Christian, Jew, and what's a Zionist?

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...ism-among-jews

I saw video of rabbis denouncing the Jewish state and was for a moment confused. I had always considered that if you where a Jew, that you where in full support of the state of Israel, but it appears that one can be a practicing Jew, and completely against the state of Israel. Then it occurred to me that most protestant Christians are zionist and far from being a Jew. It appears to me that this is just a protestant phenomenon and is not shared by Catholics or Orthodox Christians. I find myself in the position of being an anti-zionist protestant and quite at odds with many of my brothers.
I find it interesting how zionism isn't as cut and dried as many would have you believe.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/about-aice

I always look at the "about" page of any website I go to so I can get an idea of what they believe and their agenda.

The only thing that is cut and dried is whether or not a person accepts Jesus Christ or rejects Jesus Christ.

I didn't see anything on the "about" page to lift up Jesus.

Matthew 7:13
Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and many enter through it.
7:14
Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
7:15
Beware of false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.

Asking "What is Zionism?" is a great question. Is Zionism good or bad?

There is an old Indi parable about three blind men describing an elephant, one has the tail, another a leg, another the trunk, each is sure he knows what an elephant is. Then the elephant steps on them.

Wikipedia is completely biased, woke, correct, self-editing, and does a fair job of discussing Zionism. (If you want a good laugh, look up Hillary Rotten Clinton to see how wonderful she is). Zionism like Communism and Capitalism, mean different things to different people. I do not and will not ever understand why the Jewish vote in Long Island votes Democrat.

IMHO Zionism is Israeli nationalism, in a world where nationalism is seen as bad.

"Zionism... mean different things to different people."

Oh brother and how!

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IMHO Zionism is Israeli nationalism, in a world where nationalism is seen as bad.

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Basically correct.

Like anything else political, there are several slight variations that mean virtually nothing. Zion is one of the Old Testament names of the land God promised Abraham; that matters to some people.

A lot of the world's political "liberals" like to poke God in the eye about His promises and silly claims about the Land of Zion is one of their favorite targets. Historical fact is, there has never been a central government in control of the land today's Muslims and liberals improperly call Palestine.

That little chunk of arid waste land has long been nothing more than a shifting collection of "kingdoms" consisting of small towns and villages. The local come and go "kings" often fought to control of pieces of land worth nothing to anyone but the Jews who have lived there since Joshua arrived.

They've worked very hard since 1948 to make the land productive and their labors have made something of the place. Industrious Jews worked very long and hard in those fields and, because of them, the anchient wastelands of Israel have thrived. So, bloody hoards of Allah's mindless sloths really want to take it back so they can destroy it all as they did to Gaza.

Those Jews who want to keep and maintain the land under their own flag are called Zionists -- as if it were a dirty word.

It is worth mentioning that prophecy told that the wastelands would produce again, and it took the jews in the land to do it! As a Christian, I cannot separate world events and scripture.....and it looks like things are heating up towards a major happening!

Today in church we found Isaiah 61 at Luke 4:18,19
Jesus was reading Isaiah to the synagogue.
Isaiah 61:2
2To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,
(and then Jesus closed the Book in Luke)

and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn;

3To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD, that he might be glorified.

4And they shall build the old wastes, they shall raise up the former desolations, and they shall repair the waste cities, the desolations of many generations.

Why did Jesus close the Book at that place, give it to the minister?

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Originally Posted by fixit

As a Christian, I cannot separate world events and scripture.....and it looks like things are heating up towards a major happening!

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You pretty well sum'd her up!

Mr. & Mrs. GONRA were on a mid east tour in the 1980's.
In Israel, Tour Guide was a REALLY REVVED UP young blond Sweeedish Christian girl! !!

Mrs. (NOT Mr.!!!!) GONRA is EXTREMELY well versed in Religion, Philosophy - all that wierd stuff....
She explained that (what I call) "FRINGE CHRISTAIN RELIGIONS" are drawn to this area of the World 'cause
that's were it all started and they see all ending there too.
They WANNA BE READY!
They DO NOT WANNA MISS OUT IT ON ALL THE EXCITEMENT! !!
(Yawn)

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Originally Posted by GONRA

Mr. & Mrs. GONRA were on a mid east tour in the 1980's.
In Israel, Tour Guide was a REALLY REVVED UP young blond Sweeedish Christian girl! !!

Mrs. (NOT Mr.!!!!) GONRA is EXTREMELY well versed in Religion, Philosophy - all that wierd stuff....
She explained that (what I call) "FRINGE CHRISTAIN RELIGIONS" are drawn to this area of the World 'cause
that's were it all started and they see all ending there too.
They WANNA BE READY!
They DO NOT WANNA MISS OUT IT ON ALL THE EXCITEMENT! !!
(Yawn)

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I was there in 2006. There were a lot of tour groups and they struck me as mostly average folks, though I'm sure some of them felt as if they absolutely Had To make the journey at least once in their lives. The main reason to go there (if you can, just maybe not right now) would be to see it with your own eyes and hear it from the locals.

Look at all the “Christian” beliefs of our religion where some are for abortion and some against; some for the Jewish state and some for a “two state solution”; and some for including all manner of genders and some strictly Bible based definitions then explain how difficult a “Zionist” is to define. It’s no wonder God has to be the final arbitrator of good and evil! Thank you “Almighty Father”.

all kinds of people have all kinds of opinions its been that way probably since the first humanoids walked on two legs in Africa and will continue. In my time in the near east what I remember about Israel were the really great gyros at the little shops by the sea of gallilee. and another memorable impression were the dead blown up ww2 vehicles still there along the roadway on the way into jeruselum. but that was a long time ago.
cant really telly what zionist means and it isn't something I would let rent any space in my brain. got enough top do and think about just doing my own day to day stuff.
yup at this point in my life I think I would get another hobby if I had a lot of time to think about all the crap thats going on in the world.
got to go now and set up some more targets out back

If you really want to understand what's up with zionism today then there are basic historical and future facts to just accept and then move forward, but hardly anyone understands what's happening with zionism because they can't analyze the facts without getting all balled up with their emotions. It's like some sort of hysterical blindness. People who write or who preach about zionism are usually the same way, so biased in their angsts as to avoid consideration of what doesn't fit the template of their desires.

I'm taking for granted that Lebanon is fixing to get whacked.
Control of the Arabian peninsula needs to be consolidated, made safe for investors in the Ben Gurion Canal and the Houthis are providing the cause celebre for that. Control of Gaza needs to be consolidated for the oil companies signing onto leases there and Hamas provides the itch for that to be scratched off.
Ah, but wait... the eastern border is supposed to extend to the Euphrates and what's east of there will have to be tamed.
As for Lebanon, well, my guess is that it won't be long.

Psalms 72:8 KJV: He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth.

Margaret Hoover had the President of the Jewish Anti-Defamation League on the other night. He defined a Zionist as someone who believes Israel has the right to self-governance; an anti-Zionist would believe the opposite. Seems simple enough - but of course, it has proven otherwise.

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Originally Posted by kaiser

Look at all the “Christian” beliefs of our religion where some are for abortion and some against; some for the Jewish state and some for a “two state solution”;

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Our dreamy liberals are self deluded. There can never be a peace or two state solution when rag heads are born and grow up in hatred and determination to destroy the Jewish people (and everyone else). It's the only way of life they know and they'll never give that up so long as there's another breath in their murderous bodies. That's what they say and it's a fool's error to believe they don't mean it.

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some for including all manner of genders and some strictly Bible based definitions then explain how difficult a “Zionist” is to define. It’s no wonder God has to be the final arbitrator of good and evil! Thank you “Almighty Father”.

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God knows what's best for humanity.

Our "leaders", i.e., politically active people who are too highly educated to know how to define what a woman is and cannot even know if they should stand or squat to pee each day don't have enough common sense to try telling others anything about how to live (I give to you our Democrats).

Here is an idea I heard long ago...
Russia with the help of the United Nothing created Israel to spite the British, move out Russia's starving homeless rebel Jewish refugees, and provide constant customers for their WWII surplus tanks knowing from the start there could never be any Arab peace with any Israeli there. And their idea vacuumed a couple trillion dollars out of the U.S. with no effort at all.
Just an idea...kinda how it turned out anyway. Prophesy fulfilled so far with the next Chapter Coming soon.

Anybody wanta know about zionism? Might want to start your reading with back before the 1897 Zionist Congress. And later on Theodor Herzl, the Haavara agreement of 1933, Irgun (Etzal), the Stern Gang, the Deir Yassin massacre, the King David Hotel bombing. Oh, and then there's "as-above-so-below", the Khazarian religious conversion, the red shield of David, the Balfour Declaration and all the twisted political maneuverings that it took to get where we are today.
Whew! Said all that with only having had two cups of coffee and one donut.
But here's the thing. The really big thing. If anyone really reads up on all that stuff, the straight historical facts, they're likely as not gonna get personally emotionally involved and probably lose sight of what our creator is doing. You can almost guarantee it. I'm not advocating anyone ignore the facts or ignore history but just as the markets are driven by fear and greed the perception of history is also driven by emotions. Be frosty when you learn it and remember that God is in control.

https://youtu.be/W6BYRVOxc4Y?si=CUO3S_JegOMZ1dgp

Most people have no idea how tangled religions are, or why.

The roles of Israelites, Judah, practitioners of Talmudic Judaism and zionist politicians and zionist preachers in these end times gets real twisted, really tangled up.
Mom gave me a King James for Christmas in 1966. Less than two years later when 2001:A Space Odyssey came out I was able to realize that it didn't add up. Guess I've been interested in the reasons for alternative views ever since whether I can give Clarke and Kubrick any credit for it or not.
Today we live in a world captured by the alternative. Scripture is packed with prophecy so intellectually honest inquiry will reveal the truth of what is happening in this world right now and why. Then if the inquirer is honest the truth of Christ is revealed and a choice is indicated; to follow Christ or to turn away.

The end time return of Israelites to the Levant, those who claim to be of Judah but are not, and the roles they play in setting the stage for the Earthly confrontation between Christ and the devil are in scripture. It's reality guys. It's happening beyond all calculable probabilities.
By the way, that's a fact which makes real knee slappers of the intellectually dishonest attempts at arguing that it is self-fulfilling prophecy!
:happy dance:

I'm gonna go grab another cup of coffee.

I tried watch the video and it didn't pass the smell test, research robert sepehr and find out what his agenda is.


Psalm 132:13-14

For the Lord has chosen Zion; He has desired it for His dwelling place: "This is My resting place forever; Here I will dwell, for I have desired it.

History is history. Then there's the spiritual battle behind mankind's history that people get plum flummoxed over.

History is always written or rewritten by the ones in power. As today there many in this country trying rewrite history.


"those who claim to be of Judah but are not" what do you base this on?

I'm also interested in learning the 'future facts' he mentions should be accepted so we can move forward. It may help me with my blind hysteria.

He also mentioned Talmudic Judaism. I wonder how many have read that book? It gives a very eye-opening glimpse into our greatest ally and especially what they think of us - the goyim.

I'm curious. Are you actually not familiar?
Look at history, peoples who converted to Judaism as opposed to being of Judah.
I think you will find that both have been resettled into the Levant.

May not be totally on topic but I just feel like dropping it here.......I REALLY wish people would quit saying 'Jew' to describe all of Israel. Am I alone in being aggravated by that?
There were 12 tribes. 10 were scattered by Assyrians and traveled over the Caucasus mountains. Jews are NOT God's (only) chosen people......The line of Abraham Isaac & Jacob(Israel) are God's chosen people. I love our brother Judah but they're only one tribe.

One last thing on Christians & Jews.....Christ told John his opinion of the 7 churches and 5 got a bad review but 2 were favored (Smyrna & Philadelphia) ....what did those two have in common??? They both knew who CLAIMED to be our brother Judah but do lie.
There are 2 ways to be a Jew...You can be descendent from the Tribe of Judah...or you can reside in the Land of Judea. You can be born in Texas, move here to Tennessee and be a Tennessean. I can move to Texas and say I'm a Texan.....but am I?
I see these points mentioned in this thread and Bless you for that. It's NOT stated enough. The earth may not be flooded with water again but the flood of lies is on!

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Originally Posted by Nines&Twos

May not be totally on topic but I just feel like dropping it here.......I REALLY wish people would quit saying 'Jew' to describe all of Israel. Am I alone in being aggravated by that?

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Yeah it kind of grinds on me but most folks do it out of ignorance, they just are regurgitating the programming that they have been fed.

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Originally Posted by Nines&Twos

There were 12 tribes. 10 were scattered by Assyrians and traveled over the Caucasus mountains. Jews are NOT God's (only) chosen people......The line of Abraham Isaac & Jacob(Israel) are God's chosen people. I love our brother Judah but they're only one tribe.

One last thing on Christians & Jews.....Christ told John his opinion of the 7 churches and 5 got a bad review but 2 were favored (Smyrna & Philadelphia) ....what did those two have in common??? They both knew who CLAIMED to be our brother Judah but do lie.
There are 2 ways to be a Jew...You can be descendent from the Tribe of Judah...or you can reside in the Land of Judea. You can be born in Texas, move here to Tennessee and be a Tennessean. I can move to Texas and say I'm a Texan.....but am I?
I see these points mentioned in this thread and Bless you for that. It's NOT stated enough. The earth may not be flooded with water again but the flood of lies is on!

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Actually being a descendant from the tribe of Judah and or residing in "The Land" doesn't even make them a true (spiritual) Jew... That is according to
Romans 2:28-29
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

So... Technically the only true spiritual Jews are saved Folks that are saved by grace through faith.

I'll re-state what i said for emphasis, I love our brother Judah.....but the Epistle of John is quite clear .....if you don't have the SON you don't have the Father.
Between that and Hosea 6:6...'I want your love not your offerings' (paraphrased)....and most importantly, blood ordnances nailed to a Cross ....It's quite clear what kind of religion (modern)judaism is.
They don't/won't have a clue what a slap in the face it is to build a temple and offer some spotless red heifer.

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Yeah it kind of grinds on me but most folks do it out of ignorance, they just are regurgitating the programming that they have been fed.

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It grinds me how Biblically illiterate people are. I'm quite ashamed I don't know more than I do given the amount of time I've had [and wasted] to learn it.

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Originally Posted by Nines&Twos

May not be totally on topic but I just feel like dropping it here.......I REALLY wish people would quit saying 'Jew' to describe all of Israel. Am I alone in being aggravated by that?
There were 12 tribes. 10 were scattered by Assyrians and traveled over the Caucasus mountains. Jews are NOT God's (only) chosen people......The line of Abraham Isaac & Jacob(Israel) are God's chosen people. I love our brother Judah but they're only one tribe.

One last thing on Christians & Jews.....Christ told John his opinion of the 7 churches and 5 got a bad review but 2 were favored (Smyrna & Philadelphia) ....what did those two have in common??? They both knew who CLAIMED to be our brother Judah but do lie.
There are 2 ways to be a Jew...You can be descendent from the Tribe of Judah...or you can reside in the Land of Judea. You can be born in Texas, move here to Tennessee and be a Tennessean. I can move to Texas and say I'm a Texan.....but am I?
I see these points mentioned in this thread and Bless you for that. It's NOT stated enough. The earth may not be flooded with water again but the flood of lies is on!

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Well, it doesn't aggravate me but it does make me shake my head at times. What I've observed is that people latch onto views they want and then desperately defend the underpinning lies. I once observed a very intelligent person, a voracious reader, make the remark that Abraham was "an illiterate goat herding Jew". Hold that statement up to the light, roll it around and look how many absurdities it contains. That person allowed the needs of his rebellion to dictate the functioning of his rational mind, to keep him ignorant and deceived. That seems to be a condition shared by the majority of Americans these days on just about everything accepted as truth. To recognize the lies people have to dig in, study and then be willing to embrace what they find. Sometimes it hurts but sacred cows are too heavy to carry and it's a great relief to set them aside.

I've never heard Abraham referred to as such, but I am not the least bit surprised.
I say Abraham was pretty sharp and wise myself....he knew Jesus on sight and paid tithes to him. The average Christian doesn't even know their own Messiah. .....They think he's coming first.