I understand that the burning of bullet lube creates smoke..but was curious if a gas check would reduce the smoke at all?
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I understand that the burning of bullet lube creates smoke..but was curious if a gas check would reduce the smoke at all?
Not in my experience.
I can't imagine how it would.
I don't think the boolit lube is burning when a cartridge is fired.
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I do think a GC could reduce smoke, if the GC makes a boolit fit better.
Easy way to find out. Load up some identical cartridges, only some with gas checks and some without. Fire one batch and see how it smokes. Then fire the other and see if it's the same or different.
Then was are smokeless powder cast bullets round smokey? No seriously. So the same load with a jacket and see the difference, which is the difference is the case has lube. Some lubes are smokier then others. What do you think Jon?Quote:
Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe
A hotter fire equals less smoke. A tighter fit (with GC) provides higher pressure, quicker peak pressure, more thorough ignition of combustible components, and less smoke. When using a gas check my wax crayon-colored lubes smoke less, are practically unnoticeable by smell, exit with higher velocity, and burn powder completely. Without a gas check smoke and the smell of crayon is greater, powder does not burn completely, and velocity is reduced. This is exhibited with 357 Mag. in both H&R Handi-rifle and Ruger SP101 as well as 45 Colt in Buffalo Classic Handi-rifle and Ruger Blackhawk.
"In theory";
GC loads require less lube than non GC....... Always exceptions.
About the only "absolute" in shooting cast is; bullet must exit the bore.
Good luck with your project.
In my thinking; Cast lead, conventual lube could leave a "coating" of lube as the bullet travels down the barrel. The residual lube burns and smokes. A bare base bullet may have some alloy "evaporate" from the powder flame and produce smoke. The powder is often the smokiest component (remember all the complaints about a particular powder being excessively smokey?). I only use gas checks on one bullet, Lyman 421244 and not enough for a side by side comparison with a 429421. Gun smoke doesn't bother me and I hardly notice it since I stopped shooting black powder revolvers...
Depends on the lube and how much. Wiping the bullet base across a cloth or paper towel when loading might help. Wiping case necks, keeping the lube in the grooves or a thin hard coating of lube helps. Soft 'gooey' black powder lubes tend to smoke but there it doesn't matter. There is a balance between too much and just enough lube.
What do I think?Quote:
Originally Posted by TD1886
One of the tests I do, when I'm testing a lube, is to place a piece of cardboard near the muzzle to see if the lube is flung out of the lube grooves or not[after the boolit leaves the barrel]. In a successful test, there will be lube splattered on the cardboard, around the hole the boolit made. When that happens, that lube has never been on fire. That's what I think.
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I also think that during that fraction of a second after the trigger is pulled, there is a portion of lube that is exposed to high pressure and high heat. Not long enough to burn, but to vaporize the lube, or maybe just vaporize some of the components of the lube. That vapor would combine with the exhaust gases from the burning powder.
I remember a friend, long gone now, that has some cast bullets for his 357 that smoked worse then a Ford without rings! He even made note to me to watch how much smoke came out the gun.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonB_in_Glencoe
I notice a big difference on what comes out of the muzzle between cast and pc bullet.....jacketed for that matter.
Back when I first started boolit casting and learning about this and that, one member here did a swap with me. I had bought a large quantity of randyrat's beeswax and my friend wanted some of that fresh wax. He swapped some of his proprietary lube [he was a commercial caster] and some random lube ingredients from his experimenting days as well as some Lithi-bee lube, which was another experiment of his ...failed experiment he told me and he was hesitant to send me any, But I told him I wanted to try it.Quote:
Originally Posted by TD1886
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This comment is about the Lithi-bee lube.
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You know how some automotive grease just has a stank to it?
well, I don't know what grease was in this Lithi-bee, but it stank. It stank a room temp, it stank even more when lubing with a heated lubesizer. AND boy oh boy, did it stank up the pistol range, the range is basically a pit with little air movement. Yes it did seem to smoke more than some other recipes I've tried, especially when shot using Unique.
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Side note:
His proprietary lube is the most smoke-free lube I have ever used. He said it was good for both BP as well as CF with smokeless powder. He also said it was food grade and you could eat it, I did taste it, it tasted like minty lip balm.
Personally I have experienced more smoke and smell from Unique powder than anything else.
Use powder coated bullets. No more stinky smoke!
Before I dipped my toe into PC'ing boolits, and I am not saying I have gone in that water very far, I had already purchased all of the handgun and many of the rifle caliber dies and nose punches and made a gallon of petroleum jelly and bees wax-based lube for a Lube Sizer. I have not scratched the surface of that gallon of lube. Crayons make a nice lube color change and I get to use the Lube Sizer, which likely will never wear out.
Doesn't the smoke come from partially burned lube?
In autoloaders or rifles, this is the lube that shoots around the bullet before the bullet manages to seal the bore. If you can shoot bullets large enough to sufficiently fill the leade, it goes away. Lube gets properly combusted. For me, this means no smoke. But you can still smell the Alox!
And in revolvers or blowbacks, you get tons of this smoke, because this half-burnt lube shoots out the cylinder gap or from the breech, respectively, no matter what you do.
Gas checks shouldn't change things by much if at all.
If it does it would be a very small amount of smoke in most cases . That said I have loaded both jacketed and cast bullets with Gas Check in 30-30 with Leverlution powder and both loads smoked a lot . The cast bullet load pattered worse then my 12 gauge but the jacketed load had three bullets touching at 100 yards? The load I use in the gun with castboolits is IMR-3031 and I see no smoke with it and am averaging 2040 f/s. These bullets are coated and baked .
I have seen a cast bullet base destroyed and that caused a lot of smoke which was really lead in the air! I was shooting some fairly heavy loads in a 10" contender in 357-44 B&D two shot well then one smoked badly and hit way off on 25 yard target backer. Looking at the gun the case, chamber, barrel and barrel ports were badly leaded. from what I could figure out the bullets where seated below the case neck and the bullet base must have deformed before leaving the case . There was no pressure signs on the case or primer above the other loads maybe even lower pressure as the case was coated in lead before sealing the chamber.
Gas check boolits have far less lube in most designs than plain base, but whether it produce less smoke than a plain base, I haven't paid any attention. Powder coated bullets produce little to no smoke, I have noticed that.
If the gas check made any difference at all, I don't think it would be enough to notice.