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I found some hercules blue dot unopened can at an estate sale. I have been reading about and seem like I should be ok, if I start low and work my way up using Allaint blue dot data. I will be loading 180 and 165 grain jacketed bullets in a 10mm in a glock. thanks for any input. rrh
It's a favorite. If it isn't what you want, some .357Magun shooter will jump right on it.
Or.. someone who loads upper/mid range 44 mag or 45 Win MagQuote:
Originally Posted by Winger Ed.
For some odd reason, back when the earth was new, Load data was withdrawn by Hercules for 41 mag loadings . It seemed to be okay for 357 mag and 44 mag but not 41 mag.
In the 44 Magnum 17 gr of BD does everything 22 gr of 2400 will under a 429421. I have actually pressure tested it.
https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...s-Alliant-test
True.Quote:
Originally Posted by racepres
But I was always a Blue Dot in .357, and 110 in .44Mag sort of guy.
I use Alliant Blue Dot for full throttle 10mm loads with 165 gr JHPs, 165 gr and 175 gr boolits. I expect your Hercules Blue Dot will work great for you in 10mm ….. even if you’re using a Glock. Ha!
Blue Dot in full throttle 12 gauge slug loads. If you can handle the recoil. 357 magnum loads, 44 magnum also. Soon as I find some more, I’ll buy some more. I think you’ll like it.
All Good...I am exactly opposite?? Maybe I'm more recoil sensitive??Quote:
Originally Posted by Winger Ed.
Blue dot's all I use for 9mm Luger. I've used it in 357 mag with good results, but mostly load mid range cast loads with HS-6 for the revolver.
Blue Dot works well in the .45 Colt! On of my favorite loads for revolver and rifle is 12.9gr with a 250, or a 255gr cast bullet.
Some light reading from awhile back:
https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...-with-Blue-Dot
I too acquired a big can of Blue Dot for not much money at a garage sale and went looking for load data that was not sky-busting goose killing loads. Up to that point 12 gauge big boomers was my only familiarity with Blue Dot.
Lotta stuff Blue Dot will do.
Good Luck.
Just stop it.Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting on a shoestring
Tupperware guns need love too.
This myth is getting to be like Paul Bunyan. Every time it is told the story strays farther from reality.Quote:
Originally Posted by frkelly74
In 2008 Alliant (not Hercules) found that a few loads for 357 mag 125gr, and apparently too many 41 mag loads were testing over SAMMI maximum pressure. They issued a warning not to use those loads, pulled them from the website, and promised to update their data eventually.
That is all there is. No more, no less.
Yes, back then several over on Accuratereloading forums were doing a lot of reduced loading with Blue Dot including a fellow with a then new Pressure Trace system. He was getting what he thought were "pressure spikes". The problem was with his set up and his misunderstanding, if not ignorance, of what he was actually seeing in the pressure traces [time pressure curves]. That included the 357 and 41 Magnums. What he failed to realize was the "spikes" he was seeing were from vibrations in the barrel acting on the strain gauge after the bullet left the barrel and the pressure had dropped off. That phenomenon is nothing new and has been observed since the first oscilloscopes were used many years ago in pressure testing.Quote:
Originally Posted by megasupermagnum
I talked to a technician at Alliant back then about the warning that Alliant had issued regarding the use of Blue Dot in the 357 and 41 Magnum cartridges. He stated Alliant had not actually tested the loads with Blue Dot but simply playing it safe because of the reported "pressure spikes". I have also thoroughly pressure tested Blue Dot [Herculese and Alliant] in both of those cartridges and have not had or seen any actual "pressure spikes". I have a jug of Blue Dot and will continue to use it in the 357, 41 and 44 Magnum cartridges along with several other cartridges.
And... There we have it...Done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Gibson
Thank you one more time Larry!!!
BTW the only load I reworked with New vs Old Blue Dot, is that 7.+ 38Spl loading... I simply reproduced the Velocity obtained with the Hercules powder..fat, dumb, and Happy
Thank you Larry, I thought someone would have an explanation. Happy new year!!!
I think you will like it. Good find.
What Larry said! For magnum pistol or carbine loads why ever would you burn 20% MORE #2400 when Blue Dot will do the same thing and burn cleaner? One of my favorite powders!Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Gibson
Along with the others, I too appreciate you clearing the air Larry! I never bought into the .41 mag Blue Dot warnings and continue to use it.
I suggest that no one shoot full throttle Blue Dot loads in Magnum pistol calibers in ambient temperatures below freezing.
I've experienced what I believe is pressure spikes by doing just that.
(louder reports, increased recoil, flattened primers, stuck cases)
I don't believe it's a myth, but I will admit, I have no way to document my experiences to you, for proof.Quote:
Originally Posted by megasupermagnum
I've talked to others with same experiences that I've had.
That's a whole other different myth. I was referring to the myth of bluedot not being ok for 41 magnum (but ok in other handguns), which is not true at all. It is one of the best 41 magnum powders there are.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe
The myth of bluedot spiking in cold weather, well I'm not sure what I can do to ease your mind. I regularly pressure test with the Pressure Trace II, and I've never seen anything except pressure going down in cold weather like every other powder. I don't take my pressure testing stuff out in the extreme cold, but I shoot all year. -20F has never been an issue in shotguns, handguns (many of which are full throttle magnum pistols), or rifles. Every single lot of powder Alliant produces is tested in their lab at -20F, including Bluedot. You don't have to take my word for it, Alliant is quite open and proud about the testing they do with their powders. They would never continue to make a powder that was in any way unsafe.
Blue Dot is one of the first-choice propellants for major power loads in .38 Super. Which is ONE of the reasons I would "ever burn 20% MORE #2400 when Blue Dot will do the same thing and burn cleaner".
Just saying...
I don't believe it's a myth.Quote:
Originally Posted by megasupermagnum
Felix talked about it (it took me a while to find this vintage post)
Fun fact: I still use Blue Dot...I have some plans for it's use in loading cast boolits in Rifle cartridges.
Quote:
07-27-2008, 08:30 AM
Just maybe I could be of help here, considering my experiences with BD. I have used several different older lots of it in quantity, ALL before the formulas started to change. My standard loads were/are 10-150K-357M, 12.5-220K-41M, 14.5-250K-44M, 9-60(225646)-222, all with CCI/Rem standard pistol. I shoot these loads only between 40 and 90 degrees which is in my comfort zone. These older lots are consistent enough day-to-day to where I could not tell any realistic difference in performance, velocity or accuracy.
Yes, the powder pressure spikes tremendously when pushed over the edge. Accuracy is quite smooth when using a quasi 15 percent reduction below that pressure edge which is fairly easy to determine with recoil alone. Unfortunately, accuracy keeps getting better as the edge is approached, and that is a major problem with BD in the hands of inexperienced users.
Along comes WW630 to hopefully take care of that problem. This powder has the speed regulated exactly half way between BD and 2400. There are no powders currently made which fit this bill.
Here is my speculation. It is difficult to formulate a powder in this speed range. BD lot changes of late deal with the dirty bore syndrome, and yet some chemist tried to introduce a formulation to eliminate that top end problem, as well as the crystal changes well below freezing temps. All powders are made with a controlled water content, and perhaps the BD performance range depends on that value being very closely regulated. When the powder dries out in storage of any kind, it's pressure capability is adversely affected because of the lack of tolerance.
In other words, it has been especially difficult to make a powder faster than 2400 and slower than Herco with stability required across all applications, gun and weather combined.
... felix
https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...l=1#post370874
375 H&H is awesome with Blue Dot[smilie=w:Quote:
Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe
those old Hercules cans are collectors items now a day. I wish I had kept my old powder cans from years ago.
Call Alliant. Bluedot does not spike in cold weather, no powder does. They might be able to help you figure out what happened in your loads.
10.5 Blue Dot in 45 acp, 200 gr Lyman BB lswc is a hot one. Best fired in a S&W 645 auto. May break a 1911? Had powder left over from shotguns.
In cold weather [freezing or below] what can be perceived a "pressure spike" is actually an ignition problem. It's how the powder ignites and burns that creates the pressure curve. Those ignition problems are most often solved with the use of a magnum primer in freezing cold weather.
I got a Ruger Blackhawk in 41 mag about 1985. I use a 225gr cast over 16.5 grs of Blue Dot for 1480 fps. Been using this from the start. Coldest I have ever shot this load was around -30. The empties slid easily from the cylinders so I assume there was no excessive pressure.
I had already shot a lot of these rounds when the 41 BD thing came out so I just ignored it and still do.
Thanks Larry.Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Gibson
I surely can't discount this theory.
Blue Dot also works quite well in 32-20 and 25-20 loads around 6 to 7 grs.
I also like Blue Dot in many rifle cartridges, I follow Seafire quite a bit. Good Luck and Good Shooting, Chris
Use it in cast loads in 06, 30/40, and 243 Win.
Anybody messing with Blue Dot in a .357 Maximum?
Blue Dot has been my "go to" powder for the .41 magnum for years, especially cast bullets. I have tried 2400 and H110 but did not like them in cast, getting better results with Blue Dot. I talked to Alliant about my load in .41 magnum and they sent me an email telling me my load should be just fine for my use. They did say one thing, a warning not use Blue Dot with maximum loads in weather below 30*. No explanation for the warning. I lost the email memo when my old computer crashed but am working on memory here(bad idea maybe). I never use maximum loads, I use a starting load and work up with each individual rifle or handgun until I get the accurracy I want and stop there. An old timer told me years ago some words of wisdom; if the load you are using doesn't get the job done, go up in bullet weight or go larger in caliber. I have found it to be sound advice over the years. I settled on the 30-06 many, many years ago as the ideal rifle for my uses and although I have played with other calibers, it is what I picked up when I went deer hunting, etc. I also came to like the 8x57mm round but it never replaced the 06 in my heart. my experience anyway, james
I love Blue Dot, .357 and .45acp.
I did have an issue with it. .45LC Ruger BH. I had loaded up some cartridges (I can't remember what they were). The load was supposed to give me around 1300fps. And it did for a few cylinder loads. Then one round had a significantly louder bang, more recoil and the chronograph said well over 1500fps. I pondered it a minute or two and then realized my shooting technique had been different. I had raised the gun up from a low position and fired it. Most of the time with that revolver I would raise it to cock the hammer and lower it to fire. So, I repeated the low position and had the same result. Loud, bigger push and higher velocity. Went back to the high position and it went back to 'normal'.
So, I stopped using BD when the load density was lower. For my other pistols the max loads fill the case quite well.
And I have noticed the lack of 125gn data for the .357. Has not been a problem for me for many years since I started shooting 140 or 158gn bullets in that caliber.
PS I also do use BD for gallery loads in the .308. 8gn in that big case works really well.