M16a1 parts kit

[dpaqu]

I bought a M16a1 colt parts kit with a new barrel from copes for 450$ I have to mount the gas block and figure out how to park the barrel but otherwise it should go together like legos. Anyone else put one of these together? I wish it came with the original 1x12 or 1x14 twist barrels. That would be better for CB and its not like this is going to Camp Perry or something were I would want to shoot the heavy stuff in it.

I will take pictures of it as soon as it arives.

http://whatacountry.com/images/products/detail/M16A1.1.JPG

[missionary5155]

Greetings
Looks like a descent way to get a classic style rifle I went through basic with.

[AZ-Stew]

There is one place where you want a special tool for assembling the lower receiver parts. The forward hinge pin holding the upper and lower receiver together has a detent and spring that are close to impossible to assemble without the tool. Spend the extra few bucks to get one and buy an extra couple of detent pins and springs. There are four or five of them somewhere in my shop that I haven't found over the last two years since I built my lower. When those little devils get away from you, there's no finding them unless you're in a 4x4x4 capsule when they spring loose.

Get the tool and get a couple extra springs and detent pins. They're cheap.

Regards,

Stew

[mike in co]

consdier drilling and tapping the front sight base for small set screws....and then install it that way....
once you can see the screw marks on the bbl, try putting some small flats there....dremel..mill.drill press..and then use the set screws to level the base...


mike in co

[AlaskaMike]

Wow, I'm jealous! Everyone else can have their M4 style rifles with reflex sights and other tacticool garbage--give me a Colt SP1 or M16A1 rifle with a teardrop forward assist and triangle style handguard, and I'd feel like I died and went to heaven! That's the black rifle I lusted after as a kid.

Please do post pics when you get it assembled.

[82nd airborne]

consdier drilling and tapping the front sight base for small set screws....and then install it that way....
once you can see the screw marks on the bbl, try putting some small flats there....dremel..mill.drill press..and then use the set screws to level the base...


mike in co

Mike speaks the truth here. I have a thorough disdain for roll pins.

[dpaqu]

consdier drilling and tapping the front sight base for small set screws....and then install it that way....
once you can see the screw marks on the bbl, try putting some small flats there....dremel..mill.drill press..and then use the set screws to level the base...



It sounds like a great idea. What size tap should I use? Should I just look for screws from a McMaster-Carr catalog?

Stew do you have a link for that tool your talking about?

Thanks

[richbug]

It sounds like a great idea. What size tap should I use? Should I just look for screws from a McMaster-Carr catalog?

Stew do you have a link for that tool your talking about?

Thanks


Regular 8-32 set screws are fine. Any hardware store will have them. Doing it this way allows your to get he front sight indexed perfectly by shooting and adjusting before you make it permanent.

No special tolls are needed to assemble the lower. A set of pin punches are nice to have though, but you can make your own out of a bolt. A razor blade works well to hold the spring and detent for the front pin.

A barrel vise or a good bench vise with a set of "V" blocks to hold the barrel, and a wrench for the barrel nut are all you need.

[82nd airborne]

Use electrical tape to tape around holes so you dont mar the finish getting all those pins in.

[NickSS]

Souns like a good project. I have looked at these kits myself but have not decided to buy one or not. A few years ago I bought an M1 from the CMP and its gas cylinder was all shinny so I wanted to make it more like the originals. I found out that they are stainless and were originally painted with a high temp paint. So I bought some bake on paint finish from Midway that advertized a parkerized colored paint. After degreasing the cylinder I painted it them baked it in the oven for the recommended time and temperature. Its been in use now for the past five years and no wear or scratches to show for the use. You might consider this stuff for finishing your barrel.

[HATCH]

go to www.nodakspud.com
get a sp1 retro receiver.
it will look right with those kits

[Jailer]

Do you own a FA lower? I can't see a sear in that pic you posted but I do see a FA hammer and possibly FA selector (hard to tell in pic). I'd be careful possessing these parts if you don't already own a registered FA lower. Parts from a FA trigger group in a semi auto lower could land you a trip to club fed if it is ever discovered.

As for the front detent no special tools are needed. Find anything round about the same diameter as the pivot pin. I use a pin from a broken window crank just because it was the right size and it was rolling around in my desk but even a small bolt would work. We'll call it a pilot. Insert your pilot into the pivot on the lower receiver from left to right until it's almost all the way through. Insert your detent spring and detent into the hole in the receiver. Depress the detent and as you do this push your pilot the rest of the way through and it will hold the detent in. Grab your pivot pin and line it up with your pilot making sure the channel is facing the depressed detent. Push the pivot pin in from right to left pushing the pilot through and it will capture the detent and keep it from flying across the room. Whatever you choose to use as a pilot will work best if it has a flat face so you can butt the pilot and pivot pin together as you are pushing them through.

Sounds complicated but once you try it you'll see how easy it is and you'll never launch another detent across the room.

[zomby woof]

Front sight modifications to barrel on page two.

http://www.gswagner.com/arsight/arsightmods2.html

[nicholst55]

A full-auto hammer can be easily modified, by simply grinding off the 'hook' on the tip. The back end of the full-auto trigger can be spot welded so that a full-auto disconnector's 'tail' can't fit into it. The FA selector is best replaced, because it's more trouble to modify it than what the cost of a replacement is worth.

The full-auto bolt carrier is not an issue, so don't worry about that.

[cajun shooter]

I have built many of those black rifles as I was a company level armorer in the army and as a instructor with the police dept. Those parts are the (I'm in DS parts) hammer, safety with R&R position, bolt carrier,trigger and you have the idea. At one time in the late 80's early 90's you could own and fire a rifle with these parts as long as the lower was not drilled or slotted for a drop in. ATF agents used our range to check many cases. If it would R&R then the owner had some time with 3hots and a cot. If it would not R&R then the rifle was returned. I understand that if the rifle contains any of the parts now it is a no no.

[derek45]

I built an M16A1 replica

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v488/derek45/retro%20AR15%20pics/IMGP6026.jpg


and a Colt 653 Car-15 replica

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v488/derek45/retro%20AR15%20pics/IMGP6019.jpg


both have surplus 1:12 Colt barrels.
the CAR-15 is a real 14.5" with a permanently mounted extended flash suppressor to make it a legal 16"


ar15.com has a good board on "retro" AR15's
http://www.ar15.com/forums/forum.html?b=3&f=123

[home in oz]

Neat project

[JIMinPHX]

I really haven't messed with black rifles, so I don't know much about them at all. I just wanted to ask a question here. I saw a S&W M&P version of an AR in a sporting goods store the other day for about $750. With prices like that on the market now, is it worth the bother of building one from parts? Is there some advantage to building one other than the price savings? Or is it just like casting boolits? Some of us just do it because we like the challenge & like honing our craftsmanship.

[Moonie]

JIMinPHX, one of my sons and I built one, well technically we didn't build it entirely, we got a stripped lower and a kit that included the built upper and the parts to build the lower. Cost us $640 for everything.

I also built my own upper in 6.8 SPC. That upper I built piece by piece, every part hand picked and exactly what I wanted. I have about as much in that upper as we spent on the rifle itself.

Granted the 6.8 upper is of much higher quality, but both work great.

We did it not so much for the cost savings but because we could.

[Phillip]

Same here, I built a 16" with a collapsible stock for 625$. It is a civilian copy of the M4. All of the parts are top named since I took my time in waiting for sales.

I am also building a A4 for CMP shooting. I figure it will about 800$ into it by the time I am done with getting all of the parts for it.

[AZ-Stew]

It sounds like a great idea. What size tap should I use? Should I just look for screws from a McMaster-Carr catalog?

Stew do you have a link for that tool your talking about?

Thanks

Sorry I didn't come back to this until now. Here's the link: http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=920248

It's pretty simple. The tool has a transverse hole through it (you can see it at the left end in the photo) and is knurled so you can rotate it easily. In use, you insert the tool in the takedown pin hole so the transverse hole lines up with the hole in the lower that is used to insert the detent. Insert the spring and detent pin through the hole in the pin and push it down with a pin punch. Now rotate the tool so it captures the detent pin. You can now slide the takedown pin through the other side of the lower and push the tool out with it. be careful not to let the detent slip between the takedown pin and the tool.

One of the problems I had with my lower is that the detent hole wasn't drilled deep enough and I had one h*** of a time trying to get the detent and spring down far enough to assemble the takedown pin. The spring would compress solid, preventing the detent pin from going down far enough to assemble the takedown pin. Once I drilled it out and made a proper tool for assembling it, things went quickly.

Regards,

Stew

[JIMinPHX]

What is the bottom dollar that someone could build a complete unit for, that is not a total piece of garbage? What are the desirable features to look for? Where is a good place to buy a complete kit?

[AZ-Stew]

Can't help you there, Jim. I didn't go "cheap", I went "custom varmint". Mine has a Command Arms collapsible butt stock, a grip that I can never remember the name of, but is the best, low-price piece of firearms hardware I ever bought (~$15 at Pistol Parlour in Mesa), a Jewel two-stage trigger ($200+) and a Bushmaster Varminter (.223 x 9" twist x 24" long carbon steel barrel and free-float handgard - $900), with a Burris 6.5-20x50mm Ballistic Plex scope. I shoot F-Cass with it at Rio Salado about once a month.

The stripped lower cost me about $140 right after the 2008 election and parts kits were unavailable. I had to buy all the parts as separate pieces. No big deal. It only cost a few extra $$. You can probably get the stripped lower now for about $100, but I haven't priced them lately.

Regards,

Stew

[JIMinPHX]

J&G's bottom dollar on a parts kit seems to be $500.
http://www.jgsales.com/product_info.php/p/colt-m16a1-parts-kit%2C-w-new-20in-barrel-very-good-to-excellent-condition-/products_id/3920?osCsid=98dcb09d05d2449d11c9cca86e0fa0fc

Who is this "copes" place that sells them for $450?

[Houndog]

I got my rifle kit from Del-Ton and it is first class. I built an A2 on a Spike's lower reciever casting and wound up with a little under $600 in it. I did not go with a chrome lined barrel as I thoroghly dislike them. Everything else is standard military configuration. The upper was fully assembled and I built the lower from parts.

FWIW, this place is in Fayetteville NC and in what I gathered talking with them I suspect their armorers are from Fort Bragg. .

[JIMinPHX]

Why don't you like chrome barrels? The only problem that I've ever found with them is that they don't like aluminum gas checks. Are there other problems that I'm not aware of, or is it just a personal thing?

[Houndog]

Jim,
It's more of a personal thing I guess. I have had the chrome lining peel and I've never had a chrome lined barrel shoot as well as a standard bore. UNDER CERTAIN CONDITIONS they might last somewhat longer. If I were back in Nam or some other severly wet s--t hole a chrome lined barrel could be an advantage, but i'm one of the accuracy above all else folks.

FWIW: I didn't use an M16 in Nam! I used an M40A1

[andremajic]

What is the bottom dollar that someone could build a complete unit for, that is not a total piece of garbage? What are the desirable features to look for? Where is a good place to buy a complete kit?

*throws some gasoline in the burn barrel*

You money should be put into a good quality barrel with a matching bolt. That is where you accuracy comes from. (You can use a stock bolt and lap it to match if you have a decent barrel.)

Other than a free-float barrel, all the other parts can be loose as a goose.

Del-ton used to have GREAT prices, but now I shop around. They aren't in Fayetteville, but they are in NC so parts come almost overnight to me. (midwayusa beat their prices on an upper I had my eye on.)

Stick with a stock trigger and do a trigger job on it. Rent the AGI video at www.smartflix.com (Triggers do NOT make an accurate rifle, they just make it easier to shoot! Shooter accuracy vs. mechanical accuracy.)

Best Regards,

Andy.

[georged4997]

does that rifle bring back memories, 1972. i would take that rifle over any m-4.
love to have one.

[Texasflyboy]

ATF Letter #52: (http://www.titleii.com/bardwell/atf_letter52.txt)

We would advise any person who possesses an AR-15 rifle not to
possess M-16 fire control component. If a person possessed only
the M-16 machinegun and spare M-16 fire control components for that
machinegun, the person would possess only one machinegun.

We trust that the foregoing has been responsive to your inquiry.
If you have further questions concerning this matter, please
contact us.

Sincerely yours,


Edward M. Owen, Jr.
Chief, Firearms Technology Branch

The rest of the ATF letters:

ATF Letters from James Bardwell's Old Site (http://www.nfatca.org/BATF_Letters.htm)

At one time time I remember reading the following quote in a similar thread:

"You have to realize that everyone is an expert when it comes to firearms and the laws regarding firearms. Everyone has an opinion, whether right or wrong. But what is important to remember is that while you will get many different opinions in the field, the one opinion that will matter most will be the one rendered at the conclusion of the trial."

The "Can I have one, two, three, or four M16 parts in my AR-15 build?" thread happens so often it's banned on many WWW gun boards due to the sheer amount of misinformation that gets posted in regards to the thread.

Any agency that classifies a shoestring as a machine gun (http://www.bobernet.com/blog/2007/07/shoe_string_no_longer_a_machin.html) is not one I want to waste my hard earned money dealing with. The U.S. government has deep pockets. I don't.

FWIW.

[DCM]

A full-auto hammer can be easily modified, by simply grinding off the 'hook' on the tip. The back end of the full-auto trigger can be spot welded so that a full-auto disconnector's 'tail' can't fit into it. The FA selector is best replaced, because it's more trouble to modify it than what the cost of a replacement is worth.

The full-auto bolt carrier is not an issue, so don't worry about that.

Well stated! Very good advice. Best to make the FA parts SA only and dump the selector.

If you are concerned with the bolt carrier that can be fixed too by removing abot 0.125" from the bottom near where the trigger group would be, making the back part of the opening just a little longer.

[dpaqu]

Do you own a FA lower? I can't see a sear in that pic you posted but I do see a FA hammer and possibly FA selector (hard to tell in pic). I'd be careful possessing these parts if you don't already own a registered FA lower. Parts from a FA trigger group in a semi auto lower could land you a trip to club fed if it is ever discovered.---Jailer

I gave the selector and the sear to a Class III friend of mine. Thanks for looking out.


&G's bottom dollar on a parts kit seems to be $500.
http://www.jgsales.com/product_info....c9cca86e0fa0fc

Who is this "copes" place that sells them for $450?
--JIMinPHX

Copes distributing http://www.copesdistributing.net/

Good folks in OH. I buy a lot of stuff from them. The $450 dollar deal was a black friday thing.


So far I've done nothing but research this project. I do think I have someone lined up to help me with parkerizing the barrel for cheap If I pay him to parkerize an Egyptian AK kit that I'm working on

[Mallard57]

I use a hitch pin with the holes in it to put in the front take down detent pin. Put the hitch pin in, line up holes, insert the spring and detent, push down with a punch, roll hitch pin a little, withdraw punch, now your ready to shove your take down pin from the other side. Easy and a handy tool for less than a dollar.
Jeff

[shotman]

better look out tex has it right. and for what use???? cant hit a car on full auto.