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Finally got my hands on one [emoji16]
Spent last night de greasing and heat cycling it so think imma try and see how she drops tonight.
Think the 1917 is gonna like these
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Go wolfdog !
Tim
From what I see, the design is similar, and I said similar, to Lyman's 314299, but lighter, it should be a good boolit for my cz 308 twist rate 1:12
I'm going to follow this thread closely...
Actually, other than being a GC'd cast bullet, the 30 XCB has nothing in common with the 314299. I took part in the development and final design.
Let’s discuss the NOE 30 XCB bullet (310-165-FN). This bullet was designed by several of us with the idea of a perfect fit in the ’06 neck length with the GC at the base of the neck and the beginning of the ogive just bumping up against the leade, a bearing surface of 60% +, a nose giving a decent BC w/o any bore riding portion and having a small meplat. The grooves are minima in length and depth with sufficient lube capacity for todays modern lubes giving maximum diameter at the bottom of the grooves.
Larry is spot on/knowledgeable and a wealth of factual info and known for hitting exactly where needed (in a pinch) in Nam! /Ed
So, generally, will the 30 XCB work in an M1 Garand and/or a Tikka T3 Varmint? I also have an AR-10. With 3-.30 cal. rifles versatility of molds helps.
Slim
Ahh, look, I congratulate you, from what I have heard it is a very good design.Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Gibson
I will follow the thread, since I am interested in this design to make long range with my 308
Will be watching this one too. Have a couple of '03's and a Krag that might really like these.
It works really well with my Garand.
The .308 has a shorter neck and 'tighter' throat, which means it gets seated deeper.
The 30 XCB works exceedingly well in any cartridge with a 30-06 length neck. It also is excellent in many 30Ws, especially those with 12" twists. In my M70 target 308W and my M!A with milsurp barrel, both w/12" twist, the 30 XCB is seated with the top of the GC at the base of the case neck. Seated as such accuracy is moa or better in the M70 and 2 moa or less in the M1A.
My match load in my M1903A1 NM 30-06 is also excellent.
Attachment 320947
Attachment 320948
For longer range fans.....as posted several years back;
The 30 XCB, 308W, 500 Yards, 10 & 14” twists
On another forum I was asked how well I could shoot the 30 XCB at 500 yards, particularly at a velocity of 2250 fps +/- having pushed the RPM Threshold up from 1940 fps. It had been several years since I did any long range shooting with the XCB in a 10” twist and then the longest range was 300 yards. Most of my LR shooting with the XCB in the 14” twist .308W Palma rifle and the 16” twist 30x60 XCB “DAWN” have been also limited to 300 yards. I did informally shoot out to 400 yards but nothing on record as such. Time to do some 500 yard shooting on target.
The cold weather front shifted a day earlier than expected so it cooperated this morning, February 26, 2018, at least for the 500 yard shooting. By the time I got to 600 yards the wind was switching back and forth from 5 o'clock to 9 o'clock and pushing 12 to 14 mph so I didn't attempt shooting there at 600 yards with the 30x60 XCB in my rifle “DAWN”. I did however get fairly decent shooting conditions at 500 yards and got decent groups with my 10" and 14" twist .308Ws at 500 yards this morning.
This morning dawned at 39 degrees with a 2 mph wind coming out of the SW. I was at my long range shooting local north of LHC about 30 minutes later. I set up the target and my wind flag and then went to the 500 yard firing point and set up a portable BR. It's not the sturdiest bench in the world but it will do. From the firing point the wind was running 3 - 6 mph out of 7 to 8:30. By the time I was ready to shoot the sun was up and the temp was 45 degrees and the humidity 28%.
The first rifle shot was my M1909 Argentine with a 24" A&B barrel with a 10" twist. It's in a wood sporter stock. The scope is a 10X Weaver MicroTrac with friction adjustments. The load is the 30 XCB cast of #2 alloy and WQ'd, weight sorted as previously mentioned. The XCB was loaded in LC72 Match cases (match prepped of course) with WLR primers. The load I used, 44 gr RL22, is the same load that had proven extremely uniform and accurate at 2267 fps (163,224 RPM) in the thread I posted and suggested you read about how the RPM Threshold can be pushed up. For calculating sight adjustment for elevation and the wind I used the “Applied Ballistics” program I got with Bryan Litz’s very fine book on long range ballistics. That was really beneficial because it got me pretty close elevation wise. Also I had calculated the wind correction in moa and that was very helpful. Before the shooting at 500 yards was done the wind was steady at 4 – 8 mps coming out of 8 o’clock. That required 7 +/- moa (30 to 50” at 500 yards) adjustment for the wind with the 2267 fps load out of the 10” twist rifle. I had put up a good wind flag which was very helpful as I tried to shoot in the same wind condition.
I had set a rock about 6 – 8” I had painted black off to the side of the target to use as a “sighter”. With the .308W rifle with 10” twist it took a bit to get on target at 500 yards with that older Weaver scope is friction, not click adjustable and the turret marks were not moa. I did manage to get the 10 test shots on target before I ran out of ammo.....barely. The group was not centered up on the target. Here's the rifle on the bench (sorry, no slick video as I'm so like last century....just some pictures and on target results)......if you save that picture to a file you can enlarge it and see the target and range flag on the face of that far ridge where the barrel is pointed.
Attachment 320949
Here's the target. Note two of the shots creased the edge of the target frame so I counted them in the group. Here's the target measurement. It is an 11 3/4" ten consecutive shot group at 500 yards. I covered the bottom bullet hole up with the tape taking the picture. However you can see it in the other photo. The HV load (for a 10" twist) is holding very close to 2 moa (actually 2.35 moa) at 500 yards. Obviously the RPM Threshold has been pushed up but yet is still manageable. In the 2nd picture you can see the range flag hanging limp. Seemed like every time I went to check/change the target the wind died. Then as soon as I got back to the bench it started blowing again…..go figure……
Attachment 320950 Attachment 320951
I then switched rifles to see what controlling the RPM by using a slower twist and boosting the velocity can do for us. The next test was with my Palma rifle with a 27.4" light Palma S&L 14" twist barrel in 308W on a M98 byf action. The load is the standard 2600 fps load I worked up several years ago. It is 47 gr AA4350 in Winchester cases with WLR primers. Again, the NOE 30 XCB bullet was cast of #2 alloy and WQ'd. The Lube was 2500+ and GCs are Hornady's. With the 14" twist 2600 fps is 133,714 RPM, considerably less than with the 10" twist at 335 fps less velocity. The Palma load is well under its RPM threshold.
Here's the 500 yard 10 shot group from the Palma rifle at 2600 fps. With the precise elevation/windage adjustments of the Weaver T-16 on the rifle it didn't take long to get centered on target. Still I was using 4 +/- moa of wind adjustment.
Attachment 320952
Here is the group measurement. The 10 shot group at 500 yards is 7 3/4" which is 1.45 moa.
Attachment 320953
So, there are the 500 yard 30 XCB test results that was asked for. This was a lot of fun for sure and I’m watching the weather forecast for the next low wind day. Then I’ll be off again with DAWN to shoot at 600 yards……..
Some I've cast up ready for PC along with some other 30cals
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Gave them their first .310 sizing and gas checking along with an acatone bath
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And gave the 1917 a little bit of a face life
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I think it's a mold all us .30 cal junkies need to have. Larry's given us a good bullet
I chased the velocity dragon briefly with it in my 1-10" twist CZ 550 and ran into the "excessive twist" wall around 2,200 fps with a lot of lead plating at the muzzle. Had the same problem with different bullets in my 1-10" twist 700. I ultimately concluded that if 2,100-2,200 is as fast as a 1-10" twist can throw a cast bullet, I'll find an accuracy load near that speed with a heavier slug and make up for the lack of velocity with extra mass (i.e. 311299, Accurate 31-194D).
BUT, I'm still somewhat intrigued by the idea of the XCB in a Garand with an adjustable gas plug. . .or for fussy feeders that need a spitzer profile. . .or for slower twist .308's. . .there's a plethora of potential homes for it.:)
I’ve never seated to a length that put a gas check below the neck. It just didn’t seem like a good idea. After reading this, I don’t think I ever will.Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Gibson
Thank you Larry for posting this!
I have to compliment NOE with the quality of the mold ..
Mine performs very nice as it drops very clean and efficient with just a tap on the handles as compared to other molds that I use .
Still working on it's use overall as I have three different rifles for it to be in , will sit back and focus on one for now with the XCB .
Thank you for your expertise, there are three molds that I would like to get my hands on, this is one, the other two are the rcbs SIL and the lyman 311467.Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Gibson
I am indebted for the rpm stabilization reading, my long range partners are ahead of me on that.
but I have to read it in English, as I can't rely on the translator, and not knowing my mother tongue, it takes me much longer.
soon I will start trying with the mauser 1909 in 765 arg and a scope without click adjustment, so far I have managed to hit up to 500 mts but I estimate that I can be more consistent up to 600 mts.
Translated with DeepL.com (free version)
I have a cz 550 varmint, but the TR is 1:12, I have managed to hit consistently at 500 meters and more difficult at 600 meters with a load of 43 grains of win760, and the boolit that I use is 314299 drawn to .309, I I make PC and then lubricate with lyman orange magicQuote:
Originally Posted by Bigslug
gc made by me from aluminum, around 2300 fps