fantastic, keep us posted on the results, There is no hope of me finding alder buckthorn around here but I have been looking for that carolina buckthorn along with sasfarass. No luck. Any tips on where to look? What kind of places it prefers to grow (the buckthorns)?

If you want a certain density, its about reducing the volume area of a substance from Volume A with density y to volume B with the target density. If you fill the die with the same amount of powder every time, im thinking that all you need is a mark to show how far the piston goes into the die.

With pressure reading there are alot of variables: moisture content, pressure and time thats too much of a hassle to get right and constant. What i've read in that book states that there are big differences with powder compressed to 1.84 and powder compressed to 1.78. Now ive been getting close to 2.00 g/cc. The last pucks i made with just 20K lbs came out to around 1.87 g/cc and that is way to high. So im going to go by volume reduction now and measure how much powder i put in dies every time. Its a surer thing.

[HamGunner]

I found this Carolina Buckthorn growing right along the forest trails and county roads and after I had it identified, I remember seeing it growing in the timber on the farm as a boy. It does have shiny leaves that are very similarly shaped as some other shrubs such as Northern Spicebush as I discovered. Even the berries were similar, but the wood of the Carolina Buckthorn is slightly yellowish under the bark and the cambium wood is also lightly yellowish colored. The wood does not seem to be all that soft, but certainly is brittle, thus the name "Frangula Caroliniana". On the larger diameter limbs and the trunks, it develops a darker reddish colored pith and heartwood. I did not notice any that were larger than about 3-4" at the trunk and most were even smaller than that. This Buckthorn supposedly grows up and down the Eastern Coast and into the Midwest so I suspect it is likely growing in parts of Georgia as well.

My cheap Chinese 12 ton jack that came with my press has already shot craps and will not hold it's pressure well. I could tell it was cheap made when it was new and now it acts like it is low on oil or something, which it is not so I suspect the seals are already leaking. Time to go searching for a much better quality jack before I start this next test batch of BP.

I plan on milling a bit longer and also removing the drum every hour or so to bang it around a bit to remove any clumping on the ends and hopefully it gets a better mix. I am shooting for just a bit more velocity to get somewhat closer to the speed of Swiss, but of course if I can improve the consistency of the granules and therefore get better accuracy, I will be happy with that.

I just re-read Elmer Keith's "SIXGUNS" and he insists that the ball in the .36 Cal. percussion revolvers with decent velocity was a better killer than the conical bullets on both small and medium sized game as well as being a better man stopper according to his personal contact with old Civil War veterans that had first hand experience. He recommended FFG powder even in the smallish .36 Cal. He reserved FFFG for what he called, the smaller calibers. Since I shoot both .36 Cal. as well as .32 Cal. I guess I might save a bit of the FFG sized granules as well in this test batch to experiment on a bit.

[Vettepilot]

I really enjoyed that book! ("Sixguns") It's a great read and I highly recommend it.

I've got "Never for the want of powder", which is about the Rebel powder works during the civil war. The book wasn't really a fun read; too loaded with statistics and other data I wasn't interested in. However, it was interesting in some of the powder making details. Again it's amazing what they knew, and did, all those years ago, before the automobile even! But I didn't find anything, really, in that book that was enlightening for our purposes.

How'd you get all those tics out/off? When I was a kid; around 8 or so, we visited the "Great Smokey Mountains". My younger brother got "Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever", supposedly from a tic. He was allergic to whatever the hospital gave him to treat it. Bad deal for a while there...

Vettepilot

[DoubleBuck]

HamGunner;
All ticks need to die. I can't imagine any possible ecological good, that they do. They need to be extinct in our lifetime.
I have started keeping an eye out for a your Carolina Buckthorn. I've been watching for Tree of Heaven and Paulownia, as well. They are supposed to be good wood. I've made some Paulownia powder and it was good.
I looked it up and you and I are a bit over 2 hours apart. I live 15 miles Southwest of Bentonville, two miles from XNA Airport. We should have a lot of the same trees. If you want to experiment with one, try you some Sassafras. It's been my best powder yet. I plan to make some brown from it, soon. Right now I'm waiting for a grinder to come in, to do my first brown powder with (Black Willow) Hoping it turns out better than my best.

[DoubleBuck]

VettePilot;
See, there is a perfectly good reason for living in Arizona. NO TICKS! You may not have powder wood, but you don't have ticks and that is very nearly close enough.

[Vettepilot]

VettePilot;
See, there is a perfectly good reason for living in Arizona. NO TICKS! You may not have powder wood, but you don't have ticks and that is very nearly close enough.

But (this part of it) is so dam ugly!! (And hotter than "the hinges of hell.")

:~(

Vettepilot

[almar]

Yeah the volume method works spot on, just tried it. Was aiming for 1.64 g/cc and got it on the money.
This is what i will use from now on.

[Vettepilot]

Well that's a handy discovery. Do whatever it takes to get to your density mark on the die, and you're golden. How's the process exactly? Measure/weigh going in and...?

I just cooked up almost 2 pounds of Alder smoking chips I had bought at a yard sale but forgotten about 'till I stumbled across them the other day. We'll see how it works...

Ha! My daughter had been asleep in the house when I started cooking this on the porch. She came out, all sleepy eyed and said, " Daddy, are you cooking up a bunch of bacon??" "The house smells strongly of bacon!"

Whoops!

;~)

Vettepilot