Did Jesus rise from the Grave? Fact or Fiction? Myth or Reality? Sure and Certain Hope or Baseless Vanity?
What do you think?
exile
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Did Jesus rise from the Grave? Fact or Fiction? Myth or Reality? Sure and Certain Hope or Baseless Vanity?
What do you think?
exile
If you are a Christian, then you'd better hope that he did........ to paraphrase Paul, if He didn't then there is no hope for our resurrection. Yes, of course he did. If you believe the Holy Bible, His resurrection caused quite a stir at the time, and He later appeared to his followers. If you don't believe in the events recorded in the Holy Bible, then there is no point to your question as you are an atheist. His resurrection is "what's it's all about." It is the Gospel.
A lot of people witnessed both the crucifiction and resurrection of Jesus then went to their own cruel deaths because they would not recant what they knew. Dieing the way so many of them did takes more than "blind faith", it takes certainty.
So, yes, by any reasonable standard, Jesus was/is risen. And He is not "a" god, He IS God and there is no other.
There is but one God. The creator of the Universe.
Tim
How can you say that if person doesn't believe in the Bible they are an atheist? There are many different religions in the world what makes your religion the only one? this was the very meaning of our independence and the meaning in the First Amendment. One thing almost all religions have is the belief in a single God. What difference does it make how one reaches out to God? for you to say that simply supports the same ideology of Islam, believe in my way or else. I believe in the Bible but only in the Old Testament. I am not an atheist and for you to claim I am is repugnant. I looked up what the meaning of your handle is. Maybe I'm not surprised by your statement after all.
Wow, John, lighten up a bit, will you? I never heard of you before, don't know you, am not a mind reader or psychic. I did not claim that you are an atheist. Are you? It doesn't matter a whit to me-- be what you want to be, just as shall I.
Take a deep breath, and consider this: Every religion in the world believes that they are the true, correct religion. Is that not so? If they didn't believe that then there would either be only one religion, or none at all. I mean, would they waste their time subscribing to a set of beliefs and behavior that they didn't believe in?
Yes, Islam claims to be the one true religion, and so does Christianity. Christianity teaches that there is only one way to salvation, doesn't it? I didn't make that up. As an aside, it's a nice thing that Christians don't behead you for non-belief, whereas the same can't be said for Muslims.
Since you believe only in the Old Testament I take it that you are Jewish? And because my "handle" is German in origin I take it that you find that offensive because of the holocaust? My, my--sensitive aren't we? You'd need to research a little more to understand the meaning of the name, but if it's any comfort my relatives left Germany in 1923. It's about as fair for you to make that insinuation as for me to speculate that your relatives are pawnbrokers. If you are indeed of Jewish descent, then you must know that your ancestors persecuted the early Christians, demanded that Pilot crucify our Lord; and that the Torah and the Hebrew religion, although they may attempt to live in peace with other religions, believe that theirs is the only true religion. So why do you find it unreasonable that a Christian should believe the same about his religion? Rather intolerant, aren't you?
I stand before you to say that the only way to salvation is through the acceptance of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, the Son of God. You may reject it, put it out of your mind, rail against it, but someday all of us, Christian, Jew, Hindu, etc. shall stand before God and be judged. I'll offer you this, which is quite in conflict and contrast to the conventional Christian doctrines: I believe that all will be given the chance at that time to accept the sacrifice and salvation, no matter what beliefs they adhered to in this life. When we see him on his throne with the nail marks in his wrists and ankles and the mark of the spear in his side, it will be impossible for most to deny him. Only the truly, incorrigibly evil shall be thrown into the Lake of Fire to suffer the second death. Far out, eh? Study the Book of the Revelation-- not found in the Old Testament.
Religion, politics, and Gew 88s bore sizes are all bad subjects in which to engage, as the conversation almost immediately becomes conflict. I regret having answered the OP, and shall disconnect from this thread. But John-- lighten up a bit, will you?
Beyond all doubt. "He is Risen! He is Risen indeed!"
If you do not or can not believe that, well there is Islam, Buddism, Zen, you name it. Many many choices.
But if you call yourself a Christian, you have to believe he was Raised from the dead.
Yes, He rose.
I believe the Bible is the Word of God. He is risen indeed!
Yes, He has risen indeed and He lives for ever more.
[Sarcasm Mode ON]
Somebody explain to me the Scientologists concept that Christ was a shape-shifting space alien that was beamed up to the Mother ship? Does Tom Cruise read this forum?
[Sarcasm Mode OFF] Bless me Father for I have sinned...
My guess would be deception, Jesus warned us 4 times in Matthew ch 24 about being deceived.
There are many beliefs about diety in the world. If there is one God then there is one way to please him and I believe that is the Holy Bible. As specific as things are in nature,then I assume God has a specific way in which He wants us to worship him. My personal research has concluded that the Bible is Gods Word and we should abide by it.
If there are different conflicting beliefs how many can be correct? Would an all powerful God have many ways to approach Him? I think not. God honors obedience.
"For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart."
Hebrews 4:12
"Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”
John 8:47
Yes He has risen! He is our ONLY hope! My belief is not persuaded by a book full of words, my belief is persuaded by a God is omnipotent-the same yesterday, today and forevermore!
Do any of our doubters want to suggest any other person who has had the lasting impact on history and humanity than that of Jesus after his mortal death and eternal resurrection?
Another thread separating the sheep from the goats.
Hallelujah, He is risen!
In His word He warns us that many will be unbelievers. What makes HIM the only one for me is not the Bible, which is His unerring word, but it is that He has spoken to me many times. Before you ask, no I have never heard His voice... with my ears. But I have many times "heard" His guidance for my life with my spiritual heart. If you wish to know about God and His Son, our Lord and Savior, why don't you ask Him? But, if you truly desire to know Him, then be respectful and quiet your mind, open your heart and listen. He will answer you, if you're not interested in being sincere and serious then believe what you choose. Perhaps you should read 1 Kings 18:20-40.
The Lord tells us, " be in the world, but not of the world". In other words don't do what the world does just because that's what the world does. Don't be a follower of the world!
I'm familiar with the story of Elijah. And I have, many times, sat in silence and listened. I guess my personal issue is with blind Faith. Billy Graham could've built a campfire and asked the Lord to light it, do you think it would've spontaneously combusted? The people of Moses witnessed miracle after miracle and still doubted and did not believe. I personally cannot just blindly follow something that I cannot witness. I really wish I could.
I haven't a clue what your Eurocentric world means but Christianity rose in the mid-east.
Do you seriously think God - or we - cares what your beloved innerlecsually blind "greater world" believes? God's spiritual world is truth; truth is NOT a subject to be settled by taking a vote of mush headed spiritual no-nothings.
When all is said and done, much more is said than done. After all of it, one fact remains; no one in has had the historical impact of Jesus' sinless life, vicarious death and victorious resurrection.
Amen, that's what most of them seem to be anymore. If you can't, our won't believe the witness recorded, view the historical evidence, or recognize the power of the resurrection and Jesus intervention for us, then God help you on the day you are resurrected to stand before THE GOD with no intercession from his son!
There's plenty of evidence that Jesus is God's son and arose from the dead. It's up to each of us what we do with it.
There is no witness recorded evidence only hearsay. What evidence there is has weak providence and convoluted chain of custody. I don't think doctrine says we are resurrected to appear before God, we meet God the moment of our death. I have no fear of appearing before God to be judged without Jesus. How are you going to feel if Jesus is not there?
Tim
Eurocentric world view disregards the beliefs and cultures of native peoples of Asia, Africa, Australia, Pacific Islanders and the Americas. Jesus' historical impact on the World is less than it appears you imagine. Less than one third of the people of the world are Christian. A quarter are Islamist. It is a close call on whether the Christians or the Islamists have done more evil. It is not clear if Jesus has made the world a better place. I think the world would be a better place of we were all Confucians. Confucianism revolves around the pursuit of the unity of the individual self and the God of Heaven.
Tim
Surprise, surprise! :) Thank you for all that help but even little ol' me knows what the book definition of Eurocentric is. What I still don't know is how you think it means anything in this conversation.
While I suppose Eurocentric is an impressive sounding word, I don't believe it means a thing as you first posed it because I believe all, or nearly all, of us know a bit about all those other religions and have rejected them without a single thought of how Europeans believe. ???
It was the Spanish, Dutch, British and Portuguese that spread Christianity to Asia, Africa, North America, South America and Australia. You are probably a European, you can't help but think like a European. There was a time when most North Americans were Europeans. I am a European who made it a point to look outside my European/American culture to find something better.
Tim
We should fear God. He isn’t the end of the day “time clock” that we punch after living. And how are you gonna feel if Jesus is there? After all Jesus said..
Therefore whoever confesses Me before men, him I will also confess before My Father who is in heaven. Matthew 10:32
Ever heard of having something and not needing it as opposed to needing something and not having it? We all take pride in gun ownership, shooting, reloading and spreading the holy sacrament of the second amendment. God looks down sometimes and just wishes and hopes we all would take stock in Him like that! I’ll be the first to admit I need to put more into this Admiration! But yes, there will be a judgment day.
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All of us here who are self proclaimed Christians, born again, washed in the blood, sanctified, redeemed, opted to have our names written in the "Lamb's Book of Life", baptized, converted, turned from all old ways to Follow Jesus, started believing....or however you want to put it, we all understand things on a spiritual level. As someone mentioned earlier "we're in this world, but not of this world".
Our responsibility is to exhibit the same love Christ has for us to others, not to judge or dictate or argue the spirits but instead convey that unconditional Agape love that only the Father and the Son has for us. We were all given free will. We all have the capacity to believe whatever. The kicker is, "God" is "God" and Him being "God" is not going to love a serial killer ANY less than a divine Christian! Jesus is there with open arms to accept ANYONE who wants to let Him lead their life. The devil once tried to oppress me with the thought that by handing my life over to Jesus that I would be joining a "cult". NADA, I told him! Oh the peace and tranquility and the feeling of being "wanted, welcomed and warmed" in the arms of Jesus!
I know there is so many questions, so many things people want "pre-defined", evidence-things you have to see to believe! It's just not how it works! "Faith is the substance of things hoped for, and the evidence of things NOT seen" Hebrews 11:1
I would implore everyone who doesn't know Christ as their personal Savior to get to know Him right now! Would I thumb my nose at you if you didn't? Turn my head or roll my eyes? NEVER! It all comes down to the promise God made in John 3:16. But like I said, in the mean time, no matter what you believe-God still loves YOU!
Yes, well said.
There is nothing better than a relationship with Jesus Christ, any thing else leads to eternal destruction with weeping, wailing & gnashing of teeth.
God was Created by man to explain the Unexplainable. There are many beliefs throughout history and the world that are Unexplained, does that make then beliefs.
I have and do "explore the bible" I find much in the bible to be admired and practiced. If the New Testament is just a parable, fictional story, sometimes called the greatest story ever told, it is still a valuable lesson. I model my life after Jesus but I think the story is a tall tale. I also find the words of Confucius valuable lessons and I try and practice what he taught. Confucius never claimed to be God or that his word were the words of God but his lessons are as valuable as the lessons of Jesus. Reading the Bible and studying what we know of the time and place. The claims that Jesus arose from a tomb and ascended into heaven and then returned in the flesh to appear to his disciples are not substantiated with enough evidence to be convincing. I can't say for sure they did not happen but I would never try and convince anyone that they did, I don't believe they really did happen. People who believe are pretty much taking the Bibles word that the Bible is true. The only thing that says the Bible is the word of God is the Bible.
Tim
That's an odd statement, apparently based on your own hearsay because you cite no personal example. Fact is, virtually everything written in scripture is either by personal knowledge or direct revelation from God and retold by personal knowledge.
And, I suppose that from your point of view, "much" of history is only questionable hearsay because very few historians actually participated in the great events they write about so, to them and then to us, it's only hearsay. (Did I get all of that right?)
Ah, Tim, it's sad that you know so much about everything yet seem to understand so little of anything.
Scholarly history is based on recorded eyewitness testimony backed up by physical evidence. The authors of historical books don't have to have witnessed the events if they can cite records of the actual eye witnesses. Do you understand how scholarly history books are written? The bibles are the recording of oral traditions with no references to recorded eyewitness testimony. They are stories passed verbally from one person to the next sometimes over a period of centuries before they were recorded in the bible. The New Testament stories were recorded by authors who did not witness the events and maybe did not actually talk to the witnesses. Some of them were not even written by the suggested authors.
The Bibles are not scholarly history books. They are more accurately referred to as Legends.
legend
1a: a story coming down from the past
especially : one popularly regarded as historical although not verifiable.
Legends often suffer from a bit of embellishment.
Why do you think that Jesus rising from the grave means Jesus is God? After all his mother did not even die, she was taken up to heaven, living body and soul at the end of her life.
Several scriptural passages have been theologically interpreted to describe the ultimate fate in this and the afterworld of the Mother of Jesus. Various apocryphal documents do contain narrations of the Assumption of Mary.
Tim