Pre-Ammomaster Ammomaster ?

Stripped down an incomplete RBCS Ammomaster progressive I bought today.

I figured even if I couldn't get it working, it would be cool just to have.

Interestingly, some parts are not the same as indicated in the manual I downloaded for the Ammomaster.

This one doesn't have a ball handle, it's a green plastic slip-on, the primer tube block is made from aluminium, not plastic, and not removeable. The roller on the primer slide is brass, not plastic. The shellplate carrier can only accomodate small primers, it's not possible to swap out the priming punch to large.

To convert this to large primers will need a new shellplate carrier with it's own primer punch and primer slide, so I'll just use it for small primers.

I found the only thing wrong with it is the snapped rim of the shellplate retaining bolt, which I had a spare of from my Pro 2000. All it's missing is the primer tube and two of the case retainers fitted around the shellplate. I have extra tubes, and I'll have some case retainers 3d printed.

Takes the same shellplates as the Pro 2000.

RCBS clearly made at least two iterations of the Ammomaster Progressive, anyone have an idea of the timelines ?

As far as I recall, it was popular to replace the handle on the Ammomaster with one from the older series of Rock Chucker (1 and 2) to reduce the stroke. So popular, RCBS ran out of them.

Below is an RCBS Ammomaster Auto conversion kit from the late 90's I think. I has a marking on one bag noting Piggyback II parts. It has the white plastic tube mount for the primer tubes.

Attachment 315197

I never could figure out why it came with a set of three new legs ... they are the same length as are found on the single stage version. I also think the toggle block is identical to the single stage version. Sure increased the shipping cost I'll bet.

I wish I could buy more die heads. I need to look at duplicating the one I have.

Here's a pic of what I got when I bought an ammo master-auto used:
Attachment 315208
As you can see, I didn't get any conversion kit for single stage operation.
The 1st thing I did was shorten the handle/arm.
It didn't index well and I tracked that down to a bent shell plate shoulder bolt.
I had a spare bolt from a piggyback and that fixed that.
I stripped of the powder measure and its clap-trap linkage and use a Lee powder thru the expander die and Lee Auto Disc.
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I've setup mine for .38 special.

I looked at various ways to improvise a primer tube housing, and decided it would be good as is.

Although the primer tube has no housing, there is no risk of detonating the stack because the primer seating punch is two inches away from the primer tube. Even if a primer blows under the case, it cannot affect the primers in the tube.

I've removed the indexing rod and moved the ejector wire out of the way, so I will rotate the shellplate and remove the loaded rounds manually.

I found that the 9mm shellplate rotates into alignment consistently with the index rod in place, but the 38 special shellplate drags a little preventing full rotation. I could probably figure out why it's doing that, but I really don't mind manually indexing.

Some of my 38 special brass have thicker rims [ to the point where some don't even fit on the shellplate ], and those are not easily kicked off the shellplate by the ejector wire, so I moved that out of the way and will remove the loaded rounds manually.

I fitted a Hornady LnL case activated powder measure to it.

I've seen the two models referred to once on a forum as the Ammomaster 1 and Ammomaster 2, I'm guessing I have the older model 1. I'll attach a picture shortly.

I have it set up next to my Pro 2000.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 414gates

I looked at various ways to improvise a primer tube housing, and decided it would be good as is.

Although the primer tube has no housing, there is no risk of detonating the stack because the primer seating punch is two inches away from the primer tube. Even if a primer blows under the case, it cannot affect the primers in the tube.

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I was thinking of trying to 3D print a replacement part for that white piece that holds the tube but modified to accept an outer tube. PLA+ filament seems pretty tough these days and might hold up for that use.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 414gates

I have it set up next to my Pro 2000.

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At least you can share shell plates between them. How are you feeling about APS strips? It seems like a good system but has fallen out of favor. I think the new vibrating tube loaders have made the tubes more tolerable. I was never a huge fan of "pecking" up primers. Are there any mods to convert a Pro 2000 to tube feed?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kenstone

As you can see, I didn't get any conversion kit for single stage operation.

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And yet, here I sit jealously eyeing your spare 5-station top plate. Knowing that I have a spare set of legs / risers and I could have it setup and standing aside in another caliber.

[QUOTE=Rimfire McNutjob;5590508 Are there any mods to convert a Pro 2000 to tube feed?[/QUOTE]

The primer tube upgrade was shipped by RCBS as an upgrade kit.

Mine has the tube feed. I bought mine used, it came with the tube feed fitted, and the APS parts in a box. There are a lot of APS parts, it's a major upgrade.

The tube feed works very well. Changing between large and small primers is a two minute job.

FYI
Here's a recently active thread on the ammo master:
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...-group.919696/
I'm Tilos over there,
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Edit: I put a binder clip on the case detector/powder measure linkage after removing the actuating rod.
The wire wrapped around the primer tube block can also be seen in this pic:
Attachment 315217
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This is how the Pro 2000 looks with the primer tube system fitted.

Attachment 315218

The original plastic retainer around the shellplate had broken in pieces, so I traced the outline on a PVC end-cap and cut a new one.

This is showing the Ammomaster brass roller and aluminium primer tube block, the version 2 has them in plastic.

Attachment 315219

I jerry-rigged the missing case retaining clips from dowel sticks and hard black plastic.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 414gates

This is how the Pro 2000 looks with the primer tube system fitted.

Attachment 315218

The original plastic retainer around the shellplate had broken in pieces, so I traced the outline on a PVC end-cap and cut a new one.

This is showing the Ammomaster brass roller and aluminium primer tube block, the version 2 has them in plastic.

Attachment 315219

I jerry-rigged the missing case retaining clips from dowel sticks and hard black plastic.

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Thanks for posting the pics!
:drinks:
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The Ammomaster had 5 stations before it was fashionable. :)

There should be an AmmomasterAuto sub-section on one of these boards where we can all commiserate and share hacks.

Run mine auto index or manual like a 550. Convert to single stage and load anything from 25acp to 50 bmg. First order of buisness is remove the factory powder measure system and use the case activated conversion. Second is to get 8-32 Allen headed capscrews for the index rod. Remove the center plastic anti return bushing and lube the needle bearings of the one way clutch. Make sure all moving parts are not frozen or sticky. Adjust the primer slide and activation rod standoff. Adjust the primer seat stop opposite the primer slide. Clean, deburr, polish and lube accordingly. You can mod the case kicker, primer tube and case linkage actuator on the shellplate carrier once everything else is working to your satisfaction. Great press in my opinion.

Just an FYI, RCBS will provide everything to bring the press back to work ready condition. All that is required are part numbers and a phone call. You can download the parts breakdown from the website. They stand behind their products without reservation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by troyboy

First order of business is remove the factory powder measure system and use the case activated conversion.

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Amen to that. That rod flopping around in that slot on the "case detector" was pretty Rube Goldberg-ish.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by troyboy

Second is to get 8-32 Allen headed capscrews for the index rod.

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No love for the thumb screws. :(

Quote:

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Originally Posted by troyboy

Remove the center plastic anti return bushing and lube the needle bearings of the one way clutch.

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What are you using here? Some super light machine oil with a needle style applicator?

Yes, removed the plastic piece( that snap ring takes some patience) and lubed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by troyboy

Yes, removed the plastic piece( that snap ring takes some patience) and lubed.

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Could it also be done from the bottom I wonder? That retaining ring on the bottom seems more accessible to me. The one holding the nylon bushing looks like an hours work with a fine pick or something crazy like that. I dread getting that thing out without damaging the nylon bushing.

I just got off the phone with RCBS and they are sending me a spare shoulder bolt and a slow twist index rod for my Ammomaster. Apparently, they came out with the rod many years ago to reduce the "snap" of the shell plate that tends to toss powder out of mostly full pistol cases. I'm hoping it makes the nylon bushing last longer as well.

I also got a case retainer spring assembly for station 5 (the shorter one) and will try replacing that case detector arm that does that function now and also pushed the powder rod up. Like most, I've moved to case activated powder throws and so that big steel flapper is only there to hold the case in as it swings by. I'm hoping to change it out for the normal flat spring style.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rimfire McNutjob

I just got off the phone with RCBS and they are sending me a spare shoulder bolt and a slow twist index rod for my Ammomaster. Apparently, they came out with the rod many years ago to reduce the "snap" of the shell plate that tends to toss powder out of mostly full pistol cases. I'm hoping it makes the nylon bushing last longer as well.

I also got a case retainer spring assembly for station 5 (the shorter one) and will try replacing that case detector arm that does that function now and also pushed the powder rod up. Like most, I've moved to case activated powder throws and so that big steel flapper is only there to hold the case in as it swings by. I'm hoping to change it out for the normal flat spring style.

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My quick fix for that big steel flapper was to put a binder clip on it to hold it in place.
That turned out to be my permanent fix...
That way I can swing it out to remove a wonky primed case.
(read my sig. line)
Attachment 315691
:mrgreen:
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Edit: sorry for the repost/echo here...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kenstone

My quick fix for that big steel flapper was to put a binder clip on it to hold it in place.
That turned out to be my permanent fix...
That way I can swing it out to remove a wonky primed case.

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Oh, now I get it. I couldn't figure out exactly what it was doing. Great idea. I was focused on your wire retainer for the primer tube mount.

BTW, what tool did you use to put the chamfer on your primer hole in the metal primer slide? Did you have a particular chamfering bit for a Dremel or did you just use a small grinding bit and work in the chamfer manually?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rimfire McNutjob

Oh, now I get it. I couldn't figure out exactly what it was doing. Great idea. I was focused on your wire retainer for the primer tube mount.

BTW, what tool did you use to put the chamfer on your primer hole in the metal primer slide? Did you have a particular chamfering bit for a Dremel or did you just use a small grinding bit and work in the chamfer manually?

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Good question.
I'm thinking that slide is soft steel or aluminum (?) and I would have just used my case chamfering tool:
Attachment 315692
If that is not small enough you can use a drill that's bigger than the primer hole, just hand twist/turn it, no power drill needed.
If the slide proves to be hardened, (I don't recall) a stone or Dremel abrasive bit will be needed to slightly chamfer the primer hole.
:smile:
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Yeah, it was rock hard. I hit it with an alumina stone in the Dremel. I did both the top and bottom. My press binds occasionally because the primer seater catches the bottom edge of the primer hole on its way in. I'm hoping that's solved now as well. I took off very little. Just enough that I could see fresh metal and the slight chamfer.

Great machines!!
I have several Ammomaster units. And a few Piggyback units. I also have a NIB piggyback unit i picked up several years ago. PM me if anyone looking for one.