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Thread: The .32 S&W Long as a man-stopper

  1. #681
    Boolit Grand Master
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    I spent the last few evenings re-reading this thread. I think the .32 S&W Long is a bit light to carry intentionally for antipersonnel use, although it should be fine as a trail gun for use against anything coyote sized or smaller.

    I do think you should use a softer mix than ACWW, mine are about 12.5 BHN, and didn't do all that well on the one possum I shot with a 4¼" I frame years ago.

    Now to re read the experiences with a .32 thread.

    Robert

  2. #682
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    I prefer 1 to 30 tin-lead with a heavy for the caliber bullet having a large meplat. Accurate 31-109H with 2.5 grains of Bullseye gives 840 fps in my 3-inch Colt Cobra and penetrating five gallon water jugs.
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  3. #683
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    I found a box of bullets from my NOE heavy-for-caliber 32 mould (they run about 125 gr.) Would these be too heavy for 32 S&Ws? I cast them for my 327 FM, but intuitively they seemed entirely too big for the 32 S&W Long. Should I try a few? What kind of powder charges should I use? I've never tried anything heavier than a 115 in this caliber.
    "It aint easy being green!"

  4. #684
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    Interesting.
    My first thought is 2400 filled to the bottom of the boolit.
    That’d keep the pressure from being to high in that little case with the big boolit.
    "Time and money don't do you a bit of good until you spend them." - My Dad

  5. #685
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shooting on a shoestring View Post
    Interesting.
    My first thought is 2400 filled to the bottom of the boolit.
    That’d keep the pressure from being to high in that little case with the big boolit.
    WAIT!

    Larry Gibson has been testing heavy .32 S&W Long loads for me, but the work is incomplete at this time.

    In the near capacity loads with slow powders in the .32 S&W Long case the bullet is apparently being dislodged by primer blast before the powder fully ignites. This shows up on the P/T trace with the pressure rising initially, then showing a "hiccup" with a slight drop of the trace before rising again. In rifle ammunition that is a classic sign of potential secondary explosion effect.

    A charge of 7 grains of Allliant #2400 in R-P .32 S&W Long cases with the 100-grain XTP and Remington 6-1/2 primer produced erratic velocity as evidenced by a large velocity extreme spread and standard deviation, although accuracy was good and average pressure OK at 19,100 psi., with acceptable uniformity, in the same range as .32 H&R Magnum factory loads.

    Substituting the 85-grain XTP also gave a good group at only 16,800 psi, but showing erratic velocity variation, although it had a good ES and Sd with respect to pressure.

    With 9 grains of IMR4227 (compressed) in R-P .32 S&W Long cases with the 85-grain XTP and Remington 6-1/2 primer we had the initial appearance of a "good load" with excellent accuracy and good ballistic uniformity with respect to pressure, at 19,100 psi, with uniform velocities, but the P/T trace also showed the annoying pressure drop problem...

    Neither Larry nor I are prepared to recommend these loads without further testing, because in a revolver cylinder throat the free bullet travel is longer than it is in the .32 H&R Mag. Contender barrel which Larry used for testing. Would this cause a more severe drop in the pressure trace?

    We don't know. Changing primers, using a heavier crimp, adjusting powder charges to smooth out the pressure trace are planned, but we don't have the answer yet.
    Last edited by Outpost75; 04-25-2021 at 01:43 PM.
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  6. #686
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    Outpost75, have you and Larry gotten back to testing these heavy for caliber loads? I’d like to think about something to shoot from my I frame snub.

    Inquiring minds...

    Froggie
    "It aint easy being green!"

  7. #687
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    I would not exceed 16,000 psi in an I-frame. From Larry's test data in the Fouling Shot No. 272 pg11 that equates to 2.5 grains of Bullseye or 3 grains of Unique with Lyman #311008 115- grain FN with WSP primer at 1.257 OAL in R-P cases. The modern J-frames are OK to 18,000 psi for a 0.3 grain increase with either powder.
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  8. #688
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    What would Be top psi for a post-war Colt Police Positive ?
    Have Hornady 85gr XTP's and 90gr WC's, Lee #311-93-2R and a few Saeco 100gr SWC's.
    Bullseye, Unique, W231, Clay's and Titegroup.
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  9. #689
    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walks View Post
    What would Be top psi for a post-war Colt Police Positive ?
    Have Hornady 85gr XTP's and 90gr WC's, Lee #311-93-2R and a few Saeco 100gr SWC's.
    Bullseye, Unique, W231, Clay's and Titegroup.
    I'd have no worries at 18,000 psi as a steady diet, if the ballistic uniformity of the load was good such that the X-bar + 3 Sigma limit didn't exceed 20,000 psi.
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  10. #690
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    Outpost75,

    Thank You
    I HATE auto-correct

    Happiness is a Warm GUN & more ammo to shoot in it.

    My Experience and My Opinion, are just that, Mine.

    SASS #375 Life

  11. #691
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    Hey Green Frog!
    Did you ever try shooting those heavies?
    "Time and money don't do you a bit of good until you spend them." - My Dad

  12. #692
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    Quote Originally Posted by shooting on a shoestring View Post
    Hey Green Frog!
    Did you ever try shooting those heavies?
    Sorry for the slow reply… I’m not following this thread as closely as I should be. To answer your question in a word, no. After reading the reply from Outpost75, and with the variety of revolvers I have in the several lengths of 32 cal cartridges, the 125s are being devoted to 327 FM cases (in which they work quite well) and maybe 32 H&Rs in the future. I have too many good bullet designs in lighter 32 caliber designs to risk overstressing my beloved I frames.

    Froggie
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  13. #693
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    Well thanks for the reply Green Frog.
    Guess I’ll have to file this idea away for sometime in the future and play with it myself.

    Turns out I don’t have anything in 32 moulds heavier than a 311008 clone. They seem to drop at about 118 grains if my memory is working. But that would be a heavy for caliber in 32 SWL. And I’ve got a J-Frame or two that would make good test platforms. Now I need to find my Round To-it.
    Last edited by shooting on a shoestring; 01-14-2022 at 07:31 PM. Reason: I ain’t perfect
    "Time and money don't do you a bit of good until you spend them." - My Dad

  14. #694
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    The original 3118/311008 from Ideal runs about 115-118 gr and has a long and honorable history with the 32 S&W L, even though it was designed for the 32-20. If you’d really like to investigate the possibilities of shooting these heavy-for-caliber 125 gr bullets in your 32S&W L, I would be willing to send you a sample of 50, lubed with Carnauba Red and sized to .313”. Just send me your snail mail address via PM.

    Froggie
    "It aint easy being green!"

  15. #695
    Boolit Mold
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    Fascinating read, y'all! I really need to get a .32 revolver to try some of these loads. Here's what I inherited, loaded with .32 S&W Long WC's. Love reading these stories of the 'ol .32!

    I inherited this Arminius 7 shot .32 S&W Long snubby from my wife's grandfather. German, made of some pot metal, when I inherited it it was loaded with .32acp, which are 50% reliable. Runs like a champ with .32 S&W Longs. It's not trying to be a .32 Charter Arms 'Boomer', the front sight fell off sometime years back...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    One day I'll get a .327 or .32H&R Mag (maybe SA Ruger?) and then can load up some .32 S&W Longs to play. Great read! Longest thread, ever! But, like others have said, lots of valuable info here.

  16. #696
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    Welcome to the party, Dacula Kid. That Arminius, IMHO at least, does not get the respect it deserves. The alloy frame seems to have held up well over the years, and of course Germans have a reputation for engineering, so I would be willing to bet it will continue to get the job done for you. It shouldn’t be too great a challenge for a mildly competent gunsmith to replace that front sight… you might even be able to put one on yourself with 2 part epoxy or JB Weld. Have you checked with Numrich Arms/GPC for a replacement blade. Have you started thinking about reloading? Be sure and save your brass. Even if you get a 32 H&R or even a 327 Fed Mag later, a supply of 32 S&W L ammo for fun at the range.

    Apropos of nothing, the very first handgun I ever owned was a High Standard Sentinel Deluxe snub… a 22 LR nine shooter.. I only mention this because at first glance it looks just like your Arminius, down to the short barrel and alloy frame. It came with those some “bird’s head” grips, but I found a square butt replacement. Anyway, with most sane 32 S&W L ammo, I’ll bet the recoil on your 32 won’t be noticeably greater than my 22! I still have that little snubby after over 50 years and it will be in good shape when my “grands” are arguing over who gets to inherit it.

    Green Frog
    "It aint easy being green!"

  17. #697
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    Green Frog, now that’s a nice offer.
    But I really have too many irons in the fire for now.
    My current project is attempting to re-stock a nice M&P 32-20 with stocks that fit me. I have my blanks cut out of some nice maple and did get to start inletting one to the frame…..that was over 2 weeks ago and I haven’t got back to it. Having a job has its drawbacks!

    I guess if I was to be proactive here I should dream up and order a 125-130 grain boolit from Accurate. By the time it would get here I might have my 32-20 project done. I have a little bit of interest in trying boolits in that weight in 32-20 and 327. Yep. Time to go boolit mold shopping. Maybe a nice long wadcutter? Maybe a very wide flat nose? Maybe go for long range and get less meplat so it would reach out better?
    "Time and money don't do you a bit of good until you spend them." - My Dad

  18. #698
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    Hey Dacula Kid, thanks for posting the pic. Cool little 32. That’s one thing neat about 32’s. They come in so many different guns. Lots of them are very utilitarian guns bc, well 32’s are very utilitarian cartridges.

    I got a kick out of you finding it loaded with 32 acp’s. But your Granddad-in-law was indeed armed. Good for him. We think there’s an ammo shortage now. I’ll bet he might have lived through worse.
    "Time and money don't do you a bit of good until you spend them." - My Dad

  19. #699
    Boolit Mold
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    Thanks for the warm welcome. Joined in 2006, this is my second post. Sheesh. Someday I'll get to casting boolits and reloading!

    Shoestring - Well... there's a story there. It was my wife's fathers. His friend was a Sheriff in VA and confiscated it and gave it to my father in law. Their family were moonshiners from SW Virginia. My wife's parents got into a fight one night and her mother/my MIL tried to shoot him with it. She missed, hot the ceiling, and grandpa took it away. Years later, he passed on, and I had his '47 Remington Model 11 12ga (think Browning A5). Bro-in-law wants the shotgun, and wants to trade the .32 to me. I'm visiting, and I don't trust him - I know he'll use it to make a 'withdrawl' down at the gas station. So I strike a deal, give me the .32 now while I'm in VA, and then I'll bring you the 12ga from GA when I return. Deal! Now I have both guns... and all the guns I know about, so I feel safer. Wife (his sister) says come and get it, you'll get it barrel first! Needless to say he never stopped by.

    Green Frog - yeah, the Arminius is cool. Functions real well with the correct ammo! When I got it from bro-in-law (above), he says "It's empty..." and I check it anyway, because, you know. I snap it shut and say, "What, are we playing russian roulette?" He freaks out, he left 1 .32acp in there... dummy.

    Come to think of it, my father in law also had a cool .32 Colt (.32 S&W Long) - check it out. I got it back in the white, and my buddy's dad refinished it. I think he did a bang-up job. Even in the white, it locked up tight when cocked!

    What model do you think this is? Colt New Police Positive? Colt New Pocket? It is definitely .32Colt/.32 S&W Long. It's complete except for the knurled end on the ejector - anybody know where to get one? This is like 1898-1903ish, from when I remember dating it years ago. Gave it to my buddy when his dad fixed it up... wish I had a before pic!

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    Oh, and this isn't my first gun by far (the Arminius) - here's one of many, and - a .32. ACP, though...

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    Hey Frog - I call that one Kermit! You oughta like that!

  20. #700
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    Dacula,
    Ok you win for the best story. I did not see that one coming! I don’t have any story like that….and I’m happy. Ha!
    "Time and money don't do you a bit of good until you spend them." - My Dad

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check