What can be used to resize the mouths of 357 Max brass so they will fit the 357 magnum cylinder? A 9mm Lee Factory crimp die? Lee bullet sizing die, .356? A 9mm size die?
Printable View
What can be used to resize the mouths of 357 Max brass so they will fit the 357 magnum cylinder? A 9mm Lee Factory crimp die? Lee bullet sizing die, .356? A 9mm size die?
i don't exactly remember what I used. I am sure I posted it in my thread from a year or two ago, but I think it may have been a Lee or NOE bullet sizing die around .356 to .360"
MIght have used a 38 special crimp die or 9mm crimp die
Not sure on 357 mag, but I used a 327 mag sizing die to "shoulder" some cut 223 brass to make 380 acp shotshells that were the same oal as a conventional load. Worked better than expected.
I did use a 327/32 seater die (0.330") to create the "neck" on the maximum brass.
For some reason, probably because the case isn't supported, the "neck" did not form concentric to the body with the 0.356 die. It needed a smaller constriction in order to fit in the chamber.
Just trim to 357 mag trim to length and reload using 357 Mag dies. They are the same case just a bit longer on the Super Mag (Max).
Back when I looked into doing this, there was a die to star crimp "blanks". That was the route I was going to go.
Star crimp ruins cases
I don't know your circumstance, but it may be worth going in another direction for a dedicated "Snake/Rat Gun." The Bond Arms "Roughneck" Derringer in .357 can be had for as low as $250. Ream it out with a 357 Max reamer and you have a pretty lightweight little snake gun that is easy to reload for and does not wreck the brass. I did the same to a Bond Arms 45 Long Colt and had it cut with a 460 S&W reamer. Still working up shot loads for it, but it holds way more #11 shot than a .410 shell does. Who knew that Harvester Muzzleloader 45cal Hi-pressure Sabots make excellent shot cups?
The bonus is that the barrels are relatively cheap and you can easily convert it back.
I keep seeing this thread and shaking my head. Necking down a Maximum case so it fits into the throat of a .357 Magnum cylinder means you're going to be driving your shot load through a funnel. Am I missing something?
No one has a full choke barrel on there shotgun?
I agree not an ideal situation, but is it really a problem. I am sure there will be deformation of the shot from the transition but i am only lookig for 800-900 fps out of #12 or dust, not a super handicap trap load of 7½s at 1330 fps.
Full choke doesn't reduce bore area by 14%, and the choke is at the end of the barrel, not at the throat.
Restriction like that is going to boost pressure by quite a lot. It's not like pushing gases through the neck of a shouldered rifle case, you're asking a charge of lead shot to crowd through.
How are you going to get wads past that reduced diameter without damage?
The 45ACP shot loads that many of us load utilize a shouldered case without any problems. I don't see this as being any different. I also have some longer, shouldered case shot loads for my 44 Mag revolver. Again, I haven't seen any problems. The pressures I use for shot loads are by necessity low or patterns suffer. I'm not advising anyone to follow this path, though. We can each decide what we are willing to load.
Well, I'm open to empirical evidence, but it seems mighty counter-intuitive to me.
Wads are disc of manila folder or a disc of primer cardboard. So getting the "wad" through the constriction isn't a problem. Just insert the disc sideways with a slight bend, push in, then tamp / flatten the wad on top of the powder.
Shooting higher velocities/ pressures is counterproductive to even groups. While the constriction boosts pressure, the pressures arent on the high end anyway.
i make shotshells for my 44 mag, that the brass is full cylinder length, and have no issues. 150 gr. load of #8 or #9, 9.5 gr. of unique. good enough for snakes at 10 foot away. I convert 303 brit brass.
Im a little confused as to why you would want to put a shoulder in at all...both 357mag and max are straight walled cases..... my understanding of a "snake load" is a shot payload fired through a handgun or rifle chambered in a straightwalled cartridge like these...so if you want to use a 357max in a 357 revolver...trim cases so they are NO MORE than maximum length of cylinder and load your shot INSIDE the case...maybe good thick wad of cardboard under shot a thin cardboard disc on top,cemented in place with couple of dobs of nail varnish etc to glue the disc to mouth of case and have at it.....the "payload" being front disc,shot and rear wad disc will all exit case and enter barrel ,encounter rifling and shove its way through ,hopefully not generating too much spin in process.....where is problem??? this is in effect how a steel sided .410 is loaded except a wad is used to hold payload...
I use a shortened .410 shot shell shot cup for some .45 snake loads.
ok that makes sence now.....as the payload will be mostly still inside this area it shouldnt matter....
if you look at rule of thumb with STEEL shot in older guns or tight chokes,less than #3 shot and lightish payloads..both are suggestions to prevent bridging...all the pellets trying to get out of constriction at once and bunching up.... the amount of restriction you looking at will be minimal and shot os lead=softer and small shot sizes=lots of ability to move/wiggle around and make room so it SHOULD BE fine. as to how to shrink it down to size...yeah I will leave suggestions to those who know.
You can size the 357 Maxi cases in a 300 blackout die, which will neck down the case mouth to 30 cal.
such that the shoulder will be at 357Mag length. Then expand the neck with a lyman 8mm M die.
The result will be a case 'neck' that will fit nicely in the throats of the 357mag cylinder
beltfed/arnie
My thinking, since reading about somebody who used a .222 Remington sizer; I tried it, and all I got was FLB. (funny lookin' brass) Then I tried my Dillon Pro crimp die, which helped a little. My:idea: "Solution"(?)...get a carbide .32 sizer die, which will reduce the case mouth diameter of the Maximum brass so it will fit into the shorter 357 Mag. cylinder, and get some .32 caliber gas checks for over-shot use. The first firing should fire form the brass so there will be no more problems. (I hope!) So, That's where I am today. Too cold for the range now, so come spring, I should know if the WIIDOW (What If It Don't Work) factor has struck...Orrrrr...Murphy's Law.:mrgreen:
One problem, tho...#12 shot. Where can I get 2 or so lbs. of it? even the smallest amount sold on line would be a lifetime supply! The really cheap shotgun shellls with #9 shot have disappeared from Walmart shelves locally. Duck season opens soon, so maybe there will be some next time I venture into Wally World.
Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays!
As regards bottlenecking the 357 Max, I use a Lee 300 BO sizing die that has the lower portion opened up enough to slip fit a 38 case. As it comes from the factory, it is a tad tight and will sorely abuse the case.
Way before One forms the Max case, One needs to prime, charge and place the over powder card (I like the 1/8" .36 cal card from Track of the Wolf). At this point, lightly lube the case, being careful to not get any lube in the case mouth. Once the case has been bottlenecked, add the shot charge leaving about 1/16th inch space above the shot. Place a .315" +/- diameter card over the shot charge. I use an 8mm Mauser case that has been sharpened to cut my over shot cards from soda or Shiner 12-pack boxes.
Backset a 222 Remington sizing die such that the mouth of the case just barely engages the shoulder forming surface in the 222 die. Play with the adjustment until you get a roll crimp on the case mouth.
Once you have your shells made, get some $3-a-bottle colored fingernail polish and daub the wetted brush around and under the roll crimp area, and work your way out until you have a uniform coating on the card. Use a dedicated color for each shot size you may use, to keep things in order.
If you intend to re-use the brass, I highly recommend annealing the brass before you start the process. Also, if you are loading for a Model 60 Smith, you will need to trim the brass .063".
The above method has worked well for me, for about 400 rounds now. As always, your mileage may vary.
Milky Duck: If the velocity of the charge is too high, you certainly will scatter shot. If you put the shot round on a standard rifle target at 10-12ft (about the best range for using a pistol shot shell) and you get a circular pattern with an empty center, reduce your powder charge. The loads I use, with #12 shot, give a dense, uniform pattern about 12-15 inches in diameter from a 6 inch barrel. A 2 inch snubby opens up only a small bit more.
Trigger; Thanks for the offer, but I have enough #9 for the forseeable future..it's the smaller sizes in reasonable amounts that are hard to find.8-)
Bottom of the page:
https://www.ballisticproducts.com/Ma...t/products/68/
we saw that when trying birdshot and even buckshot through a rifled .12ga topper....was very disapointing as thought we had found the ultimate carry gun for wallabies where #2 lead takes care of 90% and a 100yard shot makes up the other 10%...nope epic fail so back to shotgun in hand and rifle across back.
A friend's wife has snake phobia. And a chief's special. You don't really need the 357 max case capacity if your plan is to empty the gun on each snake. Speer plastic shot capsules have worked for her for years. They are hard to find right now. But they avoid the barrel leading no one has mentioned, and they pattern well enough with 7 1/2 shot to get the job done. They do not create doughnut patterns.
My preference is to use the Speer capsules, as they are easier. However, in their absence I had to have something that would hold enough shot to be effective. For my personal use I used 454 Casul in my 45 Colt New Service. For the folks I know that have 38 snubbies and an overabundance of rather large rattlebugs, I used the 357 Max method. It is a case of necessity.
12 GA. Shotshells made by RIO can be had in #12 shot size.
A box of them broken down for the shot will make more pistol shotshells than you will ever shoot.
I am wondering if the case is fire formed with light loads. My thought is to reduce the diameter down to so point above where the powder level would be. Some where above the top of the case head. this would allow the shot column to be of uniform diameter. set the diameter height to get the weight of shot one wants. For those that have shot the 357 Max case, does it move the "shoulder" forward to the end of the 38/357 chamber? If it does expand out/forward, could a sleeve be slipped over case to fill the annular area?
I do the same thing as trigger-happy does. I turn the rim on .303 Brit to fit the extraction star, cut the overall length to just under the length of the cylinder charge hole, re-size with a .44 mag die and then set a "bottle neck" with a 10 mm sizing die. I set that neck to the length to fit the reduced dimension of the front of the cylinder. Load and seal with a card & Elmer's white glue. Works way better than the commercial "capsule" loads.
Tad late in responding...
The loads I have made fire-form to the chamber dimensions. Also, you will want to anneal the top 3/8" from the case mouth if you intend to re-use the fired cases, elsewise they will split at the end.