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If you were going to mix up an alloy to be the best all-purpose blend, what would it be? Lyman #2? Hardball? A mix of your own? What ratio of what would work for the majority of bullets? You have linotype and pure lead to start with and maybe a bit of tin. You intend to coat the bullets using a powder coat or Hi-Tek.
Lyman #2 is the bench mark for a do-all alloy and what the Lyman book load data is based on.
A common 'do-all' is 1/2 wheel weights and 1/2 pure Lead.
Also, all clip on wheel weights is common too.
Rather than 'one size fits all', I use different alloys for different applications.
For pistols going under 1,000 fps, I only put enough 'goodies' into pure Lead so it casts well and conserves expensive ingredients.
For rifles and magnum handguns, I mix up a harder alloy along the lines of Lyman #2.
Personally, #2 is my go-to alloy for most things. Second would be WW+2% tin and I’ve also begun to use 16:1.
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You need to get two groups first. Rifle and handgun. Then two more. Standard and Magnum. Now your ready. This should help.
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I have three good pots, an original RCBS Pro-Melt plugged into a PID, a newer RCBS Pro-Melt W/PID, and a Lyman MAG 25 W/PID. I also have a reliable lead hardness tester. What alloy mix should I put in each pot? I use Hi-Tek as my preferred coating and I shoot just about everything.
I use 1/4 ww to 3/4 pure lead,then powder coat.
works great for my 45 acp,10mm,44 mag,38spl and 9mm.
You dont need as hard lead when you powder coat!
Fill your lead pots with lyman number two and cast your bullets, coat your bullets, size your bullets, shoot your bullets and don't worry about crappy accuracy and leading in the guns cuz it won't be a problem unless you have a mechanical issue with your guns like rough rifling, pitted bore, undersized cylinder throats or sharp chamber transition leade, or last but not least operator error.
Don't get rid of the soft alloys, save that for special occasions like really low velocity wadcutter loads for your 38 Special where they will sometimes perform better than the hard metals.
Isn't it nice to be able to isolate variables like that?
Now that's the way to do it.
Exactly! I have a nice stock of Lyman #2, and then I have accumulated a lot of softer stuff with a mystery blend. The #2 goes in the rifles and the rest in the pistols--years ago, before I learned this, I had some leading. Since then never.Quote:
Originally Posted by Recycled bullet
It is my understanding if the bullets are powder coated, hardness is not an issue. IF, that is the case, mix up what ever you have and add enough tin so the bullets fill out well, then powder coat and shoot them.
I do not powder coat, most of my pistol bullets are made with a mystery mix, it is never the same twice. I use a medium soft lube - no leading. Correct sizing seems to have a larger effect on leading, than hardness.
Trust me...hardness is always an issue. You can use a little softer bullets when you powder coat or coat with Hi-Tek but run a soft lead bullet too fast with anything and half of it will stay in the barrel.
Respond to my theory please. I think of lead like clay but (of course) harder. Alloys make that pliable bullet harder. Pure lead is the most pliable of lead and powder coating seals it. At a low pressure with a MV = 850fps for example, the pressure on it's base is enough to distort the base and bullet enough so it engages the rifling while maintaining it's shape and balance. With excess pressure, the bullet distorts and the center of gravity is thrown off and the coating is eventually rubbed off. This is when you need a harder bullet from a certain alloy. If you want to ensure higher pressure, then, a gas check. I think you have to find whatever MV and chamber pressure you want and choose the hardness accordingly.
I think the issue is obturation and heat. Too soft causes the entire bullet to distort. Higher velocity means higher pressure and more heat. The soft base of the bullet can't handle it and it suffers gas cutting. I think that's why gas checks work so well in some cases. When the soft lead obturates so badly it almost melts into the walls of the barrel. Anyway, that's how I think about it. I'm no ballistician. I have used Hi-Tek to successfully coat bore riding pure lead shotgun slugs and entirely eliminate leading. That was almost a miracle.
It may sound a little weird but too hard a bullet can cause issues with Hi-Tek bullets. I'm not exactly sure why but if I coat a linotype bullet at a lower velocity it seems to have leading problems. If I soften up the alloy. The problem goes away. This happens routinely in my 327 Mag.
I read a thread from an African hunter who would take a hard alloy and find an accuracy load for that bullet/alloy combination. Then, he would add lead to the mix until his groups started to open. This was his hunting bullet. I think gas checks prevents the flame cutting and allows for higher pressures to withstand obturation myself. I wish someone would make an affordable gas check cutter for plain base cast bullets.Quote:
Originally Posted by AbitNutz
Lyman #2 is my go to alloy.
Linotype for small calibers.
50/50 lino/WW for high velocity rifle loads.
I have a pile of lead and a pile of straight linotype. One of the issues is that I can't get to some alloys without having some pure tin....and man is that expensive. Rotometals wants $25.00 a pound on sale! I'm now trying to think of what kind of scrap has a high tin content. Hmm..most all Fiats any Chinese tools from Amazon, let me see...
My needs are a bit different than most cast bullet shooters and I only use one alloy 70 % WW, 20% Lino, 10% Magnum Shot, alloyed at a high temprature. When cast the bullets are direct dropped out of the mould into water through a single layer of floating wet peanuts. The alloy produces a very hard bullet. They are dried, inspected, sorted by weight, then double Powder Coated, then sized to the exact groove diameter using case lube on a pad. I shoot them in long range competition and in my ARs and bolt guns for hunting or varmiting. I have pushed the 200 RCBS 35s up to 2,500 fps with .4 group accuracy at 100.
The one all-purpose blend I use is a 50 - 50 mix of COWW / scrap lead .
Scrap lead being range lead (mostly 22"s) , stick on wheel weights , plumbers lead , wall and roof flashing , shower pans (when they were made of lead) , wall sheathing leftover from dr. X-ray rooms . And a bit of Line-O-type to add some tin ....
To make up 20 pounds - 9.5 lbs. COWW + 9.5 lbs scrap lead + 1 lb. Line-O-Type
= 20 lbs .
I air cool all my boolits and lubed with Lithi-Bee lube have not leaded any handgun or rifle loads but I've not exceeded 2,000 fps velocity ( shot in 30-06) ,
No leading with handgun loads with velocity to max 1200 fps .
So far this one blend does it all for me ... even if slightly soft ... I do believe in gas checks and use them when velocities are hitting 1,000 fps in handgun loads .
Gary
I use alloy #8 from this site: http://www.lasc.us/SuperHard.htm I use lead free solder for the tin because it has trace amounts of copper in it. As part of the lead content I add 2 pounds of arsenic containing lead made from size BB shot that's been fluxed & cleaned, then cast into ingots. Even though the formula on the webpage says that this will cast at 13 BHN, the air cooled ingots that I've made from this pencil test at 22 BHN. This has made an excellent alloy for cast rifle target shooting. For a basic pistol alloy I cut it 50/50 with pure lead. It's illegal to hunt with bullets that contain lead where I live, but if I were to make rifle bullets for hunting I'd experiment with adding around 30% lead. I treat alloy #8 as a hard base alloy that's easily softened for use in different applications. I've even taken the reject bullets that would normally go back into the pot and added them to a batch of pure lead to make 38 wadcutters. #8 is a very versatile alloy.
You do realize there is a member selling 95% tin solder on here in the S&S section right now and a MUCH lower price than that.Quote:
Originally Posted by AbitNutz
Brother...point me to him!
I like electrotype, or lyman 2 and soft mixed 50/50. It's similar to WW+2%Sn, but without the junk and orneriness of WWs. It casts wonderfully.
That stuff is hard to come by. I like it too.
I'd use your piles-O-metal and mix one alloy with 3% Sb for pot #1Quote:
Originally Posted by AbitNutz
then I'd do the same with those to make one with 1.5% Sb for pot #2
then Pot #3 I'd use for pure.
That is basically the three alloys I use. But I do add Sn to balance the Sb, so the alloy forms the SbSn bonds that make a "tougher" alloy, even thought there is no more hardness. If I didn't have a healthy supply of cheap Sn, I wouldn't add it.
that's my 2¢
https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...content-solderQuote:
Originally Posted by AbitNutz
I was able to sniff him out. That is indeed a great deal. Thanks for telling me about him!
2%-Tin, 6%-Antimony and 92%-Lead. - Called Hardball.
I see that alloy in the Excel lead spreadsheet. Lyman #2 is listed at BHN15 and Hardball is listed at BHN16. Lyman #2 is 5% Tin, 5% antimony, and 90% lead. I'm going to buy some 95% tin from a member here. I have a pile of linotype and a great deal of pure lead. With 95% tin ingots I can mix pretty much anything I want. I'm thinking I'll have a pot of pure lead, as I shoot a lot of black powder, a second pot of Lyman #2, and the 3rd pot with linotype.
I use Rotometals Linotype to harden near pure lead. Pure linotype not needed for pistol or rifle. Imo.