The Book of Life...When is your name entered or Blotted out?

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Originally Posted by Alabama358

Mr. Rizzo...
I remember you. You are the guy with... shall we say very California type ideas

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Kind of like you in a way with your own "personal doctrine"?

California ideas?
I have my own individual beliefs on Spiritual matters but doubt that other Californians all believe what you listed. Lots of good God loving people around where I live.

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You believe in Jesus but not his teachings

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No, you are wrong and misstating what I have said previosly.
I do believe in Jesus and His teachings.
There are some Bible passages I do not agree with and feel there is a translation or misunderstanding issue with them.

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You believe in reincarnation and not eternal salvation with the LORD

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Yes, I do believe in reincarnation and the ultimate goal of being back with God for eternity.

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You think the bible is full of errors and contradictions etc.

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I have pointed out areas in the Bible that I do not agree with.
To say that I think it is "full of errors and contradictions" is an exaggerated false statement from you.

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If I thought you had an ear to hear I would try to help... but I think you are just a sower of strife.

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Oh, I am listening. I enjoy this Forum and all of the different views that the Posters have. Some give "food for thought".

Here is some advice:
If you are going to start a Thread topic, expect some replies that may have a different point of view than yours. Also expect to have some challenges to what you are saying and address them in your reply.

You seem to have thin skin and rather than replying by answering the questions or addressing the comments, you mock the opposing poster's views and beliefs.

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Here is a little Old Testament and New Testament wisdom for you to ponder...

Matthew 7:6
Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Proverbs 23:9
Speak not in the ears of a fool: for he will despise the wisdom of thy words.

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Nice.
Using God's word to say what you won't.
Again, more insults from you.
You may be able to "talk the talk" with your Bible references, but it doesn't look like you are "walking the walk" to me.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch.....
How about getting back on topic and address my sincere questions and comments in my previous reply?

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Originally Posted by Rizzo

Kind of like you in a way with your own "personal doctrine"?
Yes, my personal (Bible based not self created) doctrine that my family and I follow and believe ... not to be confused with a made up hybrid doctrine such as you describe in an earlier post that you adhere to.

California ideas?
I have my own individual beliefs on Spiritual matters but doubt that other Californians all believe what you listed. Lots of good God loving people around where I live. I understand that some California Schools are putting litter boxes in the class room for the kids that identify as cats or furbies or some kind of foolishness... lol I know there are good folks that live there. I was stationed down at Camp Pendleton for a few years.



No, you are wrong and misstating what I have said previosly.
I do believe in Jesus and His teachings. It is laughable to say that you believe in Jesus and his teachings in the same breath you say you do not believe in Salvation through faith and the remission of sins and then toss in a side order of reincarnation to complete your apostasy.

There are some Bible passages I do not agree with and feel there is a translation or misunderstanding issue with them. If you don't agree with scripture or it hurts your feelings doesn't mean they are wrong or a bad translation.


Yes, I do believe in reincarnation and the ultimate goal of being back with God for eternity. Good luck with that! You get one chance... One and Done! Your choice


I have pointed out areas in the Bible that I do not agree with.
To say that I think it is "full of errors and contradictions" is an exaggerated false statement from you. ok, my bad... Just the most Fundamental essential cornerstone of the Bible you find fault with.


Oh, I am listening. I enjoy this Forum and all of the different views that the Posters have. Some give "food for thought". There is some hope... God Willing!

Here is some advice:
If you are going to start a Thread topic, expect some replies that may have a different point of view than yours. Also expect to have some challenges to what you are saying and address them in your reply. My advice to your advice is... don't give advice while acting like a Nitwit.

You seem to have thin skin and rather than replying by answering the questions or addressing the comments, you mock the opposing poster's views and beliefs. I am not sure how you can speak for other posters... but definitely I was mocking that garbage that you were spewing... not because of the thickness my skin but because that sort of foolishness needs a stern rebuke.


Nice.
Using God's word to say what you won't. Using GODs word, isn't that what we are suppose to do??? If I were to use my own words I probably get banned
Again, more insults from you.
You may be able to "talk the talk" with your Bible references, but it doesn't look like you are "walking the walk" to me. What would me walking the walk look like to you? Do you need a hug and me to tell you... Rizzo its ok, go ahead and keep on in your hybrid christian walk, it will all work out.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch.....
How about getting back on topic and address my sincere questions and comments in my previous reply?

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I actually think that you are still licking your wounds from that strong rebuke that I gave you in a previous post

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Originally Posted by Rizzo

I have no idea when things get written in the "book".
I did some searching on that phrase and I came up with several Bible passages that stated "Before the foundation of the world. (See Eph 1:4-5, 1 Peter 1:20, Revelation 13:8)
More translation issues it seems, which just adds confusion. "From", Before, "Since" have their own different meanings when used.

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If doing a google search is representative of your study on this subject... it is no wonder you are confused

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Originally Posted by Rizzo

Well, "every human spirit" already includes the child in it's mother's womb.

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Well actually the mother's womb was not the beginning and with a little study you will see that GOD knew you before you were formed in your mother's belly.
Jeremiah 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

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Originally Posted by Rizzo

I am confused on that statement about Salvation not being secured if you are "saved".
If you are "saved" you receive the gift of Salvation and get an express trip to heaven, don't you?

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I think it went over your head... You are not "Written in" because of good works or your goodness
You were written in at Creation and if you accept Christ's work at the cross you will never be blotted out

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Originally Posted by Rizzo

Hmmm...so if your name is blotted out of the book, you do not go to heaven but end up in "The Lake of Fire".
However, all of our sins have and will be forgiven....if "saved". (Paraphrasing what the Bible says.)

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Actually that is the point, if you are born again and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and not in your own "good" works you would never be blotted out. Reject Christ's free gift of Salvation and your blotted out and destine for the Lake of Fire.

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Originally Posted by Rizzo

Somewhat of a contradiction there with that passage.
More confusion. <sigh>

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more confusion... You are making this harder then it is

If you're confused about something in the word then keep after it.
That's why it's there for you, to study and understand.

I am a believer. I am Baptized.
I don't currently and have not practiced any established "weekly meeting" religion for a very long time.
I simply live a reasonably clean life with more good deeds and selfless acts than self serving , and I base it mostly in the teachings of the Old Testament.
I certainly follow the high steps of do unto others and teach a man to fish .

I do not and cannot push myself to push what I believe on others .

I don't know if I'm in a book of life . I don't know if I've lived other lives . I suspect I have about 498 Saturdays left maybe 998 if I'm lucky . If I'm doomed to spend the rest existence in some horrible torture so be it , if it is peace and tranquility I'm penned in for , then that's what it is .

I don't believe that receiving the word and proclamation of faith is a certain ticket to paradise if you're not living by the word , your promise , and proclamation Tuesday through Thursday. But again I'm not the judge and it's not for me to pass judgement on a man's actions , words or life . Forgiveness isn't mine to give for ones sins it's only mine to give for those wrongs against me . My forgiveness of other has no value in the afterlife for them . I haven't yet decided yet if it holds a value in my judgment. What if it's ill given ?

What if John , Paul , Luke , etc misunderstood Christ's word ?
What if Moses got some bad rye and was on an LSD trip up the mountain?
What if Abraham was deceived ? Was the deception the command to sacrifice his son or was it to spare him ? Why would a fair and just God test a man so .......was it perhaps story just to demonstrate how hard choices and decisions in life will be and how some choices no matter how much the right thing to do are impossible for a man to carry through.

I don't question my faith nor that of any other . I don't question the teachings, perhaps the lessons as they are generally accepted.

If I don't make the book , I've lived a good life , I've been loved by dogs and kids and will be well thought of when I pass . A man cannot ask for more than that in this life .

I attended a sermon once the jist of which was that living a good and humble life wasn't enough without acceptance and accepting without living the good and humble life wasn't enough either . The pastor was on his 2nd repo'd car and wore an $800 watch ....... Perhaps it's the teacher not the teachings or lessons.

I quote Jesus: "Judge not..."
because I will not judge a man for his relationship with God.
That's God's job.
My job is to spread the Good Word, to find the last person saved.
And other duties as directed, I have every Monday off.

Would I judge a devout Shinto for worshiping his garden?
No. The better word is discern, to judge right from wrong, good from evil.
Is the Shinto causing me harm, beating his drums?
Only if I lived next door.

Do I judge LBJ for removing prayer from school?
Yes, because it directly affected me and mine and yours.
Yes, because that was a call to action that Christians ignored.
Do I judge grown children for abandoning their parents in a care home?
No, because I am not omnipotent, these old folks cannot live alone
>or with anybody else<.
These old people, I'm 70, need visiting, need touch, need takeout from Arbys
and are very glad to hear the Word (though some aren't).
They remember hymns without a hymnal, but don't know where they are.


We all have our own relationship with God, and I am glad to hear about yours.
(Oh, and don't sneer at Google, it speaks Koine.
Google "Do you know Jesus?" you will make the AI grunt for a thousand milliseconds
and get billions of hits. It's got pictures, videos, and where to find Him...)

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

I quote Jesus: "Judge not..."
because I will not judge a man for his relationship with God.
That's God's job.
My job is to spread the Good Word, to find the last person saved.
And other duties as directed, I have every Monday off.

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Well that is the point that I apparently failed to make... It is GODs job, as you say to judge whether a person is saved or damned.
That being said....there is a huge difference in judging bad and or wicked behavior (according to God's Word and not doctrines of men) and judging someones soul.

Also, I think it is best to understand who the audience is and the context of the message being preached.
Christ was preaching to mainly a large group of Jews that had been raised under the Mosaic Law. Salvation by grace through faith was a whole new concept and eventually some would try to use a mix of Mosaic Law and Salvation by Faith ... I think Christ was saying in Matthew 7 that you cant have it both ways. If you Judge and punish someone under the Mosaic Law then that is how you will be dealt with because you are not under Faith.

Similar to what Paul says in
Galatians 5:3-4
3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

Would I judge a devout Shinto for worshiping his garden?
No. The better word is discern, to judge right from wrong, good from evil.
Is the Shinto causing me harm, beating his drums?
Only if I lived next door.

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I wasn't really sure what Shinto was and that a person could be devout ...so I googled it

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

Do I judge LBJ for removing prayer from school?
Yes, because it directly affected me and mine and yours.
Yes, because that was a call to action that Christians ignored.
Do I judge grown children for abandoning their parents in a care home?
No, because I am not omnipotent, these old folks cannot live alone
>or with anybody else<.
These old people, I'm 70, need visiting, need touch, need takeout from Arbys
and are very glad to hear the Word (though some aren't).
They remember hymns without a hymnal, but don't know where they are.

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Congrats on making it to the 70 mark and God Bless you and yours.

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

We all have our own relationship with God, and I am glad to hear about yours.
(Oh, and don't sneer at Google, it speaks Koine.
Google "Do you know Jesus?" you will make the AI grunt for a thousand milliseconds
and get billions of hits. It's got pictures, videos, and where to find Him...)

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I wasn't sneering at Goggle... Heck I use it just about every day (I had to to figure out what in tarnation Shinto was) I was merely suggesting that when trying to sort out some of the more complex parts of the Bible....The Bible is your best source of information.

I had comp.rel.lit. at UMass
professor called us Jewish folk tales
and was a Taoist educated fool.
"The Art of War" is still worth reading.

Shinto caused the attack on Pearl Harbor
like Jesus caused the Crusades.
People taking God and using Him to start a war.

Zen gets blamed for Japan's aggression, too,
but it's Shinto that is rabidly xenophobic.
Shinto is the veneration of kami, little gods in everything,
instead of a Big God is everything.
I am blessed to have learned the difference!

I learned what kendo I know from a Shinto, way before I was Saved
I come from a place where guns are forbidden, so you need a stick.
A one meter white oak sword with a crutch tip on it, call it a cane.
According to Shinto, your stick will have a kami, a demon, living in it.
You can rule him, or he will rule you.

Turns out, church security is a gang of old ladies with canes
trained up about how to use a cane as a group as a weapon.
Spread out, attack the threat to your grandkids, oh my Lord!
Horrible to watch them training, running a bayonet drill with the crutch tips off.
You might shoot one or two, but the rest will make you wish you were dead.

Shinto has no heaven, just void, your mother-in-law's kami can haunt you.
I won't say they're wrong, but that they need salvation (and exorcism).
Are the Shia Sunni Hindus Buddhists...Wiccans Shintos Zoroastrians Democrats in the Book of Life?
I would think not, because we are told to save them.
There is a Great Work to do yet.

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

I had comp.rel.lit. at UMass
professor called us Jewish folk tales
and was a Taoist educated fool.
"The Art of War" is still worth reading.

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The Art of War by Sun Tzu or The Book of Five Rings by Miyamoto Musashi are both fine books to hone timing and strategy skill sets... be it playing chess, training new managers coming out of college or getting the upper hand on negotiations with a highly intelligent 7 year old young man.

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

I learned what kendo I know from a Shinto, way before I was Saved
I come from a place where guns are forbidden, so you need a stick.
A one meter white oak sword with a crutch tip on it, call it a cane.
According to Shinto, your stick will have a kami, a demon, living in it.
You can rule him, or he will rule you.

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I studied Shotokan under the late great Hidetaka Nishiyama. I am sure he was a Buddhist of some sort but never really pushed that ideology... He was more about teaching muscle mechanics, timing, technique built by repetition and discipline and not so much about demons living in sticks and such.

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

Shinto has no heaven, just void, your mother-in-law's kami can haunt you.
I won't say they're wrong, but that they need salvation (and exorcism).
Are the Shia Sunni Hindus Buddhists...Wiccans Shintos Zoroastrians Democrats in the Book of Life?
I would think not, because we are told to save them.
There is a Great Work to do yet.

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I have in-laws that I love dearly that are Buddhists, BUT I still hope and pray to get them saved... that being said, I fear that if they were to pass today, they would be blotted out.

"Learn the ways of all trades"
"Book of Five Rings" last chapter is "Void".
KJV Genesis begins with void, Musashi believed he ended in void.

The only bout that Musashi lost was against Gonnosuke.
Gonnosuke had a stick.

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

Are the Shia Sunni Hindus Buddhists...Wiccans Shintos Zoroastrians Democrats in the Book of Life?
I would think not, because we are told to save them.

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So... if not, when do you recon they get written in?
That is to say, what is your understanding or opinion of if they are born again when are they written in?

Or how many get written in or blotted out from here on.
The new Atlantis that so many of out nation's forefathers wanted, the new dawn of the black sun, it's been a long road but we've come to the first year of the new age or as recently said at the Trilateral Commission of "the new world order". I'm thinking it gets bumpy from here but Christians are can-do people and with our Father's help we can handle it.

An Infinite God would have an Infinite Book.
We limited dim beings cannot cope with infinity.
$20,000,000,000 to build a telescope!
We can't even divide by zero.
So Jesus helps us out with the Book.
Written in or written out or written at all
would you think God would ever forget?
Forgiveness is yours for the choice of
repenting renewing and redeeming.
Asking of the Holy Spirit, the Paraclete, to be whole.
Do we backslide, fail, learn slowly?
Sure and He Loves us anyway.
Whom He Loves a lot, He chastens a lot...
but never leave us or forsake us.

We had five new faces at prayers Wednesday night!
The internet is an advertising fad, go to church
a real Bible-studying evangelizing fellowship.
Government school had it's turn, and failed.
Churches used to run schools, some still do, now it's our turn.
"Our" means all of us, our majority. Everybody.

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

An Infinite God would have an Infinite Book.
We limited dim beings cannot cope with infinity.
$20,000,000,000 to build a telescope!
We can't even divide by zero.
So Jesus helps us out with the Book.
Written in or written out or written at all
would you think God would ever forget?
Forgiveness is yours for the choice of
repenting renewing and redeeming.
Asking of the Holy Spirit, the Paraclete, to be whole.
Do we backslide, fail, learn slowly?
Sure and He Loves us anyway.
Whom He Loves a lot, He chastens a lot...
but never leave us or forsake us.

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My original post was a simple question geared towards answering a question and/or building a foundation to illustrate just how simple eternal Salvation is.
GOD keeps a set of books... He tells us this in multiple scriptures! The beauty of it is that everyone is written in and already has a spot in heaven...and all you have to do is simply believe on Christ and his work at the cross.
Full Stop nothing else required... and you can never be blotted out!

A simple foundational truth to build on for a young potential believer (not so much a "To know, is to know that you know nothing. This is the meaning of true knowledge" Socrates moment)
If you lose them in the weeds they may never find their way to the Garden

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Originally Posted by .429&H110

We had five new faces at prayers Wednesday night!
The internet is an advertising fad, go to church
a real Bible-studying evangelizing fellowship.
Government school had it's turn, and failed.
Churches used to run schools, some still do, now it's our turn.
"Our" means all of us, our majority. Everybody.

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The internet is one of the tools in our tool bag. Consider this thread for example it has already had over 600 pair of curious eyes in just a few weeks... That is a potential 600 folks that the "Salvation Light" comes on... Maybe in a few months there will be a potential of 2,000... and so on
That is not to say one should forsake the congregation.
I totally agree that the public school system is the devils play ground.
When parents let the school system raise their children they are setting them selves up for heart break

This is an interesting discussion. I know that I am saved and have eternal life. Attend church regularly and study the KJV of the Bible.
I have pondered the question of "books". If there are literal books in heaven, where did they come from? That would mean that there would need to be a paper mill,a book binder, and a lot of ink pens or pencils in heaven to " keep the books"
Does an all knowing God need a book for reference or to refresh his memory?
Would you believe a new Bible translation that said your status of salvation is recorded on a hard drive and your name can be deleted.
I say God will be the ultimate authority on judgement day and his authority will rein without a hard copy or a literal book.

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Originally Posted by wv109323

This is an interesting discussion. I know that I am saved and have eternal life. Attend church regularly and study the KJV of the Bible.
I have pondered the question of "books". If there are literal books in heaven, where did they come from? That would mean that there would need to be a paper mill,a book binder, and a lot of ink pens or pencils in heaven to " keep the books"
Does an all knowing God need a book for reference or to refresh his memory?
Would you believe a new Bible translation that said your status of salvation is recorded on a hard drive and your name can be deleted.
I say God will be the ultimate authority on judgement day and his authority will rein without a hard copy or a literal book.

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WV...
The way I look at it is, if GOD says it is so.... It is so!
If he says their is a book of life that will be opened, I know that there will be, not because he needs it to refresh his memory... but because HE said so.
If he says we are going to be given white robes... take it to the bank you will have a white robe. Why, because we need one? No because he said so.
You could make just about everything spiritual... If you try hard enough

Revelation 22:1-2
1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

Will there be a river? Trees on either side? Bares twelve manner of fruits?

Yup, yup and yup!

Biblos

A recording, or written record.

It's a praise to convey a thought. We still say, "cooking the books" even though Pen and paper are seldom used today for record keeping.

Take heed we aren't removed from God's memory is how I'd take it.

Is God running out of erasures? blotted in, blotted out, blotted in, blotted out?

How many times does Jesus have to die on the cross for your sins?

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Originally Posted by BoBSavage

Is God running out of erasures? blotted in, blotted out, blotted in, blotted out?

How many times does Jesus have to die on the cross for your sins?

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Now we are getting to the point of the original post...

Written in once at creation (you except Christ's work at the cross... in for eternity)
Blotted out once...one and done (you reject Christ's work at the cross... damnation for eternity)

There is no in-out, in-out business

The idea that there is no Books as so stated in multiple scriptures... that it is all just a metaphor or an allegory, is sort of a unique idea.
Do you carry that theory forward and say there is no Great white throne or the Judgment seat of Christ?
Where does it start and stop?

Metaphor allegory and what did He really say?
What did He say to Pilate?
There were witnesses and they wrote it down.

There is a fine boundless infinite Study but we only have limited time.
Then we can see for ourselves.

Start with Genesis. Light from Dark, Earth from Heaven(s?), Sea from Land.
Woman from Man. God separates, divides things, Says It's Good.

As He goes along He says "This is not good."
What? He made something not good? What?
"That Man should be alone"
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Jesus refers to the Flood and the days of Noe, because He was there.
He said there was a flood, so there was a flood.
He says there is a Book, somehow there must be a Book.
We know this because the Tomb was empty.
So we keep the Faith and our powder dry.

But
My Savior does not sit on a golden throne in the clouds throwing thunderbolts. I looked.
But
When God drowned the Nephilim, were their lost demonic souls left stuck in this fallen world?
Now there's a soul that didn't make it into the Book or the poor soul it possesses.