I have come into possession of older reloading dies. Herter, Lachmiller, and Bair. Are these any good, and how do they compare to what is made today?
They all appear to be well made, at least as good as some of the current made dies.
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I have come into possession of older reloading dies. Herter, Lachmiller, and Bair. Are these any good, and how do they compare to what is made today?
They all appear to be well made, at least as good as some of the current made dies.
Bair bought out Pacific in the ‘80s, IIRC. For a while it was a Bair-Pacific, then just Bair. The paint jobs and logos changed, but the quality stayed high. Pacific invented the modern C press and the 7/8” x 14 reloading die set.
Lachmiller Engineering made a full line of casting and reloading equipment. RCBS bought them out and only continued the lubrisizer in production, painted green rather than blue. Lachmiller’s stuff was as good as anyone else’s. I have a couple sets of Lachmiller loading dies, and the lubrisizer, and use them regularly.
Herter’s dies were made to a price. For a while, I think they were made for Herter’s by C-H, which went through an uncomfortable period quality-wise after the founder, Charles Heckman, died in an auto accident. They should be OK, but they are definitely the Low-Priced Spread. As one reviewer of the time wrote, “Herter’s stuff doesn’t always work the way it’s supposed to, but it sure is cheap!”
On the other hand, George L. Herter said that Herter’s products were made of the finest materials on the most modern production equipment by the most highly skilled craftsmen, and sold at fair prices, unlike the overpriced, shoddy rubbish that everybody else was foisting off on the hapless, ignorant reloading public.
So I guess you’ll just have to try the Herter’s dies and see how they do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bent Ramrod
Mr. Charles Heckman was a craftsman who made some great reloading tools and some of it went to Herter's. His heirs were NOT craftsmen and really didn't want to fool with making stuff. No surprise, they didn't last long and the business was eventually sold to become CH4D; now they are maintaining the custom build quality started by Charles.
Next, there never was any the Herter's dies because Herter didn't make anything. He contracted to buy dies (and presses, scales, etc.) from several makers at the same time to provide his catalogs the widest variety of design features on the market. To the best of my experience (and the experience of everyone else who actually knew what they were doing) Herter's least costly tools worked as well as those with much higher price tags.
Yeah. Same as, "Every web reloading guru in the know knows Lee's dies are too cheep to be any good", right? Except ... it ain't true! I've made chamber casts and gage tested a lot of dies from a lot of makers for a very long time. I found as much average internal variation between dies of the same brand as between different brands --- including Herter's ... and Lee's!Quote:
As one reviewer of the time wrote, “Herter’s stuff doesn’t always work the way it’s supposed to, but it sure is cheap!”
I started reloading as a tool brand snob, I just knew "my" favorite brand was "best"! But, I've used a lot of Lee and Herter's tools and dies since 1965 (and many other brands as well), and - when used correctly - every one of them has performed as well as I could ask. (And I haven't been a brand snob in decades! :))
^^^ What he said! ^^^
"It's a poor workman who blames his tools!" ;)
Froggie
My Dad gave Me a set of Herters dies in .303British, back about 1985ish. I've probably loaded 1,000rds or more. Never had any kind of problem. They are as well made as anything out there.
Pacific was bought out by Hornady in the 1980s. Bair made some of Pacific's products until they had some sort of falling out. Then Bair starting marketing their own stuff. Or, Bair started selling reloading equipment with their name and that led to the falling out. I think there was a lawsuit between the two companies and that might have led to the demise of the Bair brand, but I can't remember for sure. Some of the Bair presses are the spitting image of Pacific presses.
I have a set of Bair .30-06 dies. They've worked fine so far, though I haven't used them that much.
Lachmiller is good stuff. I would like to have a one of the Lachmiller 707 Olympian reloading presses.
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And speaking about the Lachmiller line of tools I have a few of their boolit molds along with a lube-sizer (blue, of course). All of these are quality tools that would be among the last to leave if I should have to reduce my tool inventory. Love them!
i started loading in 1958(sporterized o3a3 springfield in 3006) and a friend of my dad sold me a set of very old hollywood 3006 dies and a single stage pacific press for 5.00 and said fill the case up to the neck with 4831 surpluse powder and a 150 gr bullet. since then the rifle and press have gone, but i still use the hollywood dies.
The first.....and only set....of 38/357 dies I've used is an old Herters set, I guess from the 60's as I bought them used sometime in the early 70's. Seems there's a different step with them from the mainstream dies. Maybe they bell the case when you resize? It's been so long since I used them I forget.
I still use all mine. I think they are as good as any you can get today.
Dad left a press he bought in 74' the frame says Pacific but it's Hornady red and came in a Hornady Pacific box .
Dies and moulds on my bench from Bonanza , CH , Cramer , Forester , H&G , Herters , Hornady , Lachmiller , Lyman , LBT , MEC , NOE , Ohaus , Pacific , RCBS , and Redding from 1935 through 2016 ....... Unless you count the new H&I and push through sizer from Ammohead and the 10 Ga roll crimp tool then the stuff spans a whole century or close to it .
Yes I have a preferred brand I buy new dies and yeah the 15+ bucks is difference in price is worth it and unless a particular bullet is perfect for the application I have a preferred brand there as well .