So I'm a squid...
Not sure how to respond to being slammed on the internet.
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So I'm a squid...
Not sure how to respond to being slammed on the internet.
taco,
LOL:lol:. Just the opposite, You would have to have been in the Navy, Navy=squid.
Mark
taco,
I promise I will make some progress this weekend. I want to try and go to the range (45min - hour, each way) for a quick test of the .25ACP rifle to see if some of my hand loads will shoot and cycle. With that behind me, I can get some work done on the lathe. I can guarantee that this project will be one of the easier/quicker endeavors to get done. This one requires very little engineering beyond my design approach to the barrel, the rest is just a matter of performing the machine operations.
Keep safe, my Dad was a cop and retired 22 years ago, but the world of law enforcement has changed and I don't think he misses it one bit. You have my respect for doing it, because I don't have the personality for it.
Mark
Just read your range report on the 25 auto rifle project (which I've been following as well) and am pleased to see it make some progress. I will wait for more to come on this 327 project.
I've only been policing a couple years. Its a second career for me & when I told my friends what I was doing several said they could see me as a cop so I guess I have the "personality" for it... whatever that is LOL!
taco,
Here you go. I got the boring of the "sleeve" completed and profiled the blank. The only big task will be threading the barrel and then a simple job to crown the muzzle and after it is fit to the gun (which is still in it's 10 day holding pattern) cut the forcing cone. All of the photos include an unmodified example.
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps50ef8b2f.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps8a1f5b7f.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps2fdc55c4.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps0c8681ed.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps481d3bfe.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps50ef8b2f.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps86c25048.jpg
I have no idea when I will cut the threads, but I will keep you posted.
Mark
P.S. I regards to Law enforcement, I should probably say temperament, I would try to keep the peace, but if someone got under my skin, I would prefer to "educate" them. Worked great in the Navy, not so good in the civilian world.
Please correct me if I'm wrong in my understanding of how you're going to do the barrel.
The bored-out factory barrel (now simply a sleeve) will be held in place via friction with the barrel body as well as the shoulder you left on the muzzle end of the barrel "liner". Also, when the barrel/cylinder gap is where you want it, you'll crown the muzzle to match the sleeve? Kinda like a Dan Wesson is what I'm picturing (except the barrel nut is part of the barrel).
Crank,
I've been following your description of this and kinda scratching my head... now I think I understand. If I'm interpreting your pictures correctly, you are making a barrel the same OD as the major threads of the tenon where it goes through the frame. Then you are reaming the "original" barrel to fit over that like the Dan Wesson used and that will be attached to it. This will eliminate the thinned out section of liner and/or threaded area of the original barrel that keeps smiths from wanting to use a "normal" sleeved barrel in a 327 FM. How about attachment to the outer portion... will it be soldered, glued or what? If you've got this last question covered, I'd say you have a winner there. I too will be eagerly waiting the next installment on your progress, since buying a Model 617 barrel and having it reamed and re-rifled was the most expensive and time consuming portion of my project.
Regards,
Froggie
PS I don't know how this would fit into your plans, but I believe that Brownell's sells a die to fit the threads of a S&W barrel.
PPS Just reread original post... I'm a slow study! I'm not sure how that attachment will hold together as you do the final torque of the barrel into the frame. Why not turn the whole barrel to the same diameter, do all the fitting of (inner) barrel to frame (with proper headspace) then affix the "shroud" to the outside without having any rotational force applied? I'm thinking a locating pin or set screw or something if the standard soft solder, epoxy, etc methods don't work.
Are you using the barrel blanks from Gun Parts Corp? Your picture looks just like the one on their website. I have been eyeing them myself but was a little leery because of the price, $14.00. What is the quality of the bore? Been thinking of getting some for a project similar to yours.
I get it. You're the guy that works on diesel-electric locomotives all day, then spends his evenings building an HO railroad in the basement . . .
Okay I had started my reply, but my "token" expired and I lost everything I had typed.
taco,
You are pretty much on track. The difference is that after I cut the threads, I will use heat and dry ice to allow the parts to slip together. I will also use an evil product known as sleeve retainer to make sure the parts never separate. At that point, I can trim the muzzle end and crown it. After the cylinder is fitted, I can set the bbl./cyl. gap and cut a forcing cone. It will be an extreme example of friction, since the parts will be an interference fit.
Froggie,
You have it correct and that is why my approach can't really be called a liner. Thanks for the note about the die from Brownell's, not sure I will use it, but it is an option. See above why the barrel won't spin in the shroud.
Stoncrusher,
Yes, those are the blanks from GPC. Bores look good and I also bought a blank from Green Mountain in case I wasn't happy with the quality, but the difference was minimal and for a 4" fixed sight gun I think it will be up to the task. If I build another with a longer barrel, I will use the GM blank (20").
JHeath,
Your powers of observation are beyond reproach. However, it was the other way around, I have been tinkering since I was a teen, went to gun-smithing school in my early 20's to "learn" something and did it for years to supplement my income and then was blessed with a golden opportunity to move up to cannons in my 40's. The man upstairs has a delightful sense of humor.
Mark
Okay, now I figured out what was bugging me about this project- the S&W Model 64 is a fixed sight gun. Wouldn't it be better to use an adjustable sight version as the donor gun?
I like fixed sight K frames, (probably better than adjustable ones) but in this case I really think the adjustable rear sight would be better.
Robert
Robert,
I am saving that for the next gun. My favorite wheel gun is my S&W Mod 58 in .41, that's includes my Python. I like fixed sight revolvers. I am one of those people that finds a load and I tend to stick with it, so once I find the right one I will regulate the sights for that . For any other load, I will learn the hold for it. The next gun is going to be an 8" Dan Wesson, but that one will stay in a holding pattern until I finish this one. So have no fear, I will have a fixed sight workhorse and an adjustable sight target gun.
Mark
Making them underlugs for the front lock on S&W barrels can be a daunting problem when making an S&W barrel from scratch. I applaud your great, super, and very good solution to this problem.
I cheated and put a S&W model 16 barrel and cylinder on a model 10, reamed the chamber just a tad (chambers were quite over long on the .32 H&R mag. cylinder) to accept .327 ctgs.. Putting an adjustable sight on it was the fun part. That and fitting the factory new (with lotsa extra metal on the ratchit) cylinder.
Mark,
I certainly understand the one gun, one load concept. I bought my first Vaquero with that in mind, I just need to settle on a load.
Robert
Crank, where were you when I was setting up Project 616? I needed to know about that 648 cylinder to save Andy a ton of work! I just went on and ordered one to have on hand "just in case" since the 617 cylinders I have found all have that screwy extractor that had to be reshaped (by Andy, at extra cost) to make it work with the 327 FM. I never even thought of the 648 before, but I've got it now. Still want to hear reports on your progress!
Froggie
Froggie,
Hopefully I have not led you astray for an inappropriate part. I just took some photos of the donor.
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps4ecb5c9f.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...psf2900481.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...ps2537ba87.jpg
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/l...psc609efad.jpg
I think I know what you meant by the square cut and this ain't it. The reason for picking it was cost, $64.00 vs. $295.00. I never gave a thought to the extractor shape, so it looks like I dodged a bullet (or maybe an extractor?):bigsmyl2:
Mark
Crank, when S&W made the -1 update to their rim fires, they changed the shape of the extractor head. If you look at the extractor head in isolation as per your third picture, the shape of the "blank" would have been a rectangle, with two of the notches for the extractor cuts coming out of the narrow ends and then two on each of the longer sides. This keeps the extractor in its recess nicely, even without the old locating pins we see in earlier extractors, but makes cutting the larger 327 rim size a nightmare. Andy had to build up my extractor then recut everything. :groaner: It's working about right now, but I wanted some insurance as well... I'm planning on keeping this gun for a long time. :grin:
Froggie
This is going to be AWSOME!!!
Okay, if my enthusiasm is adequate I will try to get some threads cut tonight so I can put the barrel together. I will be able to rescue the gun from my dealer tomorrow, so if I have the lions share of the barrel work done, that is one less thing to distract me. I will make sure to take pictures as I go.
Mark