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I have a Taurus tracker and a Marlin rifle. These are the components I have on hand.
Powders-
Lil gun,2400,green dot, unique,bullseye,tight group,red dot,w231,power pistol,trail boss,and some others
Boolits- hard cast 200 grain rnfp
CCI primers LP and Mag
I will be hunting Whitetails at 100 yards or less.
Thanks,
Dave
First thing I wuld do is get some heavier bullets. A 200 grainer is light for a 44 mag. I would prefer something in the 275 to 300 gr range.
Hi Homesteading1:
Your 200 grainers will work well enough if you stay within the 100 yard hunting distances you've mentioned.
You'll need to practice alot with your chosen load because, it's not really optimum for hunting white tails but, with good shot placement, it will get the job done. Be prepared for the possibility of having to track a wounded deer.
I use 296 and Unique powders myself. Unique powder is used for my light loads. (240 gr. semi wad cutters- 8.5 grains) Rabbits, coyotes and paper targets are the only thing I've ever shot at with this load. Works extremely well for all of the above.
The 296 powder is used for my full-power loads but, I've never had the opportunity of shooting anything larger than a coyote with these loads either. When deer hunting, I've generally used my 308 winchester. The 44 was just my backup gun.
HollowPoint
2400 Magnum powder? I like that stuff but, don't have a 44 mag. I use 15.5 grains in a 41 mag load, gets around 1350 fps.
Develop the accuracy load for the rifle staying within published handgun data. If you develop the load for the revolver manytimes it is then too fast for good accuracy in the rifle. Suggest you start with the LP primers and Unique. Start at 10 gr and work up to 13 gr (Lyman #4 max) in 1/2 gr increments. Test with 7 - 10 shot groups at 100 yards with the rifle. When you find the best load for the rifle then odds are it will also shoot well in the revolver.Quote:
Originally Posted by homesteading1
Larry Gibson
Thanks for the information, I am glad you told me about developing the rifle first. I will load up some tonight to test next weekend. The deer here are mostly in the 100-150 lb range or smaller and mostly will be taken from my deck at 35 to 50 yards.
I also plan on putting many hundreds of rounds into both guns this year and want to be ready for open season next fall.:razz:
Dave
I'd use the 2400 and get an accuracy load an go forth and practice an then wack a deer!
I would look at a hevier bullet as stated before...at least for next year
I think that you would be real happy with the performance of a 265gr Ranch Dog if you cast your own? ....I find the fit of this bullet in the Marlin to be awsome as well as the accuracy and hard hitting nock down power due to it's round flat nose!
I am not sure of the numbers but I know that the fine folks on here can tell you all kinds of molds that will drop the nessisary .431-.432 bullet needed for the Marlin barrel!
just a thought but I would want to work up loads with a bullet that will exceed my wants not fall short of them ..roght from the get go so I don't have to waste powder and primeres on loads that I know are going to be juts ok under the right blue moon conditions and have to sit there watching deer that would be good shots with a hevier round have to walk or be hesitent that my round might not get it done properly....just my.02!
Jonathan
240+ grains for the boolit and 296 for full tilt boogey.
I really like 12 grains of HS6 and a 265 H&G 503 swc for 1200 fps. It is accurate and very pleasant to shoot.
The deer here are mostly in the 100-150 lb range or smaller and mostly will be taken from my deck at 35 to 50 yards.
The 200 gr cast bullet will kill that size deer every bit as well as any heavier bullet.......unless of course the deer in your local have been PITA reengineered with body armor:bigsmyl2:
Larry Gibson
since when was 200 grains light?
It is light for a 44 caliber bullet.
Wile a 200 gr bullet will kill deer I do think a longer, heavier bullet will give better penetration, especially if he really wants to take a 100 yard shot. The heavier bullet will also retain velocity better and I find short, light bullets don't tend to shoot as well as the range increases.
I just prefer a bullet in the 250 to 300 gr range for a 44 mag for hunting. Just my preference.
No question the 200gr boolit can and will kill a deer with proper shot placement.
Personally I would want to have something a bit heavier, simply for the reason they are likely to shoot/group better. The 200 grain is really on the light for caliber range.
But the first thing I picked up on was that RNFP boolit design.
Wanting to have a boolit be as effective as possible in cleanly putting down a game animal, move towards a boolit more in line with the Wide Flat Nose designs.
That boolit shape is simply awesome in it's game taking ability, while a round nose flatpoint is going to lessen the wound channel and shock factor.
Check with the mold makers to see what nose profiles work well in your rifle.
I have used a 310gr LBT, long flat nose (LFN) in BlackHawks, and now in my RedHawk and used the same load in a Marlin .44 I wish I still had.
This boolit gets a touch over 1300fps from my 5.5" RedHawk, so it would have been something over that in the rifle.
This boolit nose is a bit long for the Marlin, so I needed to work the action slowly to feed them through the action.
I think that something in the 240 - 280gr range should be fine in your Taurus, but would question using heavy loads with heavier boolits.
My RedHawk takes a lick'in and keeps on tick'in, but no one has ever said they were under built.
Keep em coming!
Crusty Deary Ol'Coot
Have you fellows ever heard of the 44-40?
It's fine by me that you all like your heavy bullets. However you don't want to get stuck thinking heavy for caliber is the only way to skin a buck.
I've 240 and 255 grain 44 bullets myslef. However I've also 200 and 215 grain bullets. They all work.
I am well aware of the 44-40. And yes, a 200 gr projectile is adequate. I just PREFER a heavier bullet.
If I owned a 44-40 I would hunt deer with it. I would also be very likely to limit myself to 50 yards and broadside shots.
I also tend to take into consideration tha the OP may be new to hunting. He may not be looking at things like penetration potential as it relates to bullet weight. He may take a poor angle shot at 100 yards and the bullet may not be up to the task. As I don't know these things I prefer to err on the side of caution and assume the worst. Now if it was a person who I knew was an experienced hunter who understood the potential limitations I would have told him to just have fun and go to town.
Yup, it is a well known fact ever since Ross Seyfreid (SP?) shot that water buffalo in Australia some years back with the .45 Colt using a 300+ gr bullet that lighter weight bullets just won't "penetrate" through dear any more.............
That hard cast 200 gr RNFP at 13-1400 fps out of the rifle will give more than sufficient pentration on any deer with any reasonable shot within 100 yards. As GabbyM mentions, it has been doing that for 130+ years in the 44-40. The use of 300+ gr bullets out of the .44 Magnum and larger cartridges on little deers has not negated that fact.
Larry Gibson
Well, as you can see in my post, I didn't recommend the 300gr + boolits.
Do I feel that there are better boolits in the .44 then a 200grain? Without a doubt, YES!
However, as good hunters and sportsman, we should bring the best available ammo to the hunt that we can, and the "RNFP" is not the best.
Will it do? Yep with a good hit, on a good day, but if you have hunted any length of time, you have had a hit that was less then you wanted for some reason or other.
Therefore, I still say there are much better boolits the a RNFP for the taking of eating sized game.
Stack the odds in your favor of making a clean quick kill and the WFN boolits are well proven in their ability to do just that.
Keep em coming!
Crusty Deary Ol'Coot
My .44 mag hunting load (and range/target load) is a 310gr flatnose (Lee mold) water dropped wheel weight bullet over (I think, I would have to look it up to be sure) 20grs of 1680. I get around 1200 FPS out of my Redhawk.
But remember, Redhawks are one of the stronger pistols, I wouldn't suggest a load like this for a Taurus.
Does your Marlin have microgroove rifling? This might seriously affect what you can shoot. I have had success with these gas checked 310gr bullets out of a Marlin 336 but a lighter non-checked bullet might have problems.
I never said a heavy bullet was required. Never said it was fact.
I don't beleive that per penetration exists. I will take a standard to heavy weight bullet for caliber for hunting every time.
Will a 200 gr bullet work? Yes. Does it leave much margin for error? Nope.
btroj:
205 grain bullet is the standard weight bullet in a 44. 240 and 255 grain bullets are the heavies. Just because it's common to shoot heavy 240 grain bullets in a 44 magnum does not suddenly reclassify them as standard and the 205 grain as the light bullet.
See Photo below of a couple standard weight 44 bullets in 200 grain weight.
Lee and Saeco.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/pict...pictureid=1771
They are all up to the task if your marksmanship is. I like a 240 - 250ish gr boolit with some H110.
Deer are thin skinned animals-- the key is placement -- bad placement --even 240-300 gr will not work-- certainly there are what we all think are better bullets-- me too and i dont even shoot a .44 - but with good placement I can not see why it will not work -- sometimes we use what we have-- for the guys who do not like his boolit -- offer him some of your better boolits// I can not as I do not make .44s--
as with all of us be certain of yur placement- lets us know howit goes
I like the lee 310 gr in my 77/44 for deer i like the extra weight because we have brown bears where i live.
I would prefer a heavier boolit
but hey that is me
as long as you have the time
look into making an accurate load
your choices may very well move beyond what is currently
available to you
OK, guess we can all agree to disagree on bullet wt.
I have carried 310gr LBT/LFN in my BlackHawk/Redhawks for years, but if I had a mold casting a WFN profile boolit, I would gladly give something in the 240 - 280gr range a go.
As said, the 200 is light for caliber. However, those in the 240gr +/- range have been tried and proven for many years.
Hunting being what hunting is, if you spend enough time in the woods, you will have or see a shot go off the most desirable point of impact for whatever reason. It happens, this is hunting, not going to the meat market where everything is clean, served up on a nice white piece of some material and neatly wrapped in plastic wrap.
For that reason, if for no other, I would go with a boolit that will assure enough and more penetration, should it be needed. It happens.
But more important here, no matter what boolit weight you come down on, is boolit profile/shape.
Yes, we are presently talking deer, a thin skinned critter, but more importantly we are talking cast boolits which are in many/most cases, non-expanding.
Therefore, a round nose boolit would be an extremely poor choice and a RNFP or semi-wad cutter only marginally better. Remember, we are talking hunting situations here. My Clark Custom 77/22 will put down a deer "if everything" goes right, but few people consider the .22 to be a viable deer cartridge.
I have a friend who has shot deer with a .44mag in a rifle, with very poor results. Wasn't there, don't know what load/boolit he was using. It happens.
A very good read is Veral Smith's - LBT - work, "Jacketed Performance With Cast Bullets" which goes into bullet design and what has been proven to be relyable and effective in "hunting" situations.
You can get info on LBT on the net or go to Graybeard Outdoors Forum and post questions for Veral.
Most any cast .44 boolit of most any weight is going to poke a hole in a deer sized critter, but it is the hunters responsibility to make sure that boolit is the most effective design possible to insure a rapid kill. The Wide Flat Nose design is just such a boolit.
AS far as sending samples of our cast boolits, well I can do that, with a couple Semi-Wadcutters in the 240 - 250 gr range, but would wonder at the wisdom of sending any of the 310gr beyond a dummy test round simply because they would likely cause feeding problems in the rifle and would be overly stressful for the Taurus.
Would I recommend these semi-wadcutters for hunting, nope, but they are better then a RNFP.
All that is needed is for the "OP" to send me a PM with his snail mail info.
Keep em coming!
Crusty Deary Ol'Coot
Well, I guess I have to add my $0.02 worth partly to make a point if it hasn't been made and maybe to get an education too.
How is the .44 mag loaded with 200 gr. boolit less effective than a .44-40 loaded with a 200 gr. boolit/bullet? While I haven't done it, I have certainly read a lot of accounts on .44-40 being a very popular and effective deer cartridge to about 100 yards.
Not arguing that heavier boolits might give better penetration but shot placement and range would seem to the be issue here. Also, the OP is talking hard cast so too much expansion of soft/hollow point isn't an issue.
Just curious.
Longbow
Glenn,Quote:
Originally Posted by GLynn41
Excellent idea and wonderful advice. I have several boolit styles in 44 cal around 260 - 270 grains that I will be happy to offer up to the testing and trial efforts of the origional poster. OP can contact me by PM. I have no opinion regarding pros and cons of boolit weight and as long as reasonable judgment is used, why not use em. Still though, OP, if you want to try some, shoot me a message.
I have a Tracker framed 44 Mag also.
You can forget loading anything much heavier than a 240 gn bullet.
The cylinder on the tracker is too short for the heavy weight bullets.
For lead, Unique or 2400- either will do with what you're driving down the bore. The 2400 woud do better in a longer barrel. I would think that given the 30 -50 yd Range you pan to shoot at Unique would do the trick and you would use less. I'd be more concerned about over driving it and leading.
Btw, we load a full tilt, commercially available round using an XTP 240 gn bullet that chrono'd 1226 fps out of my Tracker Talo (with a 2 inch barrel.) I haven't chrono'd them out of my Puma 92 20 inch barrel. The load data stated 1500+fps with an 8 inch tube. I believe it based on my measurements with a snubby.
Had a customer named Rocky Gorby (somewhere in Central Maine) e-mail me to tell me he took a really nice Black Bear with our Appalachian Emancipator 240gn XTP-HP in 2010.
No Pics though. Sheez
Regards,
Jeff
Gabby,Quote:
Originally Posted by GabbyM
You were doing great on your point, and I agree with you. In fact, there were plenty of fellows out west who used the 44 Henry RF Flat to kill big game with, including, a bear, supposedly...
However, I have to disagree, or perhaps a better word would be "clarify," your point here.
The 205gr bullet was "Standard weight" for the 44-40 and the 44 Henry Flat. The 240-250gr boolits don't work worth a hoot in the 44-40 - I tried, and they hit WAY TOO high... Totally unusable...
In the 44 Spl. and 44 Magnum, the 246gr LRN and 240-250gr SWC (respectively) IS the standard weight, and a 200gr is generally considered "light."
Even still, I agree with you that the 200gr RNFP will kill a deer no problem.
Nobody here has said a 200 gr bullet won't kill a deer quite well. What many have said is that a heavier bullet gives more margin for error should a quartering shot be required.
I can bring 200 cinder blocks home in a VW bug but a 1 ton pickup does it easier.
Maybe they've got some humongous white tails in Appalacjia if a .44 cal 200 gr RNFN at 1200+ fps won't give all the penetration required, even on a "quartering" shot. To quote Mike Vemturino in a recent article on the 44-200-FN........."at 1150 - 1200 fps I got complete side to side penetration on every deer shot." Are the white tails that much bigger in Appalachia than in Montana? Having shot deer with 200, 215, 225, 240, 255, 270 and 300+ gr cast bullets I find the "margin of error" to be how much hillside or trees I want to shoot up on the other side of the deer. With in the OPs hunting criteria the 200 gr bullets will do just fine.
Larry Gibson
Larry I agree 100 %-- I started with what ever heavy bullet I had and learned what you said-- again nothing wrong with that --just what you prefer--- and they all work with good bullet placement- i still use the heavies becasue I can-- in a .41of course
I get it. Personally, I like the 429640 in solid or HP form (and in fact, [gasp] I load them with a medium- to light-load where they're only going 1100-1200fps, because we don't need 25,000grs of W296 crushed by the seating of the bullet to make the load an efficient killer either...).Quote:
Originally Posted by btroj
My quote above was actually quoting Gabby's response to you, and I just wanted to clarify that 200grs was "standard" weight for some 44-cal. cartridges, but that 240-250 was "standard weight" as well, but for other 44s... The "true" heavyweights are 265 or so and heavier.
[QUOTE=MakeMineA10mm;1516255]I get it. Personally, I like the 429640 in solid or HP form (and in fact, [gasp] I load them with a medium- to light-load where they're only going 1100-1200fps, because we don't need 25,000grs of W296 crushed by the seating of the bullet to make the load an efficient killer either...).
i use this boolit in my ruger B/H in hp form pushed by 19.5 gr of 2400
in my tender & Encore 12" barrels 24gr of H110 work good if i had a
200gr mold i would use that too
good luck