.32 acp rifle

[camerl2009]

ok so im looking at making a .32acp carbine its going to be a bolt gun
no i was thinking what i can use for a barrel blank
then i found some 7.62x54r and .303brit barrels what one is more consistent bore
the mosin nagant or the enfield

[NoZombies]

Dunno, I've got an old .303 barrel I was thinking of using for something similar, but I haven't slugged it yet, and I've got at least a years worth of projects before I get close to doing anything with it.

I think if I was gonna buy one, I'd look for the barrel with the best looking bore, then fit the projectiles to that.

[BerdanIII]

See if you can determine if any of the 7.62x54mmR barrels are Finnish; that would just about guarantee a decently-made tube. Check one of the milsurp websites to see if there are any stickies about barrel markings or post a question. I'll look in the M/N book I have and see if I can find anything out. .303 British barrels are a real crapshoot; the bore dimensions are all over the map. A Savage, Long Branch or Lithgow barrel might be best. A P17 barrel might be an option, but I bet you'd spend months looking for one. An Ishapore .308 (7.62mm NATO) barrel might work well, too.

NoZombies has a good slant on solving the problem.

Why not go with a .32 S&W Long? You can use bullets from the lowly roundball on up to 150 grains or more with the right twist.

Later: Try 7.62x54.com; they have a pretty extensive collection of barrel marking photos for the M/N. Much better than me trying to explain the markings; one picture worth approximately one MB.

[seppos]

Dont forget the Maxim and Lahti-Saloranta barrels that where made in Finland.
If available they might be cheaper and even factory new..

S

[armed_partisan]

I have always wanted a long barreled repeater in some tiny caliber like .32 ACP or .32 Long. Loaded right, it's like a silencer without the paperwork!

[Baron von Trollwhack]

I can tell you that 32 wadcutters at 32 S & W long speed will not stabilize in the 7.65 Argentine twist used in the 1909 rifles. BvT

[9.3X62AL]

That is surprising to read, BvT. Aren't the 7.65s in the 4 turns/meter twist rate range? (1-9.75")

Most wadcutter boolits take a tumble after 60-65 yards, anyway. Are you sure that tendency wasn't at play with the Argie(s)?

[armed_partisan]

You only need a 1:16, but if the lands are too wide for the bullet, then you'll get a lot of blowby and more skidding than spinning, and that will lead to unstable rounds.

[thx997303]

Do the barrels have any markings on them?

With the Nagants, if it was made around 44' than it's likely to have some roughness.

[swheeler]

That is surprising to read, BvT. Aren't the 7.65s in the 4 turns/meter twist rate range? (1-9.75")

Most wadcutter boolits take a tumble after 60-65 yards, anyway. Are you sure that tendency wasn't at play with the Argie(s)?

I think the 7.65 barrels were 1 in 11 twist

[Larry Gibson]

I can tell you that 32 wadcutters at 32 S & W long speed will not stabilize in the 7.65 Argentine twist used in the 1909 rifles. BvT

I've shot several thousand Speer and Hornady HBWCs out of my 7.65 Argies, M10 Ross .303, several 7.62x54Rs, my Mini MK X 7.62x39 and all of my CF .30s. Most of them have 9.5 - 10" twists with a couple having 12' twists. I used 2.7 - 3.2 gr Bullseye, depending on case capacity, and velocities ran from 800 - 900 fps. Accuracy was excellent out to 50 yards. Makes for a very good plinking/small game load. They seemed to do well out to 100 yards or so but I never put them on paper that far. If pushed any harder than that the skirts blow and the accuracy goes. No need to push them any faster anyways.

I switched to the Hornady 90 gr swaged SWC or mostly the lee TL 314-90-SWC and haven't used a HBWC since. The SWCs feed better and are more accurate. I do some amazing "plinking" on the 200 yard berm with my .30 and .31 CFs with the same loads.

Larry Gibson

[swheeler]

I suspect what Larry suggests is what was happening. The 7.65 mauser has a 1 turn in 280mm or 1:11.02", plenty twist for these shorties at any spoeed

[StrawHat]

What action are you going to use? I have long thought about building a bolt action in 30 Carbine but the 32 ACP might be an interesting one also.

[GUSTAVOAR]

Hello: 7,65 mm Argentine barrel will be OK for the proyect, they are 1 in 250 mm twist (1 in 9.8" aprox). take in count that 1891 barrels have a nominal .311" diameter and 1909 have a nominal .312" dia.

SALUDOS

[JIMinPHX]

For years, I've been thinking about taking a standard .308 barrel & chambering it to take a .32ACP. I think that would be a great little small game rifle that wouldn't be too loud. I'd love to have a little hunting gun that wouldn't aggravate my tinnitus too bad.

[NoZombies]

I look forward to seeing how other people's experiments go along these lines.

[Bret4207]

The 32 S+W Long would offer more loading possibilities. Getting it to work on a magazine would be the issue. The ACP would be easier in that respect but you have an even smaller rim to deal with. Kind of a trade off. In a bolt gun something like a Carcano would be a decent candidate, especially for a single shot. Working the bolt face/extractor down in a MN would be a chore I think.

[JIMinPHX]

I was going to choose the .32acp because with such a small powder cavity, a very small charge of a fast powder like Bullseye would give me moderate velocities from a medium weight boolit. It would be a very efficient (cheap) round to shoot.

I was leaning towards building a barrel for a NEF Handi rifle or a Contender, although, a bolt gun would be a good choice as well.

I had also thought of taking a gun in an existing caliber, like .30-30, & just making up some custom brass that is mostly solid, but has just a small powder cavity in the center. That might give the same internal ballistics as a smaller cartridge case, without modifying the gun itself.

These are all just thoughts. I don't have pressure testing equipment. That is one of the things that has kept me from developing a wildcat of my own.

[BerdanIII]

JiminPHX:

A .32-20 WCF (or .30-20, depending on bore dimensions) would be a much better choice if you're thinking about a Contender. You can load it up or down, light or heavy bullets. It will be pretty stingy on powder and still have a pretty high loading density. The only down side I can see is that the brass can be fragile and since it's a tapered (o.k., bottlenecked-ish) case, carbide dies aren't made for it.

The standard .30-30 WCF case will do fine with reduced loads without going to the extreme of producing custom, reduced-capacity cases.

[NoZombies]

I've always wanted to find one of those destroyer carbines and convert it to running .32 S&W long.

But then I realize I'd probably just enjoy shooting it as a 9mm largo that I wouldn't do the conversion.

I did build a buddy a .45 based on a sporterized .303 brit rifle. He loves that gun. I wish I'd made on for myself.

[camerl2009]

well i was wanting a nice silent rifle i cant have a suppressor here
so i want the .32 acp. and the mosin nagant barrels and the brit barrels are only
$15

[JIMinPHX]

But then I realize I'd probably just enjoy shooting it as a 9mm largo that I wouldn't do the conversion

The only problem with that is that Largo brass had turned into a back order item with star-line the last time that I checked & the surpluss ammo in that caliber isn't as easy to find as it used to be. Sarco did still have it, the last time that I checked, but they were about the only ones. Miwal was even out of it, & they used to be my go-to guys for that stuff. It is a nice caliber to play with though. It tends to be a very smooth feeder.

[JIMinPHX]

JiminPHX:

A .32-20 WCF (or .30-20, depending on bore dimensions) would be a much better choice if you're thinking about a Contender.

I hadn't really thought about that cartridge. I'll have to do a little digging & see what info I can find on it. Thanks for the tip.

[JIMinPHX]

well i was wanting a nice silent rifle i cant have a suppressor here
so i want the .32 acp. and the mosin nagant barrels and the brit barrels are only
$15

Those sounds like very good reasons to do exactly what you want to do. If I were in your shoes, I'd stick with your game plan exactly as you have it figured.

[richbug]

What about a .323-20? It looks like it would be nearly straight walled. Maybe a low pressure .323-30??? use 30-30 brass... Just thinking out loud.

I have some Mauser barrels that are pretty decent, and a Damascus shotgun of which I am tiring of loading BP shells(the mystique wore off after one hunting season)...

I always wanted a double rifle.

[NoZombies]

I wasn't aware of the brass supply problem with the 9mm largo... something to think about if I ever find one I can justify buying (read "cheap as dirt")

I'm excited, my next project is here... gonna see what it'll do tomorrow, I hope... gotta load up some ammo now.

[StrawHat]

I am pretty sure Ed Harris reworked a Remington 788 to handle the 32 Long cartridge so that is possible. Not sure if he retained the magazine feed or if it was a single shot.

The only issue I see with a bolt rifle is size, most of the bolt guns are built around a high pressure cartridge and massive for what would be needed for a 32 Long or ACP. Perhaps something built for the Hornet would work. I like the idea of a single shot along the lines of a Ballard or mini Rolling Block but neither are in my price range.

[Baron von Trollwhack]

Sorry I missed coming back, but I did rebarrel a R 581 action with a "09" argie barrel cut down to 17" and rechambered to 32 S&W long. Using published data and a little more I could not get the Hornady bulk wadcutters ot the Lee SWC to stabilize or group at 50 yards. The barrel was new and absolutely the best.

Do a search. In years past many of the 581 series were rebarreled and centerfire converted to hornet, 25-20, and similar. If I did it again I would go for 25-20.

It might be easier to rebore/resleeve/rework an old Iver Johnson or similar revolver to a 32 S&W bicycle rifle. and have a six shooter. The small Uberti SA would be terrific little rifle. Bvt

[NoZombies]

This is a link to the Article by Ed harris about his .32 ACP build.

.32 acp build by Ed Harris (http://www.castbulletassoc.org/forum/view_topic.php?id=5418&forum_id=48)

[45 2.1]

Keep in mind all the chamber inserts for the 32 ACP in most all the 30 caliber rifles. Mine shoots quite well in various 30-06s. The Lee 32 cal wadcutter from a 6 banger shoots equally as well when loaded in the 7.7 Jap, you just need to push them a little.

[NoZombies]

I swear everyone who has one of those molds just keeps rubbing it in :( One day I'll find one- preferably the 6 cavity variety

You make a really good point though, and a chamber adapter will be a lot cheaper than building a gun.

[swheeler]

Keep in mind all the chamber inserts for the 32 ACP in most all the 30 caliber rifles. Mine shoots quite well in various 30-06s. The Lee 32 cal wadcutter from a 6 banger shoots equally as well when loaded in the 7.7 Jap, you just need to push them a little.

I like that idea and would use one of the 308's or 06 for it.

[Multigunner]

There was once a German manufactured .32 ACP chambered small game rifle, a semiauto that fired from an open bolt. It didn't catch on.

I've read that US Army marksmen in Germany had found that the semi auto .32 S&W wadcutter chambered target pistol they were using for match shooting was not very accurate with the available ammunition, so they made replacement barrels from cut off M14 barrels. The tighter bore and 1:12 inch twist reduced group size greatly.

[rattletrap1970]

I have always wanted a rifle just like you are describing. What about a microgrooved (like marlin did on their rifles) 1:12? What would you use for an action?

[deltaenterprizes]

I think Jager made an AR-15 clone in 32 acp, they were imported by EMF.

Found It! It was Armi Jager AP-74 and also a Kassnar AP-15.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armi_Jager

[R.M.]

There was once a German manufactured .32 ACP chambered small game rifle, a semiauto that fired from an open bolt. It didn't catch on.

I've read that US Army marksmen in Germany had found that the semi auto .32 S&W wadcutter chambered target pistol they were using for match shooting was not very accurate with the available ammunition, so they made replacement barrels from cut off M14 barrels. The tighter bore and 1:12 inch twist reduced group size greatly.

Yes, I re-barreled my Walther GSP with a .308" 1:10 twist. It was something like 1:24 and .316" Made a world of difference.

[John Taylor]

I had to go back and check on Ed's 32ACP, didn't remember doing one in that caliber for him. When I saw it was a bolt gun I knew it was not one that I had worked on. Did more than a few shotgun conversions for him. I think he has five barrels for his Beretta folding 410, ranging from 32S&W to 45ACP.
Will be working on a 581 to 218 Bee soon. Just for info, the Winchester model 70 was made in 22 Hornet. The bolt face was made small enough for the rim and an added "pusher" was installed on the bottom of the bolt to pick up cartridges out of the special magazine. I don't think it could be made to work with something as short as the 32ACP. I have one in the shop now that is being made into a 218 Bee.

[nanuk]

well i was wanting a nice silent rifle i cant have a suppressor here
so i want the .32 acp. and the mosin nagant barrels and the brit barrels are only
$15


Where would you find that kind of deal?

[Shooter6br]

I would go for the 32 S&W long or 32 mag. Friend has made one up. The problem is the 32 ACP is rimless and exactor may be a problem. Good luck! I would not mind having one also Rick

[rattletrap1970]

I have an SACM M1935A French Pistol. It is chambered in 7.65 French long. I am rechambering it for my own cartridge 7.65x20 RAD. Which is a .30 carbine cut to .800 long (probably could be a bit longer) reamed on the ID to .3110 and loaded with a 77gr cast lead bullet. Kinda the equivalent of a .32 S&W long, but rimless. I want to use that in a rifle too.

[NoZombies]

I have an SACM M1935A French Pistol. It is chambered in 7.65 French long. I am rechambering it for my own cartridge 7.65x20 RAD. Which is a .30 carbine cut to .800 long (probably could be a bit longer) reamed on the ID to .3110 and loaded with a 77gr cast lead bullet. Kinda the equivalent of a .32 S&W long, but rimless. I want to use that in a rifle too.

Sounds like a neat project! I look forward to seeing how it all turns out, especially the rifle part of the project.

Which mold are you planning to use for that 77 gr? the lyman 32 ACP mold probably?

[camerl2009]

I think Jager made an AR-15 clone in 32 acp, they were imported by EMF.

Found It! It was Armi Jager AP-74 and also a Kassnar AP-15.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armi_Jager

lol any ak or variant is prohibited in canada

[camerl2009]

Where would you find that kind of deal?

here in canada lee enfields where the canadian rifles from WW1 to korea
so surplus rifles and parts are easy to get

[camerl2009]

ok so i did some thing i got a chamber adapter made with a rifled liner in it
for .32 acp its for the lee enfield .303 + i had the gun with the smooth barrel
rebarreld so im good to go have not shot it yet but when i gat some brass
and bullets i will

[rattletrap1970]

I just ordered the RCBS 75gr double cavity molds from Midway. Can't shoot that different from the 77gr bullets I got from Missouri Bullets. I have 100 rounds of brass all prepped and a rental .30 carbine reamer with a .300" pilot from 4D Reamers. Once the reamer gets here and I chase out the chamber we'll be in business. I will try to document the process if I remember.

[nanuk]

camerl2009, I too am in Canada, and I have never seen MN or LE barrels for that little.

and surplus rifles around here an never under $100.

can you give me a business name? I would be interested in some.

thanks

[nanuk]

subscribe

[Dannix]

I already have a BRP's 32ACP mold pending for my 32ACP BUG. This thread really makes me want to get a carbine for it. Like a smaller, light weight, longer barreled lever gun, or better yet, a reduced size ar15, reduced mags an all; yeah that sounds inexpensive.

Sometimes gun projects make no logical sense. :bigsmyl2:

[NoZombies]

http://nozombies.com/cast/581.jpg

Mine's technically a 32 long, but it likes the .32 ACP pretty well too.

[John Taylor]

Just picked up a Rem. 581 to make a 32 something. Was given a 30-06 Winchester barrel with 4 groove rifling that may get used. I know it's a bit tight but the last 32 S&W I built for myself used a 30 cal barrel and it shot great.

[klcarroll]

+1 on all the remarks about wanting a nice, quiet little "Bunny Gun"!!

I have an old Argie barrel I was going to use for a similar project: .....But being basically lazy, I was going to make it into an 18" insert for a single shot shotgun. (...Shotgun yet to be aquired.)

Kent

[trooperdan]

NoZombies, is that rifle based on a 580-series rifle? It looks darned neat! Did you do the work yourself?

[NoZombies]

TrooperDan,

Yup, it's built on a 581 action. I did only a little of the work.

Here's the thread about it:
My .32 rifle (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=99523)