Lee 310 or RD 265?

I've been doing a lot of practice this year with my .44 mag in preparation for the upcoming season. The areas that I mainly hunt provide shots that are mostly within archery distance, so I have made it a goal to strictly use my .44 mag to hunt during modern gun season this year.

My 3 most accurate loads are 20.5gr of H-110 under a Lee .429/310 cast from 50/50 clip on wheel weights/linotype, for an average velocity of 1240fps. A RD 265gr boolit, cast of 50/50 COWW/roof flashing with a bit of SN over 13.5gr of HS-6 giving me an average velocity of 1252fps. And my final load is the RD 265 cast of 50/50 COWW/Linotype over 23gr of H-110 for an average velocity of 1450fps.

Of the above combinations I'm leaning towards the Lee 310 based on it's reputation and slightly better, but negligible, groups at 50 yards. However, I also feel the higher velocity of the H-110 load under the RD boolit may cause better wound channels, even with the slightly smaller meplate.

What say the more experienced people here?

Either will shoot through any whitetail that ever walked from any angle. Don't over think. Pick a load you shoot well, practice regularly, put the boolit in the right place, and enjoy the backstraps.

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If you can keep nearly the same accuracy with 8-10 BHN the 34 cal flat nose will turn into 43-50 cal flat nose and the deer will react much better on a hit. Both of your loads will penetrate 3 deer with a single shot, so you are only putting 1/3 of the whoopin' on a deer if you use a bullet that penetrates that much.

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Originally Posted by mnewcomb59

If you can keep nearly the same accuracy with 8-10 BHN the 34 cal flat nose will turn into 43-50 cal flat nose and the deer will react much better on a hit. Both of your loads will penetrate 3 deer with a single shot, so you are only putting 1/3 of the whoopin' on a deer if you use a bullet that penetrates that much.

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With the HS-6 load and 50/50 COWW/pure mix I have not seen any expansion in either wetpack or water jugs testing. I know a living analog is completely different, but based on my test I haven't seen any expansion at that loads velocity.

If you are talking about running the softer alloy with the H-110 load, the accuracy falls apart at 21gr of H-110. I did not chrono this load so I have no clue what the velocity was.

A .429 boolit won't shrink as it goes through a deer.

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[QUOTE=Thumbcocker;5601783]A .429 boolit won't shrink as it goes through a deer.

Excellent quote! LOL

I think you are ready no matter which loading you choose. I can just hear Sam Elliot's voice after you shoot, "Venison, it's what's for Dinner."

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Originally Posted by Indiana shooter

With the HS-6 load and 50/50 COWW/pure mix I have not seen any expansion in either wetpack or water jugs testing. I know a living analog is completely different, but based on my test I haven't seen any expansion at that loads velocity.

If you are talking about running the softer alloy with the H-110 load, the accuracy falls apart at 21gr of H-110. I did not chrono this load so I have no clue what the velocity was.

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With that flat on either bullet you don't need expansion. Besides, expansion is a variable that may or may not happen. These well designed flat noses work at the moment of impact and right on through. We hit a whitetail with an LBT WFN 280 grain , the entrance wound I could put my thumbs side by side and barely touch the sides of the hole under the skin and that carried all the way through. No worries. Concentrate on placement

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Originally Posted by Thumbcocker

Either will shoot through any whitetail that ever walked from any angle. Don't over think. Pick a load you shoot well, practice regularly, put the boolit in the right place, and enjoy the backstraps.

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Being over analytical tends to be a flaw of mine, unfortunately in most cases.

I have killed around 5 deer with hard cast and 18 or 19 with 9-12 BHN and the deer take a longer time to die when hit well with hard cast. The medium cast still exits deer but the wound size is much larger and deer die faster. If it turns into a wadcutter or 1.5x caliber or less expansionand still makes it to the 5th water jug it kills deer much better than a bullet that penetrates 12 milk jugs. The magic spot in handguns lethality for wound size and penetration is when your WFN bullet grows into a wadcutter or slightly larger because your alloy is soft enough. Aim for bones and have a tracker dog on call if you hit a deer in the rear upper lungs with those hard bullets. I have personally seen double lunged deer with hard cast go over 200 yards through swamp thickets and need a finishing shot a half hour later. 1200 foot pounds of wounding potential doesn't mean squat when the bullet exits the deer and still has 900 foot pounds left.

A rock hard 44 mag, especially high sectional density, will leave a pencil sized hole and a pinkie sized bruise. If your meplat grows from .34 to .45, the AREA of the meplat doubles, from .36 square inches to .64 square inches. Now you are leaving a thumb sized hole and a 3 inch wide bruise around the hole. And still have enough penetration for Texas heart shots.

The 44 mag was developed with plain base 16:1 at 11 BHN. I think Elmer could shoot wounded mulies at 600 yards with 11 BHN plain base :wink:. If you can't get good accuracy with 10 BHN lead and a gas check maybe look into what is wrong with the revolver and fix that - such as inconsistent throats or tight spots in the barrel.

Attachment 316093Attachment 316094Attachment 316096

Below is a 1400 fps hard cast wound in a squirrel. Small hole like a 9mm rn even though I used a wfn 357. No bruising. The pic with two mushroomed bullets were some controlled expansion mushrooms in 2-2-96 recovered in deer. One was recovered in front of the shoulder after a Texas heart shot. One went through about 1 foot of neck vertebrae from under the chin all the way to the shoulder blades. Both bullets mushroomed exactly like they did in water jug tests and this load penetrates 5 jugs. The other pictures show a few 10 BHN bullets with 1100-1200 fps impact velocity where the meplat has doubled in area by growing into a wadcutter.

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Originally Posted by Don Purcell

With that flat on either bullet you don't need expansion. Besides, expansion is a variable that may or may not happen. These well designed flat noses work at the moment of impact and right on through. We hit a whitetail with an LBT WFN 280 grain , the entrance wound I could put my thumbs side by side and barely touch the sides of the hole under the skin and that carried all the way through. No worries. Concentrate on placement

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That post was in response to the above comment about the softer alloy flattening out more.

If the 310 would offer the same, or better terminal performance than the higher velocity RD, then it will be the hands down choice for me. If for no other reason than it's report is noticeably milder than the higher velocity RD boolit. (I do not wear ear pro while hunting)

You guys are amazing all this gunpowder and lead science

You've got three good ones there. I like a somewhat softish boolit for hunting. My favorite is the Lee 310. Never lets me down in either the rifle or handgun.

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Originally Posted by mnewcomb59

I have killed around 5 deer with hard cast and 18 or 19 with 9-12 BHN and the deer take a longer time to die when hit well with hard cast. The medium cast still exits deer but the wound size is much larger and deer die faster. If it turns into a wadcutter or 1.5x caliber or less expansionand still makes it to the 5th water jug it kills deer much better than a bullet that penetrates 12 milk jugs. The magic spot in handguns lethality for wound size and penetration is when your WFN bullet grows into a wadcutter or slightly larger because your alloy is soft enough. Aim for bones and have a tracker dog on call if you hit a deer in the rear upper lungs with those hard bullets. I have personally seen double lunged deer with hard cast go over 200 yards through swamp thickets and need a finishing shot a half hour later. 1200 foot pounds of wounding potential doesn't mean squat when the bullet exits the deer and still has 900 foot pounds left.

A rock hard 44 mag, especially high sectional density, will leave a pencil sized hole and a pinkie sized bruise. If your meplat grows from .34 to .45, the AREA of the meplat doubles, from .36 square inches to .64 square inches. Now you are leaving a thumb sized hole and a 3 inch wide bruise around the hole. And still have enough penetration for Texas heart shots.

The 44 mag was developed with plain base 16:1 at 11 BHN. I think Elmer could shoot wounded mulies at 600 yards with 11 BHN plain base :wink:. If you can't get good accuracy with 10 BHN lead and a gas check maybe look into what is wrong with the revolver and fix that - such as inconsistent throats or tight spots in the barrel.

Attachment 316093Attachment 316094Attachment 316096

Below is a 1400 fps hard cast wound in a squirrel. Small hole like a 9mm rn even though I used a wfn 357. No bruising. The pic with two mushroomed bullets were some controlled expansion mushrooms in 2-2-96 recovered in deer. One was recovered in front of the shoulder after a Texas heart shot. One went through about 1 foot of neck vertebrae from under the chin all the way to the shoulder blades. Both bullets mushroomed exactly like they did in water jug tests and this load penetrates 5 jugs. The other pictures show a few 10 BHN bullets with 1100-1200 fps impact velocity where the meplat has doubled in area by growing into a wadcutter.

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The RD is a plain base boolit.

I have 2 cylinders that need to be reamed a thou or so. 1 is right at the bore diameter and the other is .0005 over. (Measured by slugging and a mic.) The softer alloys skid a bit when engaging the rifling with the higher pressure loads.