Holsun optical sight has been recommended for duty use on my new Glock 47 MOS duty weapon.
Who has experience with this optic or others that they can recommend?
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Holsun optical sight has been recommended for duty use on my new Glock 47 MOS duty weapon.
Who has experience with this optic or others that they can recommend?
I have two Holosun EPS and two 507k reflex sights and love them. Aaron Cowan at Sage Dynamics (https://www.sagedynamics.org) is the guy on duty use reflex sights, and the EPS passed his tests. He is not a fan of the MOS system at all and has experienced mounting failures where the sight continued to perform well. I have avoided Glock MOS after watching his reviews.
Tony
Exactly what kind of problems have there been with the MOS system?Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyB
The issue appears to be the size of and metal used to make the screws and plates. A hard impact on the optic can make the mounting plate move/screws break, and you won't know it because those screws aren't visible with the optic mounted.
Tony
The factory Glock plates suck. Not nearly enough screw thread holding things down. We got the MOS guns for our agency and after all the bad press, didn't even both with those plates.Quote:
Originally Posted by deltaenterprizes
Been running many Holosuns for about two years now on our duty guns - almost entirely with C&H Precision Weapon System's mounting plates appropriate to the model of optic which both give you more thread holding stuff down and "socket" the base of the optic to give in more front/rear support than just the screws can give alone. I've had to occasionally retighten some of the mounting screws, but that's mostly been on early jobs done before we arrived at our current "blend of 11 herbs and spices" for threadlock and mounting practices. Broken a few of the smaller screws and mounting T-nuts here and there as part of the learning curve, but have really had no issues with the mounts themselves. C&H has been a good company to work with for us.
Personally, I wouldn't screw around with open emitter sights, and limit yourself to enclosed. The open backed sights are lint traps that are more difficult to keep clean. I've been running the Holosun 509T's hard on my G17 in my instruction gig. Had one rear window fall out and am currently waiting on replacement of my second with a leaky window seal that indicated itself when cleaning. Holosun's been Johnny on the spot making it right. The EPS Carry models I have on my little Glocks have been flawless, although they don't have anything near the same round count. Been very happy with the sights thus far. Noteworthy tip to give you: pretty much all red dots claim to have 1 MOA clicks for W&E adjustment, but the Holosuns seem to be very slightly coarser than that - seven clicks to the inch at ten yards.
The G43X/48 MOS guns use somewhat beefier screws in the slide mounting holes. The EPS Carry with Holosun's included plate has given me no grief.
I see a lot of different red dot optics as a range owner, and USPSA competitor. Another option for a good top quality red dot is Burris. They hold up very well & Burris has an excellent warranty if ever needed.
I have been shooting a few pistols with dots over the last month and I gotta say I don't see a use for one for me yet. Maybe on a hunting revolver but definitely not on a carry gun.
How do you keep the thing from getting covered in lint? How about press checks and malfunctions and just normal reloads - your fingers go straight towards the window and smudge them right up. We have been shooting outdoors in the mud over the last monthand both of my buddies, who were most definitely not in a life or death scenario - just existing in a muddy environment- and both of them had to take a break at some point to clean their screens. Sometimes my carry pistol gets a lot of lint on the iron sights. I would imagine my Fastfire III on my carry pistol being constantly linty, muddy, finger printed, etc. I have been running a Fastfire III for about 8 or 9 years on my 357 hunting rifle and I can hardly keep the thing clean for a day of deer driving, and it is super annoying on misty days so I carry an iron sighted rifle in bad weather.
Plus, the dot doesn't help marksmanship. It helps with one specific thing - front sight focus. If you are a bad shot with iron sights because you don't understand that you need to focus on the front sight and let the target be blurry - if you are bad shot with iron sights because your old eyes wont focus at short range on your front sight - then a dot will help you at moderate ranges of 25-50 yards. You should have seen my buddies when I hit 10 in a row with my open sight 9mm at 100 yards on the 2/3 size steel man. "Don't need no stinkin red dots here" is what I told them. They each hit the 100 yard steel once in a 17 round mag.
The one guy has already taken his dot off after getting muddy and dirty and finger printed and still getting outshot in every thing from shot timer stuff to marksmanship stuff.
If you have the ability to see the front sight a dot will NOT help you shoot smaller groups. If you have the ability to focus on the front sight, but instead erroneously let your front sight be blurry and focus on the target - a red dot will help you overcome your lack of fundamentals. Outside of that one specific scenario, a red dot does not help at all except in dawn and dusk hunting it is a nice upgrade over iron sights to be able to hunt for the full legal time.
I am kind of in the "not for me, either" category. I find that my prescription doesn't "blend" well with them, whereas my brother loves his Holosun. If you wear prescription lenses, try before you buy.
I've been using the "new" Vortex CCW Defender. Been very happy with it.
If looking for a good red dot for SD, competition, hunting or just fun use they are just fine. If you want to go play in muddy, nasty, range conditions,, then yes,, there can be issues.
Most red dots come with a cover to protect the lens & such. And most of the lens covers don't have a very secure method of attachment. A simple rubber band can prevent the loss of the cover if SD or hunting is the goal.
But to "press check, clear a malfunction, or doing reloads" ,,, the optic is NOT a handle. Your hands should not go to the dot, but to the slide as needed. Just like a scope on a rifle is not a carry handle.
But lint,, easily kept off by using the cover. Doing stuff in muddy conditions,, unless you are going prone, or whatever,, mud shouldn't be an issue. Lastly, our soldiers use a lot of red dot optics in combat. Obviously they can be in very bad conditions, and they prefer to have them.
The OP has asked about small red dots. As such,, the reflex types are the smallest ones that can fit his needs. There are other types that can be used for different applications,, such as hunting, and using a tube type of red dot. But the OP has a desire for a dot on his Glock. For duty purposes. My son is LEO,, and they are transitioning to a dot sight for many sections within the dept. Plus a good friend of mine is NCHP,, and they too are transitioning to a dot type of sight. LEO's may have a holster type that can cover the dot to protect it against bad conditions. But otherwise,, a simple rubber band can keep the cover in place, and is easily flipped off & away if necessary.
BTW; my NCHP friend,, found himself in a very very sudden gunfight on 7/3/23. A guy pulled a Desert Eagle .44 mag & shot him in the chest from about 4 ft away. His vest saved his life. He was NOT knocked down, (ala hollywierd,) but he recognized the threat too late to fire the first round,, but he was quick enough to draw & return fire & the thug didn't get off a second shot. He told me he drew, and started firing as he cleared his holster. He never looked at his sights. He fired 6 rounds,, hitting the thug 5 of the 6.
We discussed the red dot ideas for duty carry. He's of the mind to be as light as possible, and to allow you to witness the open sights as well, just in case the battery dies or whatever.
Nothing is perfect, and all potential armed confrontations have a ton of variables. No one system is 100% ideal for everything. But red dots have their place now and are being used successfully by many.
In the line of "best value" believe it or not I bought a few UTG OP3 red dots and they're quite good. For under a hundred bucks with a lifetime warranty if you need a red dot I'd recommend them.
Currently I have two on my comped Tanfo slides for over a year without issues and I'm putting one to try out on my BFR .45 Colt.
Attachment 324186
Here's a pretty objective review of them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvvNsNH4QIE
I dislike red dots on pistols. Just me being honest. But, since I am being honest, I will say they generally work better than iron sights in terms of accuracy, speed, and calling shots. Speed and accuracy are pretty important so I own red dots. But I do not like them.
I have two of them....they are great....love the shake to turn on. I dont thing you can go wrong with them!Quote:
Originally Posted by deltaenterprizes
If you have astigmatism, the dot will look funky.Quote:
Originally Posted by rintinglen
Polarized lenses are supposed to help, but I haven’t seen a difference.
Most red dots look like a figure 8, starburst or a smear to my astigmatic eyes. After reading a bunch of reviews and watching a bunch of YT vids about astigmatism and RDS I bought a Swampfox Kingslayer green circle-dot. It looks to my eyes just like the pic below. As a bonus it is really easy to find the dot in the lens with the big outer ring. I really love this sight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtarm
Attachment 325211
I'm another fan of the circle dot reticles -- and in green. When a range officer in New Mexico I had the chance to handle and shoot a number of pistols with various dot sights -- Leupold, Burris, Vortex, Trijicon-- and the Holosun 507C -GR-X2 was by far the easiest for me to use.
https://i.postimg.cc/g2bFkJPv/IMG-2573.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/QxFfY88n/IMG-2169.jpg
A 25-year-old J Point red dot on my Ruger MK II, I believe these are made/still offered by Shield Sights with timely improvements. It's never been a problem. This much earlier version isn't water resistant. For a duty gun I would think being highly water resistant a necessity. I'm not sure about the current ones. And I have a pair of Holosun 507K red dots on Glock 48's. These are water resistant and have a trio of different dot options, just a small dot, small dot within a larger circle and just the circle. One of my Holosun's decided it didn't want to track any farther to the left when adjusting after about a year and went back to Holosun in California for repairs, judging by the new serial number it was swapped for a new one. They have good customer service in my experience. I mounted both of mine to the Glock 48's by filing down the two rear slide bumps and directly mounting the sight to the slide sans a mounting plate. This required shortening the screws as they bound up the extractor when full length. This also allows using the standard height sights thru the red dot if the battery fails. As my eyes age these are a help.
Yep, starburst is what I get. I can usually get a decent dot, but I have to fiddle with brightness and get my progressive lenses in just the right spot.Quote:
Originally Posted by steve urquell
I’ll check out the Kingslayer. Thanks!