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My Dad has a 1909 Argentine that has a badly corroded bore.
He's always talked about "doing something with it", like rebarreling it or having a 'smith sporterize it.
The question I have: is it a candidate to have rebored to 35 Whelen, without having to do any other work? Does the shoulder of the 7.65 Argentine fall "within" the shape of the 35 Whelen dimension? Or would he have to do a complete barrel swap?
I figure there are probably a few of you here that know the answer.
Far from a expert .... I do have a 35 whelen, so I will make a comment
a couple of points
loaded round length ...pointy bullets on 35 whelen get pretty long and might not fit in the mag or allow it to load to full length
3006 brass is 63mm long
I have shot some 35 whelen with some stiff loads ..... do you want to go that far ... will that old action handle it
I do not think chamber area will clean up .... a expert will chime in with more of answer
you probably will need a new Barrel
Have you thought about a new barrel in 358 win ???? case length is just over 51mm
358 win and pistol bullets or heaver cast bullets for a nice every day fun gun that you can load mild to wild
Yup, I have. It makes a ton of sense. I was just wondering if the Whelen was an option for him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ford SD
I would call JES reboring and get his thoughts on it. I’ve heard that he doesn’t rebore military barrels anymore but it won’t hurt to ask. The 1909 Mauser( DWM or FMAP made) will handle higher pressure cartridges than the Whelen, so no worries there.
JES Reboring 541-942-1342 leave a message- he’ll call you back.
I think this is definitely do-able, but not without any other work. It will require some magazine work because the .35 Whelen, based on a .30-06 is a longer cartridge than the rifle was designed for. The chamber should clean-up fine with rechambering.
JES rebored and rechambered a military action P14 to 35 Winchester for me last year, and it shoots great.
I also have an Argentine Mauser that was rechambered to .30-06 by an importer, but it still had the 7.65mm/.312 barrel. I didn't want to be loading "regular" .30-06 rounds with .308 jacketed/.311 cast for my other rifles and have to keep separate and load .312/.314 for the Argentine. I ended up rebarreling with an FN M1950 .30-06 barrel. The point here is that you can easily accommodate a longer .30-06 or .35 Whelen in a M1909 Argentine action, but you will probably need to go with an extended magazine box and may need to also slightly modify the feed ramp to accept a 0.40" longer cartridge than the rifle was originally chambered for.
Numrich/Gun Parts Corp used to always have modified extended length M98 trigger guards (magazine boxes), but not anymore. You will need to modify a standard M98 trigger guard yourself to accommodate the longer cartridge.
How about a 9.3X57?
If your dad is going to have it sporterized I suggest a rebarrel. If he wants to keep it in original military configuration a rebore to 35 Whelen would be doable, but I'd suggest trying to fing a decent takeoff milsurp barrel instead.
I built my wife's 35 Whelen on a 09/09 action using a Douglas barrel. It feeds and functions perfectly. I've built several others on VZ-24 actions with no problems. She, the wife, has taken four bull elk with hers. She thinks it is "Big Medicine" for elk. The Whelen come into it's own with 250 grain bullets. That is it's advantage over the 30-06 as they will both shoot 220's at relatively the same velocity.
Rebarrell is the way to go, especially if its in military configuration. Shooting 35 whelen with a military stock will quickly wear you down.
I have a NOS 3006 military stepped barrel which will fit if your interested.
9.3x62, if it will fit in the magazine box. I had a Turk Mauser that JES did and it functioned fine.
You guys are awesome. Thanks for all the info.
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If your 09 Argie has the original hinged floorplate TG setup, no way would I change, personally! Those rifles are a beautiful example of the gunmakers art, even if they're over a century old. Those old Argie Mausers are built way better than all but custom rifles today! I had one barreled in .30-06, and it did well for what it was. An enterprising gunsmith had fitted a 2-groove 03-A3 Springfield barrel to it, and chopped down the military stock. I didn't have much money in it, but I really enjoyed that rifle. Too bad I let it go.
I rebarreled mine to .308 Win and frankly I don't think anything much longer would be a good idea. The .358 Win would be close to the .35 Whelen and fit much better in the magazine...
Tony
i have a 1909 that has been rebarreled to 35 whelen, and i love it. It has a nikon 4-12x40 and it will shoot 1.5" groups at 100 yards easily with the RCBS 200gn.
That is using imr 3031
What STUBSHAFT suggested. Or even a .358 Winchester.
I cannot picture the 1909 Mauser in my mind, but if memory serves, the 7.65 Turk/Belgian/Argentine/ Whatever is a shorter round than most other military calibers and so might be the action. In this century, I haven't measured the action the OP mentions, so maybe it's long enough. All factors being equal, though, you may find that rechambering (in this case, rebarreling) for a shorter round rather than the longish Whelen is to your advantage.
I built two Mausers into .35 Whelen.
One for a friend was on a 1909 Argentine action.
And mine that I still have is built on a Czech receiver.
Both rifles are excellent.
I still have my rifle.
My friend passed away a year ago.
I got his rifle from the estate.
I don't need two of that caliber , so I gave another friend that rifle so he can sell it at a gun show.
I do want to build a Mauser in .358 Winchester.
But I will use a Yugo Mauser 24/47 action since it is shorter and handled the .308 length cartridge very well
i have a 35 whelen built on a 1912 styre action with no problems with feeding or fireing/.