what tang sight for trapdoor

I have an 1884 trapdoor. My eyes are at the point that the fine sights can no longer be seen clearly. I would like to mount a vernier tang sight but can't find much info on what would work. Track Of The Wolf has a number of creedmore sights that look like they might work but don't mention anything about fitting a trapdoor in the description. If anyone has any experience with this type or project I would appreciate anything you could offer. I don't need a 300$ sight. This is a parts gun but a good shooter.

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Originally Posted by saturn

I have an 1884 trapdoor. My eyes are at the point that the fine sights can no longer be seen clearly. I would like to mount a vernier tang sight but can't find much info on what would work. Track Of The Wolf has a number of creedmore sights that look like they might work but don't mention anything about fitting a trapdoor in the description. If anyone has any experience with this type or project I would appreciate anything you could offer. I don't need a 300$ sight. This is a parts gun but a good shooter.

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I was in the same boat with my 1888 TD but I didn't like the idea of mounting the sight on the wrist of the stock. I now have a Williams radius bottom receiver sight mounted just ahead of the breech. I used Loctite Black Max to secure it. No holes drilled. A sharp whack with a lite hammer will knock it off and the glue comes off with a little heat and some acetone. The sight costs around $30.00. I now have the same sight on my Sharps carbine, 1868 TD and 1871 Rolling Block. All originals and no butchering for the sight.

Do you have the Williams number for that sight and where did you get it ?

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Originally Posted by tdoor4570

Do you have the Williams number for that sight and where did you get it ?

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WGRS-BAR. I got mine from Midway, but other vendors have them, too.

There is a guy Ernest Brandt at https://www.trapdoorcollector.com//index.html that makes a small rail that mounts to the rear sight holes that a red dot can be mounted to. I was going to get one but he can’t ship it to Canada.
I know many would consider this blasphemy but with my old eyes it would be a blessing as I have to use optics on everything now. Trying to see the sights on my 1873 is almost impossible.

I forgot to mention that I leave the aperture out to make it a ghost ring.

Thanks a bunch for the info.
Varsity, did you have to add height to your front sight to get the WGRS-BAR to shoot somewhere close to original sights?

I checked a few online places that will ship up here and that sight seems to be out of stock.

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Originally Posted by saturn

Thanks a bunch for the info.
Varsity, did you have to add height to your front sight to get the WGRS-BAR to shoot somewhere close to original sights?

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Yes. It's 7/16" high.

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Originally Posted by Carrier

There is a guy Ernest Brandt at https://www.trapdoorcollector.com//index.html that makes a small rail that mounts to the rear sight holes that a red dot can be mounted to. I was going to get one but he can’t ship it to Canada.
I know many would consider this blasphemy but with my old eyes it would be a blessing as I have to use optics on everything now. Trying to see the sights on my 1873 is almost impossible.

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Oh my ... that featured trapdoor is VERY COOL! Id love to have a trapper like that. Might need to begin gathering parts for a build. Thanks for sharing that.

I have gotten so much information and help from Trapdoorcollectors forum and especially from Al Frasca. Have bought original parts and tools for my Trapdoor from Al that are the real deal. There is a ton of information on that site for the Trapdoor.

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Originally Posted by varsity07840

Yes. It's 7/16" high.

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Thank you sir. If I go that route I guess I'll have to make a new one.

Here is a tang sight I recently installed on a trapdoor sporter. It is a Sharps Soule type sight. I made a steel tang extension that went under the original tang and the tang screw holds then both in place. I used a rear screw on the extension. You can remove the barrelled action and leave the tang extension in place.

Attachment 258897

Williams sight on my TD. I have no idea why it's upside down.

My ultimate Trapdoor.

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Originally Posted by varsity07840

I was in the same boat with my 1888 TD but I didn't like the idea of mounting the sight on the wrist of the stock. I now have a Williams radius bottom receiver sight mounted just ahead of the breech. I used Loctite Black Max to secure it. No holes drilled. A sharp whack with a lite hammer will knock it off and the glue comes off with a little heat and some acetone. The sight costs around $30.00. I now have the same sight on my Sharps carbine, 1868 TD and 1871 Rolling Block. All originals and no butchering for the sight.

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Does that adhesive you using hurt the bluing at all? My Trapdoor has perfect bluing on 80% on the barrel and I would sure be pissed if it hurt it at all as I would like to try what you did.

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Originally Posted by Carrier

Does that adhesive you using hurt the bluing at all? My Trapdoor has perfect bluing on 80% on the barrel and I would sure be pissed if it hurt it at all as I would like to try what you did.

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My '88's barrel has turned brown and spotty in some areas. Very easy to touch up with cold brown. Two of the others are in the white. The Sharps was a victim of a poor rebluing job. I stripped it off and refinished it to an antique faded blue. On a perfect blue, I'd use hot melt glue which has also worked for me. It peels right off. None of the rifles I mentioned are anywhere near collector grade, but I draw the line at drilling holes in the wood or metal where they don't belong. Make sure with any method that the spot on the barrel and the sight base is degreased.

The H&R Officer Model reproductions used a cheap copy of originals. Some pics here

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q...ight&FORM=IGRE

They were not what I consider a quality sight for other than sighting in at one distance and windage.

https://www.assra.com/cgi-bin/yabb/Y...num=1459577958

We talked about year ago at my table at the gun show.

The sight I considered from Track of the Wolf is the RS-creed-3-WE. After looking at the pictures M-Tecs posted I think it would work. Any thoughts on that?

The biggest issue with mounting a tang sight on a trapdoor is the very minimal drop from the boreline to the wrist compared to , say, a sharps, Ballard, Stevens, or Winchester high wall. You need a tang sight that allows the peep to be lowered down far enough so that you can see the original rear sight picture through the peep. Otherwise, you end up having to put a very high front sight on as well to get sight line approximately parallel to bore, unless all your shooting is going to be done at very long range. A Soule is a beautiful sight, but will raise the peep way above boreline on a trapdoor. You may have to consider something like the Dr. Goodwin sight, which, though serving the purpose well, costs nearly as much as a nice rifle. https://www.buffaloarms.com/kelley-k...-sight-akelkos Why not just open the peep aperture on you Buffington sight a bit? Should work just fine, and you have the advantage of using the fine graduations and windage feature on that very fine sight, the most sophisticated sight design ever placed on a rifle issued to a common foot soldier

John is certainly correct. But the other thing to consider is that the base of the tang sight base to be mounted well behind the tang in order for the hammer to clear the eyepiece for windage adjustment on the sight. That means inletting the sight base into the wood, behind the tang, which I'm unwilling to do, because sooner or later my TD is going up for sale and I would think that a buyer wouldn't want a bubba'd rifle.

My rifle already is a (bubba) so the inletting or drilling a hole doesn't bother me. I would drive to TOTW with my rifle and take a look see as far as fit but, the Gov. has issued the stay at home order and I don't think that would qualify as a basic need.

I got mine from Lee Shaver after a number of N-SSA folks strongly recommended him.

Clyde Baker, in his 'Modern Gunsmithing', told of a very handsome conversion of a trapdoor into a Whelen pistol gripped sporting rifle. The rear sight was a Lyman designed for the Savage 1899, screwed to the steel tang. It handily (heh) cleared the wrist.

I've offered up this Lyman sight to my trapdoor and it's a good fit, with an appropriately low sight line. Looks wonderful, too.

Great idea, Nueces! Never thought of the Lyman Savage 99 sight. That's an excellent option, and, it could be JB Weld'ed to the tang instead of drilling and tapping. If you want to remove it in the future, pull the barrelled action from the stock, lightly heat the tang with a mild torch, and the sight will pop off with invisible results.

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Originally Posted by Nueces

Clyde Baker, in his 'Modern Gunsmithing', told of a very handsome conversion of a trapdoor into a Whelen pistol gripped sporting rifle. The rear sight was a Lyman designed for the Savage 1899, screwed to the steel tang. It handily (heh) cleared the wrist.

I've offered up this Lyman sight to my trapdoor and it's a good fit, with an appropriately low sight line. Looks wonderful, too.

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was that sight the model 1 or 1A?

I finally got the wgrs-bar sight,most everyone is out of stock. Got it from Ochocos outdoors in Oregon, was that 7/16" high measurement from the barrel or from the sight base to the top of the blade? That was in the post from varsity07840.

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Originally Posted by Nueces

Clyde Baker, in his 'Modern Gunsmithing', told of a very handsome conversion of a trapdoor into a Whelen pistol gripped sporting rifle. The rear sight was a Lyman designed for the Savage 1899, screwed to the steel tang. It handily (heh) cleared the wrist.

I've offered up this Lyman sight to my trapdoor and it's a good fit, with an appropriately low sight line. Looks wonderful, too.

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Photos of the sight on your Trapdoor please?

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Originally Posted by tbx-4

Photos of the sight on your Trapdoor please?

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Have not installed it, only held it to the tang to verify fitment. Baker's book has some nice B&W photos of the original.