7.35 Carcano Woes

Not really case forming but.... First shot at reloading 7.35 Carcano. Lee dies, Hornady shellholder. 5 of 10 got stuck in the sizing die. After the first 2 I removed the sizing ball and "bumped" the brass 4-5 times to get it to FL size. Lubed the inside of the neck and ran into the die again. Still had 3 more get stuck. Yes I did clean the die before using and also tried a light cote of lube inside the die. Polished the sizing ball with 2000 grit sandpaper. Still no improvement. I'm using Hornady One Shot case lube and once fired PPU brass. Also tried Imperial with no change.

Funny thing is I also resized several 6.5 Carcano with no problems.

Ideas? Do I need to anneal 1x fired brass? The brass is so hard to get I don't want to trash more. I just ruined an eighth of my brass.

I would suspect the dies. They may be a little rough on the inside. You could also try the RCBS lube.

i just bought a 7.35 carcano sporter that has an off centered bore. i paid $50 for it at an auction, only because i wanted the action. i'm going to rebarrel it to 35 rem.

i suspect the dies also. i use lanolin and 99% Isopropyl alcohol.

I'd start with the easy things 1st. I've had similar problems in the past which got me looking into case lubes. A swaging lube consisting of lanolin/castor oil mixed 50/50 works best for me. Haven't had a stuck case since using this lube.

Sounds like a rough die inside. Try polishing the inside the die like you did the sizing ball. Did the 2 that didn’t stick fit the chamber ok?

To me, sizing wax is the ultimate for difficult to size cases. Right now I have a container from Hornady and one from Creedmor. Difficult to clean off, but if it can't be resized with these you got a bad sizing die.

I deprime and size in one step (ground the neck expander off the decapping pin). Then wet tumble with pins and dawn. Expand neck with Lyman M-die. I think it gets it straighter.

I'm a little puzzled by your post, NY_Treeguy. I've been reloading for a long time, many different calibers, and can probably count the number of stuck cases I've had on one hand. I'm going to start by suspecting your lube. Personally, I use Lee Case Sizing Lube, the white stuff that comes in a tube. I use it exclusively on all rifle cartridges for which carbide dies aren't available. A little goes a long way--just a pea-sized dab on the finger will do 3-5 cases. I also use Q-tips to apply a sparing amount to the inside of the necks. This lube is sort of accumulative inside the die, and just to see if it could be done I've sometimes run in a 5th or 6th die without any lube and it's still resized and come back out.

Next thing that seems odd is your expander ball problem. When a case is run into a sizing die it punches out the old primer and squeezes the entire case back to near factory specs (unless it is a neck size only die), and when it is removed from the die on the down stroke (depending on the type of press) the expander ball is the last thing it encounters on the way out, the purpose being to expand the neck's mouth sufficiently to insert the new bullet. If you remove the ball and run the case into sizer die as you described 5 times to get a case to resize something may be wrong with the die's dimensions. However, the way you stated the problem, it's not clear to me that you are resizing brass that was made as 7.35 Carcano and not trying to form it from something else. You said some 6.5 Carcano brass sized without a problem, which is not at all unusual, as the only difference between the two cases is the mouth diameter for a larger bullet, and the two may usually be easily converted from one to the other both ways.

Usually I discount problems where the O.P. says the shell holder and the dies are a different brand, and the odds of this being a problem are unlikely, but perhaps the Hornady shell holder is thinner or thicker than a Lee holder, and assuming dies properly adjusted in the press as per Lee's instructions, the Hornady shell holder may be pushing the case too far into the die, or insufficiently. I think I'd remove the die from the press and start over again with adjustment closely following Lee's instructions.

If none of this works to solve your problem, then I'd recommend sending the die back to Lee. They're very good about replacement of defective dies. You can also phone them. Ask for Peter and explain the situation.

Good luck with your problem.

DG

Did you clean the dies between the One Shot and the Imperial? I'm not a fan of Hornady's One Shot, it and a set of Lee dies in .223 more than tripled my lifetime number of stuck cases about twenty years ago.

With decent case lube, I am still using that set of Lee dies today.

Robert

GONRA suggests trying STP Oil Treatment or
Tri-Flow Synthetic Grease for case forming lube.
If these fail to help, probably hava a rough die finish....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Der Gebirgsjager

I'm a little puzzled by your post, NY_Treeguy. I've been reloading for a long time, many different calibers, and can probably count the number of stuck cases I've had on one hand. I'm going to start by suspecting your lube. Personally, I use Lee Case Sizing Lube, the white stuff that comes in a tube. I use it exclusively on all rifle cartridges for which carbide dies aren't available. A little goes a long way--just a pea-sized dab on the finger will do 3-5 cases. I also use Q-tips to apply a sparing amount to the inside of the necks. This lube is sort of accumulative inside the die, and just to see if it could be done I've sometimes run in a 5th or 6th die without any lube and it's still resized and come back out.

Next thing that seems odd is your expander ball problem. When a case is run into a sizing die it punches out the old primer and squeezes the entire case back to near factory specs (unless it is a neck size only die), and when it is removed from the die on the down stroke (depending on the type of press) the expander ball is the last thing it encounters on the way out, the purpose being to expand the neck's mouth sufficiently to insert the new bullet. If you remove the ball and run the case into sizer die as you described 5 times to get a case to resize something may be wrong with the die's dimensions. However, the way you stated the problem, it's not clear to me that you are resizing brass that was made as 7.35 Carcano and not trying to form it from something else. You said some 6.5 Carcano brass sized without a problem, which is not at all unusual, as the only difference between the two cases is the mouth diameter for a larger bullet, and the two may usually be easily converted from one to the other both ways.

Usually I discount problems where the O.P. says the shell holder and the dies are a different brand, and the odds of this being a problem are unlikely, but perhaps the Hornady shell holder is thinner or thicker than a Lee holder, and assuming dies properly adjusted in the press as per Lee's instructions, the Hornady shell holder may be pushing the case too far into the die, or insufficiently. I think I'd remove the die from the press and start over again with adjustment closely following Lee's instructions.

If none of this works to solve your problem, then I'd recommend sending the die back to Lee. They're very good about replacement of defective dies. You can also phone them. Ask for Peter and explain the situation.

Good luck with your problem.

DG

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Tried the lee sizing lube as well as lanolin. It must be the dies. After I managed to get a few of the 7.35 cases resized the lee die would not seat bullets either. Bullet would start to seat and then when adjusting the seating depth the bullets would pull out.

I have used Lee dies in several other calibers and never had a stuck case issue. Also used oneshot lube and same thing...never a stuck case.

Contacted Lee and am sending dies back for them to check. Also have a set of RCBS dies on order.

Please revisit this thread and let us know how things turn out.

DG

I've had bum dies by more than one maker. Send them back and they will get you fixed up.

Cases are "stuck" in an FL die when the rim rips off the shell holder while leaving the case itself fully stuck up inside the die. (Dragging an unusually tight expander ball from a bottle neck case is not a "stuck" case!)

Cases get stuck in FL dies for only one reason: insufficient lube on the lower, thicker part (head) of the case. Proper application of any type of case lube is critical to trouble free sizing. However, finding a "good commercial case lube" is quite easy; they are all good. No reloading tool company is dumm enough to market a failed case lube ... but even they can't make us use it right!

Proper application methods vary by type. Different people prefer different methods so choose a lube method you like and get a lube that works that way. But know that all commercial case lubes work fine when used correctly! The big problem is (1) a lot of users liberally apply lube in and on the necks but starve the heads OR (2) they use a spray lube but don't read the instructions and don't allow the lube carrier to fully evaporate.

I occasionally read web comments about rough dies causing stuck cases. But in 55 years of reloading experience, while using many dies from many makers, I've never seen or personally known of anyone actually having a troublesome "ruff" sizer. (I do know of a LOT of people who had trouble applying their case lube properly!)

Shell holders ... don't cause cases to get stuck in dies because they can't. Common SAMMI shell holders ALL have 1/8"/.125" decks (+/- the very small specified tolerance they all share) so it doesn't matter what brand mix of conventional dies and shell holders (or cases) we may use, they're made to work together.

Expander balls ... can't possibly cause stuck cases because the cases are already hanging loose inside the die before the expander balls can touch the sized cases. (Okay, except for a miss-adjusted Bonanza/Forster sizer.)

Finally, I have no idea what "bumping" a sizer means but I know unusual press lever resistance is the only warning we will ever get when developing stuck case. If it's getting unusually difficult to press down don't just keep pushing harder, withdraw the case and apply more lube on the head area BEFORE it sticks - that works!

:)

What make of brass are you using? Do not use the Lee shell holder, it is for .473 base cases. I found that the Redding #24 and the Hornady #21 work best for me. The Lee #12 and RCBS #9 might also work.

You may be right suspecting the dies may not smooth enough. I had the same problem last year when I started loading 7.35 using Lee dies and lost a few cases when converting some PPU brand 6.5x54 MS cases. Dimensions of the MS cases are slightly larger than the Carcano and my 7.35 dies would not size them down in one pass.

My solution was to use a .448 base sizing die in an arbor press to reduce the diameter of the MS cases. Once the base is properly resized I have not lost any cases.

Been loading for 58 years now. Hornandy Unique Case Lube is the best stuff I have ever used. Never had a stuck case using it.
Who's brass are you using?